Uriel Ventris: The Swords of Calth

[kamedake88]

I picked up the audiobook tonight and I am about half way through it and felt compelled to start a thread on it for tomorrow's BL celebration release. So far it is terrible. I will try and do a full write up once I am done with it... send help.

[Kelborn]

*reads the post*

 

...picked up the audiobook... (Alright.) ....half way through and felt compelled... (Ok, doesn't sound bad)....so far it is terrible... (O_O)

 

Eager to read your thoughts in a review, brother. ;)

 

Sad to hear that, tbh. I mean, Ventirs wasn't topnotch BL quality but it was a ride back then.

[DarkChaplain]

Just makes me want to read it more.

[Lord Nord in Gravis Armour]

I'm a third of the way in, which in and of itself is a little annoying, as the book is only thirteen chapters and they're not very long.

 

That said, my impressions so far are just that it's an *okay* ground-level 40K novel. I haven't read anything yet that I'd call "terrible," but I also don't know that I'll be re-reading it after this first runthrough.

[Morovir]

I think it's slightly disingenuous to even call it a novel, given that it's shorter than Fury of Magnus.

[Lord Nord in Gravis Armour]

I think it's slightly disingenuous to even call it a novel, given that it's shorter than Fury of Magnus.

 

And it's split into three "books," each of which is about short-story length.

[Brother Lunkhead]

=][=

 

I'm locking this down until two or more fraters have actually read the book. Please PM me when you are ready.

Usually, when a thread starts off this negative from an incomplete reading, it only gets worse.

Please, please...... prove me wrong.

 

=][=

[Brother Lunkhead]

=][= UPDATE =][=

 

I've received one PM from a frater who has finished reading Swords of Calth. Just waiting for one more to unlock the thread.

[Brother Lunkhead]

=][=

 

Okay.... It's game on fraters.

 

Remember to keep it friendly and keep it focused.

 

=][=

[Taliesin]

Would love to read some opinions on this book.

[DarkChaplain]

Looks like it harkens back all the way to Pavonis and the Nightbringer, back in... well, Nightbringer. That's a cool way to restart the series, at the very least.

[KJB]

Finished it last night, it was OK, not great, but not terrible either, it expands on the Nightbringer novel (i.e. C'tan shards etc)

 

However at the end of the day it's a standard Uriel "the invincible" Ventris novel, 

 

Example: 

It ends with a weird IT 2 moment, Uriel kills the Nightbringer by belittling it and telling it that it's merely a Shard of it's former self and that it is weak and pathetic - It then screams and then dies...

 

Teleporting a Reaver titan 60,000 feet below the planet after having it walk through the light of the sun was also a tad OTT as well

Edited March 4, 2021 by KJB

[kamedake88]

Oh boy, where do I begin. With a conceit I suppose. I have met Graham on several occasions and even have a few of his works signed by him too. He is an upstanding chap and Uriel’s stories were some of my favorites back in the day. Pulpy and fun if a little plodding.

I could tell 20 pages in Graham did not want to write this story. It uses every trick in the book to stretch word count such as double metaphor and double preposition in a sentence. I am also not angry at him doing this one bit. The 40k that Mr. Mcneill helped build is long gone and I doubt he has any idea how to make characters who had their stories finished a decade ago fit in to this new pale reflection of oddly more narratively consistent times.

 

Let us begin with Mr. Green-shoulder-pads himself, Uriel Ventris or whatever is wearing his skin in this new novel. First off, he isn’t even wearing the same armor his newly released model is wearing, instead he is wearing gravis plate like his colleague Felix from Guy Haley’s stories. Minor but still a gripe. Glaringly, Uriel has caught the Wardmarine bug though and what little tension there is in the work is easily burned away in the heat of Uriel’s new Belesarian Furnace. (I gaged a little writing that)

Learchus and Pausanias show themselves too and both are as we recall them. Older more grizzled, wondering why they’re appearing in a new story and perplexed why Uriel is a primaris even though event’s taking place in this novels aftermath still have Uriel as an oldmarine. Yes I know there is a retcon coming it still makes no f’ing sense.

Is there anything to spoil? Not really, Telion is alive and hasn’t been off’d to the dustbin of forgotten 40k characters.

 

Some cool stuff did happen. 

the whole point of the story is the Nightbringer is big bad and super uriel makes a million year old fragment of a star god feel fear.) (Learchus gets aged by a necron time tech or something in more or less the same way Barabus Dantioch did and becomes the new 4^th company ancient. Now he’s double old. Kill me)

 

I got this on audio and listened it twice. The narration was subpar, making an already over-starched rendition of a strait-laced character near unbearable.

Skub out of 10, save your money, buy the model, replace the head and turn it into a new Sicarius or whatever.

Edited March 4, 2021 by kamedake88

[KJB]

Let’s not forget the part where he (no spoiler tags needed) shouts “I am Primaris!” like He-Man Edited March 4, 2021 by KJB

[RedFurioso]

Question to fraters...

What's the name of short story attached to the limited edition?

Asking for my thread http://www.bolterandchainsword.com/topic/366696-complete-list-of-limited-editions-short-stories-need-help/

[Brother Lunkhead]

Question to fraters...

What's the name of short story attached to the limited edition?

Asking for my thread http://www.bolterandchainsword.com/topic/366696-complete-list-of-limited-editions-short-stories-need-help/

Slightly off topic, but the story is The Death of Uriel Ventris. Here's a link to a Quick Review of it from TRACK OF WORDS.

[Lord Nord in Gravis Armour]

I finished it the same day I started, as threatened. Being a fan of Graham McNeill's previous work, I was disappointed to discover the book was about half the length of the 40K novels I'm used to.

 

Also - weird thought maybe, but I couldn't shake the feeling reading this that the story was a repurposed movie script. I believe this entire tale would fit into a 100-minute film without truncating a word of dialog or excising any of the action scenes. Takes quite a bit longer to read of course due to the scene descriptions (which I personally think McNeill does very well; it was one reason I finished it in one day, even with hours-long breaks between each of the three "books").

 

Overall, while I'd upgrade it from my original impression of "okay," I'd have to stop short of a recommend. Unless you're a fan of the character or Smurfs in general.

[Brother Lunkhead]

Now that I've read the book and listened to the audio, I'm ready to do battle

 

This is one of those books that I liked better after a second read. My first assessment after one readthrough was 3 of 10 points, Uriel Ventris and Ultramarines fans only (that's me ). However, after listening to the audio and a second read, I've reassessed.

 

Still not my favorite UV book by a long shot, but ultimately pretty good. The short length, I think suits the the subject and narrative. However, it's primarily a character(s) driven tale, and I can't help but feel it would have been more satisfying as a slightly longer (but not much longer) if it had a meatier and better structured plot. It reads more like a Space Marines Battles book than a proper Uriel Ventris novel.  A better example of what I consider a "proper" UV novel that is battle centered would be Courage and Honor. That one had a much better plot structure.

 

McNeill's battles are messy things and quite often require a second look to catch specifics, and I like that. Bear with me here. Graham doesn't focus down and give you the squad/ individual level view that Dan Abnett is so famous for and so good at ( and I really like that too), but he captures the chaos of battle that overwhelms the senses very well. In McNeill's battle scenes one gets overwhelmed by the sheer amount of information thrown at you in a moment of battle. In a moment, characters are wounded or killed, a vital war machine is crippled or destroyed, the enemy has the momentum, the enemy has lost momentum, there's too much noise, too much smoke, too much light, too much darkness, etc. Many may find this disconcerting, but I like it. That's how battle is.

 

As far as how characters are treated, it's a mixed bag. McNeill, unfortunately doesn't have the gift (or at least doesn't exhibit it here) that Abnett has of giving the reader a character, causing the reader to connect with and like said character, then in the next moment, punching the reader in the gut by killing said character. McNeill for sure kills off some folks that are important to Uriel and some of the others, and they feel the loss. However, none of these characters were ever developed enough for the reader to connect, and thus it's just a body count. McNeill does show several characters having matured over time and at least one weakening over time and  solidifying his position at the top of my list of Space Marines I just don't like (and that's not necessarily a bad thing).

 

At the top of my list here of Space Marines I just don't like is..... Torias Telion.

Torias Telion's reputation as a master sniper and stealth warrior is well deserved and in the ranks of the Ultramarines, without peer. That's illustrated well in this novel. However, as a peerless trainer of recruits, not so much. He's more like a peerless killer of recruits. I started seeing some of Torias' less healthy traits in McNeill's audio drama, Eye of Vengeance, and my view is solidified here in Uriel Ventris: The Swords of Calth. Telion has become one of those unfortunate talented folks who has begun to believe his own press. He is arrogant to the point of disrespect for his superiors and disregard of orders which ultimately leads to the deaths of at least two of his neophytes who are so impressed by him that they act in a like manner, and as a result are unnecessarily killed. This is not the first time this has happened either, so I'm seeing a pattern. Although sad at this, Torias doesn't seem to be seeing the pattern himself. He needs to be busted and busted quick. If Graham is doing this on purpose, good job That should lead to some very interesting future developments in the Ultramarine saga. If Graham isn't doing this intentionally, still..... good job. I like seeing some of these characters as less than perfect as their reputation would suggest.

 

There's some good off screen character development with Pausanias and Learchus.

Learchus started off in the UV series as a stuck up, arrogant bully and has slowly matured into a strong leader and one of Captain Ventris' most loyal and solid allies. I've really warmed to this character..... Good job Graham. Pausanius is shown in a more mature light here as well. He is now not only Uriel's closest friend, but his conscience as Ventris comes to grips with his new Primaris body and all of the physical and psychological changes that go with it. Not much substantial character development here for Uriel, but he has definitely matured over the course of the entire series, and here we do get a view of some of the psychological changes/challenges that a Space Marine has to deal with, and that at least is interesting.

 

Lastly, the Nightbringer.....

Good to see my favorite evil C'tan shard again..... but wait a minute, it's a different shard. That's okay, a Nightbringer shard is a Nightbringer shard..... still an evil, bad thing, and an existential threat. And as an existential thread, at first glance it seemed like Uriel's defeat of the Nightbringer awfully quick with some convenient Captain Kirk-fu. This was one of those parts I had to reread and think about. On further consideration this was not as lame as I first thought. Keep in mind that the shard thought he WAS the Nightbringer, the whole enchilada as it were, and not just a tiny piece. The ritual he was trying to enact was assuming that he was the whole being. Plus, the shard was more than a little insane.... that never helps. Everybody has seen a talented person rise and rise until they reach the outer limits of their talent. Momentum carries them a short way further, then they crash and burn. It's kind of like that. Uriel is able reach the shard for a moment using his Kirk-fu and the piece of Nightbringer realizes he's flapping his arms in mid air like he can really fly..... oops. Crash and burn. So, I think that scene needed a little more wordage to make it more clear and convincing, but ultimately it still worked okay. Not great..... but okay.

 

So, in the end, I up my "LIKE" rating from 3 out of 10 to 6 out of 10. Not a must read or good for all. It could have earned a couple of more points of it had a more solid plot. Still, for Uriel Ventris/Ultramarines fans and lore fans in general, its a good read and worth your time.

Edited March 8, 2021 by Brother Lunkhead

[MegaVolt87]

I'm re-reading the old ones, is this re-boot campy or cringe? The old Ventris arcs were fun/ campy to me. Mabye we are expecting too much from McNeil here, he has been far surpassed as an author in BL these days.

[Sothalor]

That's probably a larger discussion than the scope of this particular topic, but I'll say I think McNeil is a product of a previous era of BL/GW.

[Knockagh]

That's probably a larger discussion than the scope of this particular topic, but I'll say I think McNeil is a product of a previous era of BL/GW.

I would agree but his two novellas from the siege series were great. Ventris certainly feels like a previous era, one I wasn’t sorry to see go but then this was supposed to be a touch of nostalgia. The last chancers revisit last year felt similar. Didn’t enjoy it, the ideas alway better than the book

[cheywood]

Well, I was wasn’t expecting much and this still underwhelmed. I’d put it down there with my least favorite 40k novels. I don’t want to spend a lot of time attacking someone’s hard work but this felt like the most perfunctory, slapdash novel I’ve seen from BL in years. There’s a bunch of bland action, incredibly on the nose dialogue that feels suited to a middle grade novel, some entirely unaffecting emotional moments and then the book ends. I wouldn’t recommend it to anyone and I’m not sure who it’s for. There’s very little in the way of substantive connection between the previous books for old fans, but enough references that new readers would feel a little lost. There’s absolutely no substance or depth to the characters or plot, to the point that it feels targeted at a younger audience, but McNeill also includes enough gore that I can’t see it being a good fit. Anyways that’s enough bemoaning, on to better books. Edited March 14, 2021 by cheywood

[b1soul]

McNeill's Uriel Ventris and King's Ragnar Blackmane were the 40K gateway drugs for those in their teens in the late 90s/early 00s

 

Gore was something I could handle when I was, say, 14...so I suspect the new Ventris work reads like Young Adult fiction for high schoolers, which is kinda the quality-level the Ventris series has always been at IMO

[cheywood]

McNeill's Uriel Ventris and King's Ragnar Blackmane were the 40K gateway drugs for those in their teens in the late 90s/early 00s

 

Gore was something I could handle when I was, say, 14...so I suspect the new Ventris work reads like Young Adult fiction for high schoolers, which is kinda the quality-level the Ventris series has always been at IMO

I agree with you re gore in young adult books, but I’d argue the dialogue in this is below typical young adult level (at least from what I remember of young adult books). There’s no symbolism or deeper meaning and no complicated concepts. It’s very much just characters stating their feelings bluntly and describing what’s happening. Even for Graham it feels simplified. Middle grade fiction is targeted at 8-12 year olds typically and that’s what the dialogue reminds me of, but the gore is a bit much for some of that age group.

 

Edit: on second thought you’re probably right and I’m just misremembering the depth of stories I read well over a decade ago.

Edited March 15, 2021 by cheywood

[SkimaskMohawk]

His ultramarine books are pretty on the nose and lacking depth unfortunately. I reread them a couple of years ago and it basically ruined my fond memories of those books.

 

His iron warriors are a lot better, but it's still frustrating to flip back to ultramarine povs in some them.