Unit of the week: Helbrutes

[Plague _Lord]

Welcome to the Unit of the Week Series! 

 

Each week a different unit will be highlighted for discussion until we have amalgamated a full list of our available options and their relevant tactics as 9th edition evolves. This will include not only matched play, but free play considerations as well as Crusade, as these methods of play are just as relevant and exciting.

 

Please keep in mind this isn't to lament the status of featured units or compare them to others but to try and find their potential for all types of gameplay.

 

(Yes I did steal the intro from Daimyo-Phaeron Lenoch but it is a fine intro indeeed)

 

This week we will take a look at:

 

Helbrutes

 

I think it's a good Idea to go through core units first as they have synergies that you have to have in mind when list building. I think most of us have at least 1 helbrute lying around somewhere and while not the strongest unit, they must have some uses! Besides... how can you not love dreads?

 

Some food for thought:

- how many units would you take?

- is it worth using cp on them?

- what role do they function?

- what are the overall strengths and weaknesses?

- what synergies do they have in the different plague companies?

- what weapon loadouts are best?

 

Feel free to discuss my blighted lords and ladies.

 

Death Guard Unit of the Week Index

Edited April 9, 2021 by Xenith

[Syrakul]

The move and fire at no -1 and shoot out of cc are fantastic for helbrutes, and the new -1 damage gives it sometimes equal staying power to its larger forged cousins (though id prefer the invuln)

The power scourge is great at killing marines, and gives the 3+ bonus to attacks to get nearly a full squad in. Couple it with a twin heavy bolter for more of the same.

 

I prefer it with a stronger weapon like lascannon and fist. March forward shooting and charging armor and heavy infantry and hope your enemy tries plinging a wound off you for the juicy reroll 1's to wound. (Or on overwatch, taunt them to try it) 9th made it a game of 'dont make it angry even once' for an great always-on effect.

It is core for lord rerolls to hit as well so very reliable shooting and melee.

 

Don't think its worth adding another missile launcher because its potential in cc feels wasted, where it has higher str and reliable 3 dmg attacks traded for one ml shot a turn.

 

As they don't degrade they feel more potent then maulerfiends who can hit like a wet sack after being pummeled on their way across the field. (DG dont get one but when helbrutes come to CSM or for allied detatchments)

 

I previously pointed out id overall prefer a defiler for higher cost, faster far more wounds and invuln, with a battlecannon and stronger claws. However a defiler degrades, is a larger target, more expensive and doesn't have those reliable hitting bonuses, so there are a few tradeoffs.

Edited March 2, 2021 by Syrakul

[KingYertle]

I think the Helbrute is one of our most interesting options.   Some Highlights:

 

Wide assortment of ranged weapons which you can tailor to boost areas where we are otherwise lacking.

 

Bubonic Astartes keyword means it scores VP for Despoiled Ground and is our only vehicle that is both Bubonic Astartes and gets -1 damage.

 

T7 hide will draw higher Str weapons away from valuable targets such as Terminators and Plague Marines, while also providing good foil against opponents who spam Str5 & Str6 weapons.

 

Frenzy rule (re-roll 1s to wound once the unit has suffered any damage) helps offset the lack of plague weapons. 

 

Very good Strat Synergies, such as:

 

Haze of Corruption - Expensive at 2cp but potentially devastating vs 1W hordes with D3 Fists and D2 Scourges.  A HB with a Scourge is 15 Attacks that wounds T3 & T4 on 2s thanks to Nurgles Gift.  That should reliably nuke 1W tarpits.

 

Virulent Rounds - Turn Dual Heavy Bolters into Plague Weapons and thus benefit from any PW synergies, such as Arch Contaminator, Overwhelming Generosity and the Lord a Virulence aura.

 

And obviously Fire Fever for +1 to hit & wound.  Makes the Multimelta very reliable, especially when in aura range of a Lord and once Frenzy is active.

 

Helbrutes benefit from the Tallyman relic (exploding sixes) and the +1 to Hit. 

 

Only real downside is M6.  But if you wasted 60 points on a Noxious Blightbringer he does give Helbrutes +1 Movement.

 

From a model standpoint the Demon Engines should be very important to our army construction, but I think the cheaper and more well rounded Helbrute could be a surprise VIP unit in many builds.  Especially considering they score Despoiled Ground, which the Deamon Engines shockingly cannot. 1 Long Range equipped Helbrute in the backfield while another CC and Melta equiped unit charges up into the mid field is sure to leave your opponent in a tough spot with their target priority.  Especially if they are already concerned with focusing their big guns on Morty.

[Karhedron]

How do people feel the Hellbrute compares against the MBH? On the face of it, they have quite similar stats. The MBH has the advantage that it packs 2 heavy weapons and is still somewhat capable in melee (although obviously not as good as a Hellbrute with a dedicated melee weapon).

[KingYertle]

At the moment I think the MBH suffers from a high point cost and lack of weapon options.  Side by Side the Helbrute is 20 points cheaper and is Core, but is slower and lacks the 5++ deamon save.  However you are not taking a Hellbrute to arm it with a midrange multimelta and a long range missile launcher.  You'll either be giving it dual long range weapons and keeping it back to help hold your DZ or 1 mid range and 1 CC weapon and marching it up to capture midfield objectives.  The Helbrute's array of options allow you to customize the unit for what your army needs.  I think the MBH is in a odd spot due to the EZ Build model.  For its points its not very effective in melee nor is the ML very reliable as anti-tank.  If you need speed, there are better options in the Codex.  Personally I think the Helbrute is the clear winner over the MBH.  

[KingYertle]

Thinking on this topic today, it dawned on me just how effective a Dual Heavy Bolter and Power Scourge Helbrute could be.

 

In particular the Power Scourge is going to be wounding T7 vehicles on 3s thanks to Contagions of Nurgle.  15 attacks vs a T7 (dropped to T6) target with a 3+ save will average 8-10 wounds (15 attacks, 10 hits, 6-7 wounds, 4-5 unsaved, 2 damage).  Give it the Tallyman +1 to hit for the Battle Round and its reliably killing 10W T7 Vehicles in melee.  

 

Meanwhile the dual Heavy Bolter cranks out 6 shots, hitting on 3s, with multiple options to hit on 2s and reroll 1s.  

 

Vs Marines, unbuffed the HB will average 1.8 kills while the Scourge kills another 4.5.  Buff that up with your pick of the Tallyman's +1, Frenzy, Core HQ Rerolls, Ferric Blight (+1 AP), Stratagems etc and suddenly you have a very reliable and more importantly cheap Marine killer for which your opponent will need to account meaning less fire power is aimed at your high value targets (Morty, Terminators, etc).    

[McElMcNinja]

These are some very valid points, cuz I admit I had all but written Helbrutes off. Seeing all this info has made me reconsider them and look at how they might fit in my army.

[Plague _Lord]

To be fair I also had written the Helbrute off but some of these points are great - for example I had totally forgotten that they benefit from the tallyman's buffs and could be the target for virulent rounds. I think we have to compare the brute to 2 other units - the MBH and Drones.

 

Helbrute:

Pros:

- cheapish (depending on loadout)

- source of accurate AT ( nice strat, when wounded get's rerolls to wound, can get bufed by tallyman, doesn't degrade)

- Core so benefits from rerolls and most auras

- bubonic astartes keyword

- flexible builds (not bad in both combat and shooting)

- Distraction carnifex

 

Cons:

- Takes up crowded elite spot

- Not that tough

- No Inv save, no access to fnp

- only plasma cannon in the codex is really bad

 

Comparing it with the MBH:

- deals more damage in combat but also takes more

- has less AT capabilities but more flexible if the enemy doesn't have tanks

- is much slower

- cheaper

- worse defensive stats

 

Comparing a heavy bolter loadout to a blight launcher drone:

- has worse gun (even with strats) but is more accurate

- cheaper

- is more flexible due to combat abilites

- worse defensive stats

 

All in all I think this unit might be a sleeper MVP. Will have to test though.

 

Thinking on this topic today, it dawned on me just how effective a Dual Heavy Bolter and Power Scourge Helbrute could be.

 

In particular the Power Scourge is going to be wounding T7 vehicles on 3s thanks to Contagions of Nurgle.  15 attacks vs a T7 (dropped to T6) target with a 3+ save will average 8-10 wounds (15 attacks, 10 hits, 6-7 wounds, 4-5 unsaved, 2 damage).  Give it the Tallyman +1 to hit for the Battle Round and its reliably killing 10W T7 Vehicles in melee.  

 

Meanwhile the dual Heavy Bolter cranks out 6 shots, hitting on 3s, with multiple options to hit on 2s and reroll 1s.  

 

Vs Marines, unbuffed the HB will average 1.8 kills while the Scourge kills another 4.5.  Buff that up with your pick of the Tallyman's +1, Frenzy, Core HQ Rerolls, Ferric Blight (+1 AP), Stratagems etc and suddenly you have a very reliable and more importantly cheap Marine killer for which your opponent will need to account meaning less fire power is aimed at your high value targets (Morty, Terminators, etc).    

 

I think you have misread what the scourge does. It gives +3 attacks when the bearer fights and not +3 attack for every attack made by this weapon. So a helbrute with scourge and ranged weapon is going to have 8 attacks  in close combat. Still not bad.

[KingYertle]

 

I think you have misread what the scourge does. It gives +3 attacks when the bearer fights and not +3 attack for every attack made by this weapon. So a helbrute with scourge and ranged weapon is going to have 8 attacks  in close combat. Still not bad.

 

Nice catch Plague Lord, I new it was too good to be true.  

 

Scary that the game has grown so lethal that a T7 unit with 8 wounds and -1 damage is "Not that tough".  But I agree, the lack of an invul save and no means to get one (that I can think of) is a definitive CON. In early 9th I had very good success running them next to a Blightbringing with the old Deamon's Toll relic which granted the 5++ aura.  Granted I only got in a handful of games before things shut down but they were enough of a distraction to ensure my rhino delivered its plague marines intact.  I mourn the loss of the Deamon's Toll 5++ aura.

 

I wonder if holding one back in strategic reserve could be viable.  For similar cost to a 5 man unit of PM you could come in the enemy DZ turn 3 and either put pressure on their home objective or hide out to score Despoiled Ground.  

[Tokugawa]

I have a painted hellbrute, and I will use it as contemptor in every game which opponent player agrees. Gap of the raw power on datasheets is just too big.

[Special Officer Doofy]

I still prefer haulers. No opponent of mine worth a damn is going to let a 6" move helbrute make it into melee with anything worthwhile. And the ranged loadout on the hauler for a few points more I like better, not to mention they are more mobile and have an invuln save.

 

I don't play marine players as often as others do, so stacking 2 damage weapons like the scourge and heavy bolter are not as important to me. I'll probably use mine again eventually, but having haulers go to 3+ to hit and the buff to the multi-melta makes me like the helbrute less and less.

[Plaguecaster]

I always take one walker for every infantry squad I usually take as they can be quite good for providing plague marines or death shroud with some much needed firepowe, add the fact only I take plaguecasters and they can be the prime target of Miasma since it affects all death guard.

 

Scourges are amazing, especially with the contagions for -1T just wish gw would get more in stock as I'd live to pick up a couple more for my army. Just wish they had access to plague weapons, twin entrophy cannons, heavy blight launchers or dual spitters would be awesome on helbrutes. I'd love to convert one up at least

Edited March 3, 2021 by Plaguecaster

[Plague _Lord]

I still prefer haulers. No opponent of mine worth a damn is going to let a 6" move helbrute make it into melee with anything worthwhile. And the ranged loadout on the hauler for a few points more I like better, not to mention they are more mobile and have an invuln save.

 

I don't play marine players as often as others do, so stacking 2 damage weapons like the scourge and heavy bolter are not as important to me. I'll probably use mine again eventually, but having haulers go to 3+ to hit and the buff to the multi-melta makes me like the helbrute less and less.

 

The funny thing is that a helbrute with the same loadout is both cheaper and shoots better but on the other hand is less durable, slower (so get's  in melta range later) and needs charachter support, while the MBH can do stuff solo.

 

Both seem like a solid choice, which you take depending mostly on theme and army composition.

[KingYertle]

So Could Helbrute spam work?

 

Supreme Command Detachment

Mortarion

 

Battalion Detachment, Inexorable

HQ:

Plaguecaster, Ferric Blight -1cp

Chaos Lord, Balesword, plasmapistol, Relic Plaguebringer

Troops:

3 Units 5xPlague Marines, Boltersx4, Flail of Corruptionx1

3 Units 10xPoxwalkers

Elites:

Foetid Virions:

  Tallyman, Relic Tollkeeper -1cp

  Blightbringer, Relic Fulgaris Helm -1cp

2 Units Helbrute, Fist & Multi-melta

2 Units Helbrute, Scourge & Heavy Bolter

Fast Attack:

Bloat-drone, Fleshmower

Chaos Spawn x3, Grandfatherly Influence -1cp

 

Total Points 1999

 

Tactics are pretty simple.  Turn 1, Fleshmower and the Spawn rush up the board to apply pressure, while Mortarion the 4 Helbrutes & the Virion move up into firing positions and aim to secure the midfield in Turn 2.  The Poxwalkers can spread out to secure Board Control, while the Plague Marines hang back taking advantage of cover or performing actions.  1 unit likely goes into reserve to come in on any flank that needs Obsec.

 

Goal is to provide high toughness target saturation with -1 damage.  Your opponent will need to deal with the fast moving Mower and Mortarion freeing the Helbrutes to secure the mid table on turn 2.  If the Helbrutes need more melee support you could drop the Spawn and add a Blightspawn and his fight last aura.  But I think the Spawn provide additional turn 1 pressure, and will draw attention away from your obsec units.

[Special Officer Doofy]

 

 

I still prefer haulers. No opponent of mine worth a damn is going to let a 6" move helbrute make it into melee with anything worthwhile. And the ranged loadout on the hauler for a few points more I like better, not to mention they are more mobile and have an invuln save.

 

I don't play marine players as often as others do, so stacking 2 damage weapons like the scourge and heavy bolter are not as important to me. I'll probably use mine again eventually, but having haulers go to 3+ to hit and the buff to the multi-melta makes me like the helbrute less and less.

The funny thing is that a helbrute with the same loadout is both cheaper and shoots better but on the other hand is less durable, slower (so get's in melta range later) and needs charachter support, while the MBH can do stuff solo.

 

Both seem like a solid choice, which you take depending mostly on theme and army composition.

I don't even think the helbrute shoots better with the same loadout. They have core, and they have bubonic astartes, so they can reroll if near a lord and can shoot while in melee no penalty. But that requires baby sitting and again, allowing a 6" move turd to get into melee. The hauler also has the bile spurt, a blast plague weapon they can shoot in melee themselves, and the hauler gets -1 to being hit in melee. I still would prefer the haulers shooting, that's more guns with the possibility of more damage.

 

Only thing I can think of I like better on the brute is the 135pts loadout with twin Las and missle so it can shoot 48", just have it deep in your deployment. But at that point I rather pay 40pts more and take a PBC. And the melee loadout on the helbrute is outshined by the fleshmower bloat Drone. The Drone has potential for more damage, plague weapon, can fly, move further, and has an invuln.

 

I'm not trying to hate on the helbrute, I quite like the model and I have one magnetized, but I just always compare it to one of the DG dedicated Daemon engines and it always seems worse. Maybe my opinion will switch when Grey knights get their codex and my brother starts using them again. Now that we don't have our 5+++ against MW spam, it's going to suck haha.

[Tokugawa]

9th meta is a melta meta, that may be true. But to equip only 1 multimelta on a isv-less 115pts chassis, and giving it a task needed to finish with a full-melta unit, is nowhere close to "competitive".

 

Opponents could easily find options with much higher melta shots(or other high S anti tank shots)/points ratio. Remember: When they are in your melta range, you are in their melta range, too.

 

Please don't dream "a cheap unit melta-kill an expensive tank" route works on hellbrute. Hellbrute is going to be the "expensive tank" itself. It will be hunted, not hunter. The cheaper units with more firepower(e.g. attack bikes) are hunter.

Edited March 3, 2021 by Tokugawa

[KingYertle]

I'm honestly surprised by all the MBH Love.  Plague Lord, what do you think of doing them next?

[Verbal Underbelly]

I think there's a place for DG helbrutes, I think their main issue is finding a place in the crowded elites slot. They're certainly far more interesting in this codex than they have been for years. Minus one damage, some decent strats and synergies etc. 

 

As ever, it's probably most worthwhile giving them one melee weapon and one gun. 

 

My own plan is multi-melta, fist and heavy flamer to walk alongside a unit of ten plague marines with 2 melta guns and 2 plague spewers. Potentially walk them on as outflanking reinforcements mid game. 

 

I think it's worth using helbrutes to mirror what your plague marines are carrying.