Most efficient unit for Stubborn Defiance

[palin2222]

While I was planning out my list I started thinking about what unit would be best to use for the Stubborn Defiance Secondary Objective. I thought I would share my findings.

 

In order to qualify for Stubborn Defiance and get the most points out of it, you have to claim an objective with an Obsec unit, and keep that objective claimed for the duration of the game. An Ideal candidate unit would be one that is hard to kill, one that doesn't mind standing still, and the longest range possible to support the rest of the army. Given those requirements the following options are available to us

 

Battle Forged Troops choices (taken as cheap as possible)

- Infiltrator Squad @ 12ppw max range 24"

- Incursor squad @ 10.5 ppw, max range 24"

- Intercessor Squad @ 10 ppw, max range 24"

- Assault Intercessor @ 9.5 ppw, max 12"

- Heavy Intercessor @ 9.3 ppw, T5, max range 42"

- Tactical squad @ 9 ppw, max range 24"

 

Of these options they basically are all equally tough, being T4 and 2 wound models accept for the Heavy Intercessors, which are T5 and 3 wounds. Assault intersessors are a particularly bad choice becuase they are a melee unit and basically wont be able to contribute to the fight at all, unless they get charged. From these, your best options are going to be a tactical Squad, for cheapness or a Heavy Intercessor Squad for Toughness and utility. The heavy intercessor also benefits from the Transhuman strat if you need it.

 

Deathwing Vanguard Detachment (taken as cheap as possible)

- Terminator Squad @ 12.6 ppw, 2+/5++, IC,  max range 24"

- Relic Terminator Squad @ 11.3 ppw, 2+/5++, IC,  max range 24"

- Terminator Assault Squad @ 11 ppw, 2+/5++, IC,  max range melee

- Deathwing Terminator Squad @ 11ppw, 2+/5++ IC11:30 , max range melee

 

Toughness for these units are all Identical, being terminator armor they are all 2+/5++ and have Inner Circle. If you want versatility go with the Deathwing Terminators as you can take more options, though keep in mind their shooting options cost more points. The biggest problem with these is that they are all very expensive, and generally none of them want to be sitting still 

 

Ravenwing Outrider Detachment

- Outrider Squad @ 11.25 ppw, Max Range is 24"

- Bike Squad @ 10 ppw, Max Range is 24"

 

Standard bikes are the winner in this catagory, While they dont really want to be standing still, because of Jink. I suppose you could just advance them every turn, driving in circles around the objective marker so you can enjoy those 4+ jink saves. Come to think of it, are you allowed to advance a unit and just choose to move them 0 inches and still benefit from Jink, or do you actually have to move a minim distance to qualify for the save? 

 

 

The last source of obsec comes in the form of a Chapter Ancient with the Warlord Trait "Steadfast example" turning any core unit within 6" obsec. 

There are a lot of core units in the book, none of them are particularly efficient, but they do have some interesting options. I wont list them all, unless you really want them, but the ones that stood out most to me were the following:

Keep in mind that these ppw include the cost and wounds of a Chapter Ancient with a Warlord trait

- Venerable Dreadnought @ 20.9 ppw, -1 Damage 6+++. Max Range 24"

- Redemptor Dreadnough @ 15.8 ppw Max Range 30"

- Devastators @ 13.2 ppw Max Range 24" (signum will allow for easier hits)

 

All in all, its really not very efficient to use the Chapter Ancient in this matter, You can get some interesting options and some really tough units but nothing too over and above what is all ready available out there.

 

 

 

TLDR:

Most efficient option: Tactical Squad

Most Useful: Heavy Intercessors

Out of left field: Bike Squad can burn donuts around the objective for the lols and points

[bigtrouble]

movement in the movement phase uses the word “can” and can be on any legal path, so yes, you could declare an advance and not move, or do donuts. You just can’t then shoot or charge.

[CyberC1]

In my last game I mistakenly made my outrider detachment obj secured instead of my vanguard one, and ended up having to camp my unit of 3 Ravenwing bikes with melta guns on a backfield objective all game. It was ok, still won, but a total waste of a mobile unit.

[PhilB]

I would have thought a unit of Infiltrators would have been pretty hard to shift. Between the helix gauntlet, smoke screen & transhuman, it’s a lot of CP, but only if they focus on that unit.

[G8Keeper]

Considering it will net you what, 40 VP's in a game, depending on the mission, (assuming you do manage to hold it for 5 turns) it's worth spending the points on something that's going to be able to protect itself too.  I'd go for Deathwing Terminators in a Deathwing Vanguard detachment, full 10-man with at least 2 or 3 storm shields, the rest shooty.  You have the ability to tank damage, the base size to keep obsec units more than 3" away even if they outnumber you pretty easily, decent shooty and combat output and a host of buffs available from characters should you feel like supporting them, a Chief Apothecary being my initial thoughts.

[Brother Ramael]

Considering it will net you what, 40 VP's in a game, depending on the mission, (assuming you do manage to hold it for 5 turns) it's worth spending the points on something that's going to be able to protect itself too.  I'd go for Deathwing Terminators in a Deathwing Vanguard detachment, full 10-man with at least 2 or 3 storm shields, the rest shooty.  You have the ability to tank damage, the base size to keep obsec units more than 3" away even if they outnumber you pretty easily, decent shooty and combat output and a host of buffs available from characters should you feel like supporting them, a Chief Apothecary being my initial thoughts.

I agree on principle but I feel a 5 man squad with some SS mixed in and maybe a AC/CL for some bite could do as well; obviously if your opponent is keeping units in reserve you'd be right to keep some backup around.

[G8Keeper]

 

I agree on principle but I feel a 5 man squad with some SS mixed in and maybe a AC/CL for some bite could do as well; obviously if your opponent is keeping units in reserve you'd be right to keep some backup around.

 

 

Indeed, I do feel for the entire game you need the full 10-man though.

[CyberC1]

Oof, that’s a load of points to sink in to one thing, but at Strike Force and above sized games I can see it making sense.

[palin2222]

Considering it will net you what, 40 VP's in a game, depending on the mission, (assuming you do manage to hold it for 5 turns) it's worth spending the points on something that's going to be able to protect itself too.  I'd go for Deathwing Terminators in a Deathwing Vanguard detachment, full 10-man with at least 2 or 3 storm shields, the rest shooty.  You have the ability to tank damage, the base size to keep obsec units more than 3" away even if they outnumber you pretty easily, decent shooty and combat output and a host of buffs available from characters should you feel like supporting them, a Chief Apothecary being my initial thoughts.

It nets you 15 points. 2, 3, 5, and 5 on consecutive turns. Done properly, its a guaranteed 15 point and can easily win you the game, but its not so powerful that I can justify spending a quarter of my army on one secondary objective. Especially since this one objective will net me in one game, what you can earn in one turn of the primary objective. BUT following up with your idea of terminators, the Deathwing command squad is a core unit, and will benefit from the Chapter Ancient. It ends up being 17 points per wound. 170 points total for the bodies, and the added bonus of bodyguard for your ancient. 

 

 

[G8Keeper]

Dont forget the primary points for the objective too, 5 per turn (depending on the mission). Unless im being extremely dense of course, highly possible.

[march10k]

Eh, for me, it has to be ten deathwing.  With Azrael and a pair of plasma cannons.  While camping that home objective, they should have LOS and range to 1-2 other objectives with the stormbolters, let alone the cannons.  So they're NOT just sitting there collecting 15 secondary points.  Besides contributing towards the primary (owning one out of 4-6 primary objectives outright, no questions asked, is actually quite powerful), it's going to threaten infantry on or near at least one other, supporting any forces you have in that area and it's going to be throwing boosted plasma a bit farther than that. 

 

It is a ton of points.  Even worse when combined with my 8 knights supported by my TDA IC Master of Sanctity.  But when the knights murder the enemy's best unit and seize THAT objective, I'm sitting on two and skirmishing for the 2-4 remaining ones with a force that includes Zeke.  Having Zeke in the midfield skirmish means if the numbers aren't in my favor, I can neutralize one of my opponent's caps.  If I look at the board and my opponent's list pre-game and decide to, I can always combat squad those ten terminators, too.

Edited April 11, 2021 by march10k

[G8Keeper]

Eh, for me, it has to be ten deathwing.  With Azrael and a pair of plasma cannons.  While camping that home objective, they should have LOS and range to 1-2 other objectives with the stormbolters, let alone the cannons.  So they're NOT just sitting there collecting 15 secondary points.  Besides contributing towards the primary (owning one out of 4-6 primary objectives outright, no questions asked, is actually quite powerful), it's going to threaten infantry on or near at least one other, supporting any forces you have in that area and it's going to be throwing boosted plasma a bit farther than that. 

 

It is a ton of points.  Even worse when combined with my 8 knights supported by my TDA IC Master of Sanctity.  But when the knights murder the enemy's best unit and seize THAT objective, I'm sitting on two and skirmishing for the 2-4 remaining ones with a force that includes Zeke.  Having Zeke in the midfield skirmish means if the numbers aren't in my favor, I can neutralize one of my opponent's caps.  If I look at the board and my opponent's list pre-game and decide to, I can always combat squad those ten terminators, too.

 

I always forget about Plasma Cannons on DW, I still have to assemble mine.  A 10-man unit with 2 of them would be a decent shout for WotDA, with re-rolls from Azzy and for me an Apothecary along for the ride, it's pretty safe to overcharge too if needed.  That being said, Cyclone's are hard to ignore.

[march10k]

 

Eh, for me, it has to be ten deathwing.  With Azrael and a pair of plasma cannons.  While camping that home objective, they should have LOS and range to 1-2 other objectives with the stormbolters, let alone the cannons.  So they're NOT just sitting there collecting 15 secondary points.  Besides contributing towards the primary (owning one out of 4-6 primary objectives outright, no questions asked, is actually quite powerful), it's going to threaten infantry on or near at least one other, supporting any forces you have in that area and it's going to be throwing boosted plasma a bit farther than that. 

 

It is a ton of points.  Even worse when combined with my 8 knights supported by my TDA IC Master of Sanctity.  But when the knights murder the enemy's best unit and seize THAT objective, I'm sitting on two and skirmishing for the 2-4 remaining ones with a force that includes Zeke.  Having Zeke in the midfield skirmish means if the numbers aren't in my favor, I can neutralize one of my opponent's caps.  If I look at the board and my opponent's list pre-game and decide to, I can always combat squad those ten terminators, too.

 

I always forget about Plasma Cannons on DW, I still have to assemble mine.  A 10-man unit with 2 of them would be a decent shout for WotDA, with re-rolls from Azzy and for me an Apothecary along for the ride, it's pretty safe to overcharge too if needed.  That being said, Cyclone's are hard to ignore.

 

 

I have at least two of all of the heavy weapon options.  My issue with cyclones is that krak missiles underperform against tanks, compared to lascannons, and frag missiles underperform against infantry, compared to bolters.  I call that "delusions of mediocrity."  They think they're jacks of all trades, but they're pretty limp-wristed against both types of targets.  Especially since core rules finally gave split fire to every model.  Why bother with frag missiles when you have stormbolters in the same squad?  They sort of made sense when you were forced to shoot everything at the same target, but now that the stormbolters and the heavy weapons can shoot at separate targets, frag missiles are almost never useful. 

 

Meanwhile, krak missiles are overkill against individual heavy infantry models in general, and yet might still roll a 1 for damage.  They also have a flat 2 shots versus D3 when compared to the plasma cannon.  That's an advantage a lot of the time, but sometimes the plasma gets a flat 3, and with two weapons in a squad of 10, the usual result is equal: 4 shots.  You'll get 5 as often as you get 3 from the plasma, and 6 as often as 2, except when you get a flat 6, of course.  But the number of shots is far less orky than the damage of the missiles.

 

Damage...that's where I really love the plasma cannons.  It's 100% up to you, no random outcomes.   That's massive with heavy infantry.  Two wound models? Overcharge.  Three wound models?  Overcharge and WotDA.  One shot, one kill, no "this one's dead and this one's on one wound."  Shooting at a tank?  Overcharge, obviously, but you get to decide whether or not to burn WotDA for 50% more damage.  Maybe this turn it's more important to put WotDA on my 5 inceptors?  Flexibility and and reliability.  I'll take 3 damage over D6 damage any day of the week.  With 4 shots, krak missiles only average 14 damage, with a massive range of possible outcomes.  With plasma, if use WotDA, it's pretty reliably 9, 12, or 15 damage, and usually 12.  That means two things to me.  I'm not going to whiff with 4, and I'm not going to throw an impressive, but useless, 24.  12 damage leaves a few things alive, but it cripples all of them.   

 

Honestly, one of the scariest units in the game is a dark angels plasma cannon devastator squad in an Azrael bubble in cover on an objective.  It's so reliable at pointing  and clicking to delete things, and impossible to shoot off the board.  But terminator armor with half the cannons is a fair trade to ensure 15 points in the secondary objective.  

 

Absolutely need the ambulance.  In my list, he starts with the DWK, but his bike makes him available to stand up an inceptor or a plasma cannoneer, as well, especially on the smaller boards that 9th edition gifts us with.