Would you like primaris 'sternguard' and 'vanguard'

[Inquisitor_Lensoven]

I was thinking veteran heavy Intercessors with more weapon options for sternguard and BGV with jumpacks for vanguard veteran equivalent.

[Brother Ramael]

Tbh I think BGV are intended to be the VV already, adding JP to BGV would start a riot.

[Karhedron]

I would like JP melee Primaris but I think it would obsolete too many units like Van Vets, Sanguinary Guard etc.

[Sarvis]

Well they are going to be replaced at some point anyways, as primaris are effectively the replacement to smol marines, but with some gimmicks. I think and hope we’ll see VV and SGVs eventually, also primaris sang guard

[Imren]

Assuming GW really wants 40k to steer away from original size marines and shift over to large size primaris, then I think it is just a matter of time before we see JPs on primaris,already we have inceptors which are kind of JP primaris unit.

 

Seems like GW discontinued the jumping primaris unit with the short barrelled autocannons! Who would have guessed.

[redmapa]

I would have prefered if Veteran Intercessors used the Heavy Intercessors instead and gave them a rule similar to the old Special Ammo that Sternguard had that is now part of the Deathwatch, essentially you chose an ammo type that had a special bonus (like ignore cover, +1S, rerolling vs infantry, etc), to me that would have been a great primaris Sternguard equivalent, normal intercessors with +1A is just lazy and boring to me.

 

As for Vanguard Vets, I dont know, I think BGV are a good equivalent and I would rather see an update for the vanilla terminators or an equivalent unit for Primaris, maybe Saturnine armor with each marine being a walking fortress, you get less marines per unit but more guns and harder melee.

[Inquisitor_Lensoven]

I would have prefered if Veteran Intercessors used the Heavy Intercessors instead and gave them a rule similar to the old Special Ammo that Sternguard had that is now part of the Deathwatch, essentially you chose an ammo type that had a special bonus (like ignore cover, +1S, rerolling vs infantry, etc), to me that would have been a great primaris Sternguard equivalent, normal intercessors with +1A is just lazy and boring to me.

 

As for Vanguard Vets, I dont know, I think BGV are a good equivalent and I would rather see an update for the vanilla terminators or an equivalent unit for Primaris, maybe Saturnine armor with each marine being a walking fortress, you get less marines per unit but more guns and harder melee.

I can't consider dedicated foot sloggers an equivalent to a unit intended to be used with JPs.

 

Aggressors are supposed to be roughly equivalent to tactical terminators if not assault terms.

[XeonDragon]

Q: Would you like primaris 'sternguard' and 'vanguard'?

A;  No, I would not. That is all.

Edited April 11, 2021 by XeonDragon

[Subtleknife]

I kinda feel the amount of options for marines now is kind of a mess. I really like primaris but I do feel GW have dropped a ball here in a few way.

[Inquisitor_Lensoven]

I kinda feel the amount of options for marines now is kind of a mess. I really like primaris but I do feel GW have dropped a ball here in a few way.

expect a lot of those options to disappear in the next 2-5 years.

[Lord Nord in Gravis Armour]

Melee Jump Primaris were one of my predictions for the next wave, more specifically that they'll be in Phobos armor as I do not believe that GW ever intended for Shrike to be the only Primaris model wearing jump-enabled Phobos, nor do I think it'd be contained just to a Raven Guard squad. It also makes sense from a narrative perspective that jump veterans would actually prefer the lighter armor for its maneuverability over heavier Inceptor-style or even regular Omnis-pattern armor.

 

I see a bright future for Shrike-pattern armor and lightning claws in Primaris armies.

 

 

Seems like GW discontinued the jumping primaris unit with the short barrelled autocannons! Who would have guessed.

 

You mean the Suppressors? They've never been available as a separate purchase, sharing sprues with the other Shadowspear marines, and they're still available in the Start Collecting Vanguard box, the only place they've ever been available aside from Shadowspear.

 

I would like JP melee Primaris but I think it would obsolete too many units like Van Vets, Sanguinary Guard etc.

 

So Ultima Founding chapters are just SOL then?

[Brother Captain Vakarian]

Yes, I would love them. The Indomitus Crusade veteran Primaris (Bladeguard, etc.) got me back into 40K. I would really love two things to flesh out the Primaris line: melee jump infantry and true Primaris/true scale Terminators. Having Vanguard Veteran and Sternguard veteran equivalent Primaris that have the design style of the Bladeguard would be awesome.

 

Although I suspect the comments about lightning claw Phobos armor are probably closer to what we’ll actually get. Which is also fine with me.

[Lord_Ikka]

We'll eventually get some sort of JP Primaris- but what would be the point of Assault Intercessors if we get JP Primaris? I'm honestly wondering, as we already have a fairly decent range of units available for Primaris and invalidating one of them seems counter-intuitive. It would seem to be the same thing that happens to non-JP Firstborn Assault squads, they just never get taken unless you are really low on points.

 

As far as actual Sternguard/Vanguard Primaris- as of yet I don't see it. Primaris squads all do the same weapon, or more recently have one guy upgraded to a heavier version of the same weapon, so I don't think GW will start handing out a bunch of options similar to how current Stern/Vanguard Vets get.

[Lucerne]

No. I'd like real Sternguard and Vanguard as part of an upsize and range refresh.

[Jorin Helm-splitter]

We'll eventually get some sort of JP Primaris- but what would be the point of Assault Intercessors if we get JP Primaris? I'm honestly wondering, as we already have a fairly decent range of units available for Primaris and invalidating one of them seems counter-intuitive. It would seem to be the same thing that happens to non-JP Firstborn Assault squads, they just never get taken unless you are really low on points.

 

As far as actual Sternguard/Vanguard Primaris- as of yet I don't see it. Primaris squads all do the same weapon, or more recently have one guy upgraded to a heavier version of the same weapon, so I don't think GW will start handing out a bunch of options similar to how current Stern/Vanguard Vets get.

Assault Intercessors are troops I doubt JP melee options will be in that slot, so I think it's a stretch to say they would be invalidated.

 

Totally agree with your other points though there are no primaris kits with anywhere near the customization options that VV and Sternguard have and I really doubt there will be.

[Son of Sacrifice]

As a modeller, absolutely. Veteran kits, hopefully with pieces of older armour marks and bolters would be very welcome. From a rules perspective I'm not really bothered, cool models are my priority. Edited April 12, 2021 by Son of Sacrifice

[Ishagu]

Not really, but I do feel that Primaris need a fast moving, cc unit.

 

That's one of the few things the range is lacking and would allow Primaris to stand independent as a complete force that covers all bases, along with a dedicated flyer and some indirect fire vehicle.

Edited April 12, 2021 by Ishagu

[Inquisitor_Lensoven]

Not really, but I do feel that Primaris need a fast moving, cc unit.

 

That's one of the few things the range is lacking and would allow Primaris to stand independent as a complete force that covers all bases, along with a dedicated flyer and some indirect fire vehicle.

as long as that dedicated flier is as cool as a 'Raven and can sling a dreadnought around I'm down.

[BLACK BLΠFLY]

If I could take five man outrider squads and the sarge armed with a TH I would be okay.

[Blindhamster]

I honestly think we'll see a veteran shooty primaris unit eventually, and if we get jump pack melee primaris of any kind, I'd expect veteran ones eventually too.

[Spleenex]

We'll eventually get some sort of JP Primaris- but what would be the point of Assault Intercessors if we get JP Primaris? I'm honestly wondering, as we already have a fairly decent range of units available for Primaris and invalidating one of them seems counter-intuitive. It would seem to be the same thing that happens to non-JP Firstborn Assault squads, they just never get taken unless you are really low on points.

This is my concern, as well - I just don't see any design space for CC JP Primaris. At least not without making one of the other stabby units obsolete, or at least directly competing with them. I had the thought that maybe an "assault support" JP unit like Inceptors with flamers might work. Steps on the toes of Aggressors a bit, but if all they have are flamers they're missing the former's CC punch. Could provide reactive overwatch or support a unit about to charge. Such a unit would probably have to extortionately expensive, though.

Edited April 13, 2021 by Spleenex

[Ishagu]

If I could take five man outrider squads and the sarge armed with a TH I would be okay.

Yep, this sounds great!

[Brother Captain Vakarian]

 

 

We'll eventually get some sort of JP Primaris- but what would be the point of Assault Intercessors if we get JP Primaris? I'm honestly wondering, as we already have a fairly decent range of units available for Primaris and invalidating one of them seems counter-intuitive. It would seem to be the same thing that happens to non-JP Firstborn Assault squads, they just never get taken unless you are really low on points.

This is my concern, as well - I just don't see any design space for CC JP Primaris. At least not without making one of the other stabby units obsolete, or at least directly competing with them. I had the thought that maybe an "assault support" JP unit like Inceptors with flamers might work. Steps on the toes of Aggressors a bit, but if all they have are flamers they're missing the former's CC punch. Could provide reactive overwatch or support a unit about to charge. Such a unit would probably have to extortionately expensive, though.

This is part of why I expect Primaris jump infantry would be locked to dual claws in Phobos armor like Shrike. They’d have a unique role: fast and meant to tangle with hordes. They wouldn’t have the resilience or ability to punch up of Bladeguard, and they wouldn’t have ObSec or the ability to take special weapons on the Sarge like Assault Intercessors.

 

The more I think about it, the more I agree true Veteran-style units for Primaris are unlikely, in part because Bladeguard already fill the role and in part because GW really does seem set on reducing redundancies in the Marine range through Primaris. Of course lots could change based on how they end up handling firstborn and what seems to be a gradual transition to purely the new models.

 

Dang it, I still want real Terminators though.

[TheNewman]

... and I would rather see an update for the vanilla terminators or an equivalent unit for Primaris, maybe Saturnine armor with each marine being a walking fortress, you get less marines per unit but more guns and harder melee.

You pretty much just described Centurions.

 

I think with how Fierros translated into the generic Primaris Techmarine a Shrike -> generic Primaris Jump Pack captain translation is also probably inevitable; that's too cool of a gubbin to not reuse.

 

Shrike himself would be in a very strange place in an all-primaris future that didn't include a JP melee unit of some kind. .

[Medjugorje]

I would like JP melee Primaris but I think it would obsolete too many units like Van Vets, Sanguinary Guard etc.

and too OP. Think about the Jump pack Shrike has already (14" movement) and a BGV with it...

 

If JP... then a Assault Intercessor squad

Edited April 14, 2021 by Medjugorje