Ultramarines Supplement wishlist

[Captain Idaho]

Sure I know this is likely an edition away but let's have fun and talk about what we all know and love!

 

So for me, my wishlist for a new Ultramarines supplement is:

 

• Honour Guard given a 3rd wound. I don't understand why they're stuck at 2 considering their position within the Chapter. Still, they are more likely to be kicked to legacy anyway...

 

• Sicarius getting a rules refresh. Make him an flashy leader, working on intuition with his rules, like something akin to outflabking part of your force, or when he and his Tactical squads deploy from Drop Pod they get +1 to wound in shooting.

 

Also he is supposed to be a champion of the Chapter, so much so that Primaris leaders of the Chapter doubted they could even hold a candle to him - give him some of the buffs a Chapter Champion gets.

 

Hell, keep his special rules if need be but make him a Captain with the Chapter Champion rules combined and that works.

 

• Guilliman... I think it's time he got his reroll to wounds back in full. It's already coming from another character and can be given to characters as well as core units, so Guilliman doesn't need it himself.

 

• The Solider's Blade could be changed to grant additional attacks or something. It has a very limited place right now otherwise.

 

• Strategums

 

I'd like the duff and pointless ones replaced with thematic Ultramarines ones.

 

One that harkens back to 30K would be cool - if a Troops, Phobos or Scouts unit shoots at an enemy unit, the next unit in the army to fire at said unit that turn and get +1 to wound.

 

Another which I'd enjoy is for some flexibility, like a Captain/Chapter Master/Guilliman can give his benefits to a unit anywhere on the table. That would be really cool.

 

In a similar vein, how about for 2 CP a Captain can grant his benefits to a non-Core unit in the Codex, though in practice that'll be a vehicle or Centurion squad.

 

***

 

I could go on all day but what do other folk want?

[Subtleknife]

I would like the supplement to be more thematic. I feel the majority of our stratagems have missed the mark in this regard. IMO the Ultras strats should be about flexibility and allowing us to adapt. The strats that I feel really nails this is the rapid redeployment and the defensive focus ones. I think if GW aim for Ultras being able to replicate the strengths of the other chapters but not in such an efficient way then that is the way to go. For instance the rapid redeployment allows us some flexibility in the deploy phase but it isnt a generous as the raven guard etc, I think that is how our strats should feel.

 

I want to get a jack of all trades master of none feel from the supplement. I feel we do need a way to re-roll charges and get a plus 1 to wound strat but with a twist.

 

Eg the re roll to charge could go something like this...

Covering Fire:

If a separate infantry/troop etc unit in the shooting phase has targeted the enemy unit selected to be charged, then the charging unit may re-roll the charge roll.

 

This isnt as good as a straight up re roll the charge but allows the Ultras to do something similar.

 

I think our psychic powers need a redo really but I dont really use them that much so not sure how exactly I would change them.

 

For characters....

 

RG I feel either needs a points rebalanced or a rules rebalance. I hope he gets the latter as points just feels a bit lazy. Again I wish he would be more thematic somehow.

 

Victrix I think would just want a master crafted power sword and that is it.

 

Tyranic war vets....I feel like these guys need a whole redo, my dream would be they get a model redo (like the hounds of morkai) and get a primaris revamp with an existing kit to tie us over until the end of the primaris update and GW move onto hopefully releasing propper chapter specific primaris.

[BLACK BLΠFLY]

I feel like in general the SM codex needs a rework first and foremost.

Edited May 12, 2021 by Black Blow Fly

[Captain Idaho]

Here's a few changes that are all about theme:

 

Tyrannic War Veterans - Grenadiers needs adding to the unit akin to old; any model can forgo their attacks to make a single attack with a Krak Grenade in melee.

 

On that note:

 

Echoes of Cold Steel Ridge - Strategum

 

An Ultramarines core unit can still fire despite being engaged in close combat, provided they fire at a unit that has engaged them. All shooting this turn for that unit is done at -1 to hit.

 

3 Command Points, dropping to 2 vs Tyranids.

 

Guilliman

 

"You can use any Battle Tactics or Strategic Ploy Strategum from Codex Space Marines or Ultramarines for 0 CP. You can only use this ability once per turn."

 

I think this would be really powerful and thematic for Guilliman. If his rules stay the same, I consider adding this would bring his points investment to reasonable.

[NKirkham24]

I think the free strategem is a great idea for Guilliman. He is literally the author of the codex, he should know all the tricks in the book. I was initially going to say this could replace his +3 CP, but that needs to remain so it doesn't penalise us for taking him.

 

I was thinking maybe something along the lines of the following:

 

Primogenitors

Ultramarine geneseed makes up the vast majority of all Imperial space marines lineage. Members of these chapters often revere their primogenitors as shining examples of what a space marine should be. Members of Ultramarine successors are known to make pilgrimage to Macragge and the Shrine of the Primarch, and often serve alongside the Ultramarines. This shared experience only enhances the Ultramarines knowledge in all forms of warfare and sees them able to apply any tactics where necessary.

 

Similar to Paragon of the Chapter in DW (which allows a character to swap out to his parent chapters warlord trait), on a squad level we can swap our chapter trait to one of the successor chapter traits in the codex for a turn? 

[Captain Idaho]

Oh yeah, I'd definitely like to see our Psychic Powers changed. Some are pointless pretty much and others very expensive in Warp Charge cost.

[Torbenos]

Not sure if it would be too powerful, but I could imagine a stratagem that makes an infantry unit Obsec for a turn, or makes an already obsec unit count as twice the number. 

[jonjacob]

I don't tend to play many other characters at the moment. But I do keep Sicarius regularly and I would pay 130-150 for the following.

 

Battle Forged Heros: At the start of the battle round select 1 ultramarines unit within 6 of this model, that unit receives a +1 to wound rolls.

 

Knight Champion of Mcragge: When resolving an attack made with a melee weapon by this model against a CHARACTER unit, you can re-roll the hit roll and you can re-roll the wound roll.

 

Tempest blade damage fixed to 3. Coverts to mortal wounds on a 6+

 

Warlord trait. Gets to fight first.

 

But I doubt the above would ever happen.

 

I do agree better strategems should be on the cards. And unit like tyranic war vets and honour guard need a re-think.

[BLACK BLΠFLY]

It’d be awesome if we got a unit like Primaris Suzerain.

[Captain Idaho]

I'd like to use those lovely FW models for the Invictus Suzerain. They're my all time favourites but man we can't use them for 40K.

[Ishagu]

My hopes:

 

Unit changes:

 

Calgar:

-Gauntlets of Ultramar should be Flat 3 damage

-Bolters should be Rapid Fire 4

-reduce cost to 180. Still awards 2 cp

 

Tigurius:

-Rod of Tigurius should be flat 3 damage

-Reduce cost to 115 points

 

Sicarius:

-Sword should be Damage 2, Damage becomes Mortal Wounds on roll of 5+ to wound

-re-roll hits and wounds when in combat against characters

-Grants aura of +1 to assault

-Increase cost to 160

 

Cassius:

-Can select 3 Litanies, can cast 2

-casts on a 2+

 

Guilliman:

-Gain D6 extra attacks when using Sword

-Gauntlet is damage 3+ D3

-Gauntlet ranged attack is 24", Assault 6, Str 6, Ap-2, Damage 2

-Can only be wounded on a 4+

-Friendly Astartes Core and Character units within 6" can re-roll all hits, and can re-roll wound rolls of 1

-Can nominate 1 Ultramarines unit within 12" to re-roll all hits and wounds

-Grants aura of +1 to advance and charge

-After losing all wounds, once per game can be set up again in the controlling players command phase, as close to previous position as possible, with 3 wounds remaining

-Can select 3 Warlord traits from the Ultramarines traits

-Cost changed to 360

 

Victrix Honour Guard:

-Make swords Master-Crafted

-Change unit size to max of 5, minimum of 2

 

 

Changes to rules:

 

Chapter Tactic:

-Units can withdraw from combat and shoot with no penalty in the following turn

-Add 1 to leadership

-Units ignore negative leadership modifiers

 

 

New Stratagems:

 

-Focused Fire, 1 CP. Nominate one unit. That unit Gains +1 to wound in the shooting phase if it targets a single enemy unit.

 

-Marshall Precision, 1 CP. Nominate one unit. That unit gains +1 to wound in the combat phase.

 

-Tactical Superiority. 1 CP. Nominate 1 unit that has been placed in Tactical reserve. That unit can be deployed 6" from any board edge and 9" from enemy Units

 

-Unwavering charge: 1 CP. Nominate one unit, that unit can re-roll 1 or both dice when rolling for charge distance.

 

 

Paychic power changes:

 

-Scryer's Gaze: WC 7 - Reduce the cost of the first stratagem used by the controlling player in the following phase by 1, to a minimum of 1.

Increase the cost of of the first stratagem used by the opposing player by 1 to a maximum of 4.

 

-Psychic Protection: WC 6 -Nominate 1 unit within 12". Until the next psychic phase that unit has a 4+ Invulnerable save

 

-Warp Haste: WC 7- Nominate 1 unit within 6" of the Psyker. That unit can immediately move as if it was the movement phase

Edited May 13, 2021 by Ishagu

[Captain Idaho]

Oh this is something close to my heart, but I'd like Calgar to get his Terminator armoured version back. Why? Well I like Terminators and the model is the best version of him, but really it's because I love the Battle of Maccragge and historic 40K themes in my armies.

 

@ Ishagu - not sure Tigurius needs a melee buff since he's actually pretty good now anyway. But I wouldn't be opposed to it either ;)

[Ishagu]

I think Tiggy is a bit delicate, and I've seen so many weapons across different books Gain fixed damage profiles. I'd prefer a flat 2 over the D3.

[Captain Idaho]

Here's something that I took as from a bit of inspiration from the Death Guard - Company rules!

 

Imagine that would be too much and working out which units get the rules might need some heavy keyword usage. But I'd love it.

 

I particularly want 1st Company rules.

 

In a similar vein to that, I'd like to apply rules to Captains specific to Companies, which would be a neat work around to the whole army counting as a specific Company.

 

I think Tiggy is a bit delicate, and I've seen so many weapons across different books Gain fixed damage profiles. I'd prefer a flat 2 over the D3.

Definitely prefer flat 2. And yes he's still vulnerable even with the extra Primaris wound.

[NKirkham24]

Agree completely on Tiggy! 

 

He is arguably the Imperium's best psyker, and sees threats coming before they happen, but has a basic 3+ armour save. He even uses his powers in game to confer a -1 to hit on a unit with his prescience, but he cannot see what's going to hit him personally?

 

I know non-Terminator Librarians do not usually get an Inv save, but I think Tiggy really should have. If it's a 4+ he would probs need a points hike, but 5+ seem fair?

[Captain Idaho]

I don't think Tigurius really needs that kind of buffing. With Ultramarines powers being boosted and the fact he's often thought of as an auto include now as is for the bargain points cost he is, he can stay the same. Well obviously going to D2 would be cool.

[Ishagu]

He's only useful now because the generic powers got better, but he's far from an auto include. You can make a comparable psysker for less with a few relics and some cp investment.

 

His best ability is the 5++ Invulnerable bubble spell. He costs 130 points.

 

Azrael is a Chapter Master with far better stats and weapons, has a 4++ Invul bubble and costs 170 points.

 

When I wrote my wishlist I was looking at all the buffs and powers other recently updated armies had, and some of it might appear too powerful but I've based it on what's already out there.

Edited May 13, 2021 by Ishagu

[Captain Idaho]

Azrael is a Chapter Master who can't deny powers or cast any, including Mortal Wounds. The 2 aren't comparable.

 

Sure you can make a character in Terminator armour and with CP investment make him comparable but that's a niche and costs in different ways. Depends if you want to pay the Command Point investment.

[Ishagu]

No, Azrael can't cast powers, but he has an improved version of Tiggy's best power as a guaranteed ability each turn. That's on top of being a Chapter Master with a CP bonus and far better offense and durability.

 

When you compare Tiggy to other named psykers he's OK, generally, but his powers are not as impressive and he doesn't have the offense of his equivalents.

Edited May 13, 2021 by Ishagu

[Captain Idaho]

Taking Tigurius just for a 5+ Invulnerable save is likely the problem there.

 

I think you just made a case for Azrael being too cheap, which is different issue and doesn't mean a thing regarding Tigurius.

 

In fact, the best way to determine whether Tigurius is any good is a simple checklist:

 

Is he worth taking in your army now?

 

Yes, YES! or no?

 

Most people will say YES! or yes. If not all.

[Ishagu]

He's definitely worth taking in an Ultramarines army, but remember that this doesn't mean that he's a particularly strong unit when compared to the game as a whole.

 

To be clear I don't think he needs many changes. I think the weakness of our psychic discipline is the most disappointing thing about him.

[Captain Idaho]

Definitely.

 

The game stepped up a gear when Dark Angels, Death Guard and Dark Eldar came out (the 3ds) so maybe he does need a drastic power boost unless GW does something about those armies pretty sharpish.

[BLACK BLΠFLY]

I said new unit. Of course you can’t use 30k units… :facepalm

[Captain Idaho]

Lol you can use some! And they look awesome.

[macradam_hue]

I’d like to see Bobby G gain a version of the maximum number of wounds taken per phase rule that others have gained