Problem choosing Space Wolves

[Deiblox]

Hi guys. I'm new at this forum and at the hobby so... Hello to everybody.

 

I have a little problem with the stuff that I buy, that's the reason that I arrive here.

Well, the point is that before all the covid stuff I wanted to start playing this game. One friend and me buy the box the Prophecy of the wolf (ragnar blakmane box). I decided to buy the Talons of morkai box for completing the army.

 

And then, Covid comes and I have no time to paint or mount figures. I expend this year watching some games when I have time to know how this game works and I just realize that I don't want to be a Wolf. We didn't know anything about the game when we bought all the stuff and I buy Wolves just because I like the figures.

 

The thing is what I enjoy the most is the stealth, subterfuge and making my rival crazy (control game). And Shooting more than close combat. Like snipers, fast attacks and things like that.

 

For this reason I need ur help. I want an army like this, but I also want to try things. So, I don't know if I should sell this two boxes and start a new different army (I was looking for Genestealer cults) or just keep the normal infantry, sell the Wulfens and the Stormwolf ( all the wolfs stuff) and make my own chapter of Space Marines (for trying different chapters).

 

Can anyone give me an advice?

 

Thank you for your help.

 

P.S.  As you can see English is not my language, so I hope I explain myself, sorry for any mistake that I can made (any correction is welcome, so I can improve).

Edited May 13, 2021 by Brother Tyler
Text style formatting such as "u" for "you" is not allowed at the B&C.

[Captain Idaho]

Welcome to the forum. Let me bump this to the Fang, as they're a passionate and knowledgeable bunch in there and who better to discuss all things Space Wolf.

[Rune Priest Jbickb]

Welcome to the forum Deiblox!

 

First things first, if you like the models you can use them as different marines. Just take them as space wolf successors and then you can use space wolf units, but change your doctrines to fit your stealthily desires. Some fluff justification for this is Erik Morkai's Great company which has a much heavier Stealth Focus then the average space wolf.

 

Another option is to stick with marines but drop wolves. As you mentioned this would mean losing Ragnar, the storm wolf, and the wulfen as only wolves and their successors have those. Raven guard are a very stealth and surprise oriented marine army and you could always create a successor of them with a space wolf aesthetic but use Raven guard rules.

 

The beauty of marines is, at tge end of the say the armies are similar enough that you can try lots of stuff before you commit to a particular lore and honestly if you go for a custom chapter there's no need to ever fully commit as they could be successors of anyone.

 

The 3rd option is, as you mentioned switch altogether. While I am loathe to lose a wolf brother I totally get how tricky and expensive getting into this game is. So if starting a second army is not a possibility, then perhaps switching would make you happier. If that's the case, Gene Stealer Cult certainly has some of tge stealthiest options out there, both fluff wise and table wise.

 

Side note if you decide to keep wolves/ marines and start GSC, there is a box that you might be able to find called tooth and claw with both.

 

Good luck on your quest

[Captain Idaho]

I say go Space Wolves. If you are drawn to the models, then fighting as they do is going to be enjoyable for you too. (And then me bumping this to the SW forum isn't a massive mistake lol )

[Ragnar69]

I don't know much about shooty armies but I know that Genestealer Cults are one of the worst armies right now.

 

In general there isn't really subterfuge and stealth in this game as your opponent always knows what units you have and where they might pop up.

 

Space Wolves are still Space Marines and can be built very shooty with some efficient countercharge elements. In this edition, every army should include some melee units. you could also do a successor chapter and pick shooty traits if you want.

 

It is important that you like your models, else it is very hard to find motivation to build and paint a whole army. If you already bought them without knowing the rules, I guess you like the optics. So I suggest to give them a try.

[Xenith]

Hello and welcome to the forums! 

 

In my opinion, your first priority should be buying and painting which models you like the look of the most. If you do that, you'll have a better time painting them, and always enjoy fielding them on the table. 

 

As a Blood Angel, I empathise. Our chapter tactic often doesnt gel too well to maximise what these units do, but they're still usable.

 

In your instance, prophecy of the wolf box - you get a sprue of 10 phobos marines and can make a unit of 5 infiltrators (sniper headshot disruption specialists) and 5 incursors (5 wall breachers/SWAT style specialists). These are both perfectly usable as part of a Space Wolves army - your moels wont be better at shooting like Imperial fists will, or assassinating like Raven Guard, but they will be better in melee if you like your tactical espionage action to be more Jason Bourne stylee. You can supplement this with other PHOBOS characters - the Start Collecting! Vanguard Space Marines box would be a good addition, netting you a sneaky captain, some snipers and long range suppression guys. 

 

Space Wolves also have a great unit in Wolf Scouts - who get to outflank with special weapons, something no other chapter gets.

 

The large benefit of playing marines is that the codex covers the basic rules for a bunch of chapters. If you want to try out the playstyle of a different chapter before committing to it, go for it. If you create your own chapter (The Shadow Wolves?) you can chop and change what rules they have between games as you like, or make your own chapter tactics using the rules in the codex. 

 

Basically, you can do whatever you like, there's no hard and fast rule that Space Wolves can't play sneaky mind games with the opponent, so forge your own narrative!

[Deiblox]

Thank you for ur help. I will give a try to the wolfs because at least, I want to try different armies. I will paint them with a different schema and make successors of different chapters.

 

Just one question more. If I'm using a successor of, for example, wolves, I can't use Ragnar and their Vips. Is that correct?

 

So, here you have another wolf.

[Xenith]

Ragnar has the SPACE WOLVES keyword, so while you could use him in an army with other stuff, they will lose any detachment bonuses as they will be mixed. You can always use him as a generic primaris captain, or include him with 1 SPACE WOLVES troop choice.

 

If you want to run your models as SPACE WOLVES, just with a different colour, you can use him no issue, you're just not allowed to use him if say, you make a Space Wolf successor chapter with different chapter doctrines. 

[Deiblox]

So, if I paint my miniatures all like purple (just an example) and I put them a different sticker on their shoulders, but I say that they are wolves, I can include Ragnar with the bonus detachment?

 

And If I paint Marneus Calgar in purple and put the same sticker I can use my miniatures in a different game like Ultramarines with all the bonus, weapons and all the stuff from Ultramarines, right?

 

If I understand this right, what I can't do is mixing chapters to get bonus of every different chapter. So I can reuse my miniatures to try different chapters even in some small tournament?

[BadgersinHills]

So, if I paint my miniatures all like purple (just an example) and I put them a different sticker on their shoulders, but I say that they are wolves, I can include Ragnar with the bonus detachment?

 

And If I paint Marneus Calgar in purple and put the same sticker I can use my miniatures in a different game like Ultramarines with all the bonus, weapons and all the stuff from Ultramarines, right?

 

If I understand this right, what I can't do is mixing chapters to get bonus of every different chapter. So I can reuse my miniatures to try different chapters even in some small tournament?

 

If a detachment has the Space Wolves chapter keyword, Ragnar can be in it with the detachment bonus.

 

You can use the different coloured miniatures for Ultramarines, yep. A lot of Chapter bonuses for the Marines come from having a whole army that is one Chapter, so changing the keyword can lead to a lot of versatility.

 

As for tournaments you'd be okay in nearly every case, but some may be exceptions. 

[Xenith]

Precisely that. Ragnar has the SPACE WOLVES keyword, so if you say all your other guys have the SPACE WOLVES keyword (decided at army list creation) then you would get the respective bonuses.

 

Likewise, you could decide for the next game all your guys will have ULTRAMARINES and use Calgar with no issues. Paint scheme has no impact on rules. 

 

If you wanted, you could field one detachment as ULTRAMARINES with Calgar, and one as SPACE WOLVES with Ragnar, however as you then have a mixed army, you lose the 'Superdoctrine' for both, something which rewards focussed armies. If you do such a thing, it's generally good form to have the different keyword units with some visual differentiation somehow. 

[Karack Blackstone]

Hi, I hope this helps.

 

One of the great things about Space Wolves that might be affecting you right now is that the two books needed, Codex: Space Marines, and Codex Supplement: Space Wolves are not that easy at times to get a hold of! What really will help is that Space Wolves and their successor Chapters are pretty well capable of being all based on the SW bits, and sometimes if there's too much wolf, in the past there was a conversion thread to get a box of SW PA and a SM PA box, letting the two be mixed and matched as desired to tone down the wolf wolf wolf of GW.

 

Another thing that's important is that SW's very much play like they look! While you might love the mini's and question the rules, please come back later once you have your two core rulebooks to run the army, C: SM and CS: SW so we can help you get a grasp of how the army would play! I even struggle with the 9th edition stuff on how it all comes together!

 

Anyway, I seriously hope this helps! The Sons of Russ are here for you as ever if you need, and we're a pretty fun lot, so any questions you have as you're so new to the hobby, please ask here and if the question is better served elsewhere for your answers, the Mods herein will direct you to where you should consider asking!

 

Please have fun, game on, and above all, keep an open mind! WH40K is a very solid game right now, so above all, please learn!

 

If the rules are not an issue, please, explaining the new rules for Codex: Space Marines and Codex Supplement: Space Wolves could take some time! Ask away!

[Deiblox]

Thanks for ur help. Seriously it helps me a lot. I didn't know that I can decide the keyword of the army at the list creation.

 

Thanks a lot guys. I will make my own personalised "wolfs" chapter.

[Wulf Vengis]

Welcome to the Fang Frater!

 

I look forward to seeing your work in the future.

[Torin]

Thanks for ur help. Seriously it helps me a lot. I didn't know that I can decide the keyword of the army at the list creation.

 

Thanks a lot guys. I will make my own personalised "wolfs" chapter.

Welcome Deiblox,

 

Most important of all is that you are happy with the army that you are collecting. Take your time painting, slowly but surely. Cheers.

 

Torin.

[Commisar Necros]

Everyone here has covered the ground well. Xenith points out well that you can make a sneaky army with all those infiltrators. The wolf has to hunt down his prey so having a dedicated scout section would be great. Bunches of infiltrators backed up by land speeders and bikes would fit thematically for you, and work well on the table(Probably I run a lot of first born grey hunters so I play a bit different.) But what really matters is enjoying what your painting and modeling. If the wolves grabbed you go for it. They've been around since the beginning so could write whatever lore you want for your great company/successor. And the variety of units can keep your painting varied. Hell the wolves themselves have changed from a dark grey scheme in the heresy era, to the baby blue of the 40th and then now looking like its going back to the darker greys.

 

Best of luck, the pack is stronger with you here.

[Frater Cornelius]

Forget high end competitiveness when choosing an army. These things change and will prevent you from ever making a solid choice. ESPECIALLY if this is your first army.

 

Like Wolves? Go Wolves! Wanna have a different colour? Do a different colour! Don't like melee too much and wanna go all sneaky-like? Go for the hunter-stalking-prey theme! Incidentally, this is how actual wolf packs hunt. They rarely engage in direct fights, unless their den is threatened.

Just because it says melee on the box doesn't mean that all they do. All Marines are capable of solid melee so those buffs will never go to waste.

 

Besides, once you have a sizeable collection, who says that you won't expand into melee stuff?

 

Finally, once you built your Wolves, you can sometimes use Raven Guard rules for them. Trust me, any one who calls you out on it is probably not worth playing against anyway.

 

Tl,dr: DO IT!

Edited May 25, 2021 by Frater Cornelius