Returning to painting - tips/guidance?

[Tymell]

Greetings fraters!

 

So while I've maintained my reading and interest in Warhammer, I've been out of the loop on painting for a long time, haven't really done any properly for many years now. This summer looks set to be a pretty firm stay-home break for me, so seems like an ideal time to venture into the basement, bust out some of my (many) unpainted models and get cracking. Hopefully to a better standard than in my youth too...

 

I have a few questions about diving back in if anyone more experienced would be willing to indulge me:

1. Paints - In the past I've always just made use of GW's own paints, and now I wonder if there are other brands that work just as well but at a cheaper price. But I'm unsure. Are GW's own paints reasonably priced for their quality, or are there better options out there?
    
2. Air-brushes - I've heard about air-brushes but never actually tried one for myself. What are they like? Would they be okay to get back into things with, or would I be better off getting back into the swing of things with regular brushes first?
    
3. Videos - As I say, my painting back in the day left a bit to be desired, and while I'm not looking to enter any competitions or the like, I would like to try to aim for a higher standard. Would anyone recommend any particularly good online resources (videos, YouTube channels, webpages, etc)?

 

Cheers in advance for any help!

Edited May 18, 2021 by Tymell

[Bung]

There are alot of brands used in the hobby, Vallejo, Scalecolor, Armypainter, P3 Just to name a few.

Some people even use some artist brands like Createx or Schminke.

They dont differ that much and Most are cheaper than FW paints.

Maybe have a Look at your local hobby shop and have a look what they offer.

 

For an airbrush get back with a brush first as a decent airbrush setup will cost a bunch of money.

Maybe there is someone in your area using one and can show you how it works.

 

I recommend Hobby Cheating YouTube Channel.

Vincent Venturella answers all your questions in his videos.

[sbarnby71]

For the paints, sometimes it will come down to the actual colour you want, you may find one manufacturer does the exact colour you want.  I paint Space Wolves in the very light baby blue and I've tried Vallejo, Scalecolor, Armypainter and GW and I still go back to GW as they have the blue I want.  But another thing might be how long your paints last, so the GW pot lids by design end up with loads of paint in the lip which means you don't end up with an airtight seal, so if you don't use them very often, they dry up and you can end up throwing away half the paint.  Now dropper bottles are better, but I find if you over tighten the top, it splits the dropper and you end up with it leaking into the screw cap and lots of issues with blocked droppers or just a load of extra paint comes out or gets wasted.  So if one brand is cheaper, but you end up throwing half of it away because it's dried up, then you've not saved any money.  Also over the years I have bought so many different colours that I have used once, maybe twice, so I wasted a lot of money, if you can build up a small list of a few paints that can be adjusted with a wash then that will save money, Nuln Oil and Agrax Earth Shade will make your small number of paints go further.

 

I tend to use a mixture of brands of paints, once I find a colour I like from a certain brand, I'll stick with it. 

 

Airbrush, depends what you want to do, I base coat with a cheap Spraycraft unit that cost about £90 and it's perfect for that, never tried it for actual painting, but I think for that you'd need a decent setup and that can cost a LOT of money.  So stick with brushes first.

 

Videos, this guy does really good examples with Contrast paints (which I had almost given up on as I could not get flat armour plates done well and quickly):

http://www.bolterandchainsword.com/topic/370319-returning-to-painting-tipsguidance/

Edited May 18, 2021 by sbarnby71

[techsoldaten]

Good questions.

 

Sometimes I ask myself, if I had to start all over again, what would I actually buy.

 

Paints - GW paints are mostly good but expensive. I'd start with Army Painter color match paints and Vallejo, especially the metallics in the Model Air series. Then I'd buy specific colors from GW that are hard to match for the army I'm painting, there's about 15 that matter for me. Then I'd look at wash mediums, I use Army Painter quickshade wash medium just about ever time I paint. Along with that, I'd buy Liquitex Matte Medium / Matte Varnish / Gloss Varnish along with a Tamiya thinner. As far as GW washes go - they can be useful, but you can get much better results once you learn how to make your own washes.

 

Air Brushes - Work wonderfully once you learn how to use them. Dry tip is a thing and paints need to be properly thinned - focus on those points. I'd start with a Badger Chrome, which is a general, all round good airbrush. Then I would get a Badger Sotar for detail work. Then I'd add a Harder Steenbeck specifically because it's easy to use (but expensive.) The other thing I'd need is a good compressor, the best ones I've found are the Badger series. They keep noise to a minimum while offering the capacity you need.

 

Videos - Ork Painter Nerd is a good channel to follow, excellent technical execution on a variety of mediums and styles. Duncan Rhodes Painting Academy is interesting, very spirited approach to painting that inspires. Next Level Painting is entertaining, I get a lot out of his use of washes. Beyond those guys, just Google for what you are trying to do. My armies involve a lot of Black - Black Legion and Deathwatch - which is not always easy to pull off. Xenus Minis, Trovarion Miniatures, and Darren Latham Miniature Painting are on a list I keep specifically to remind myself about best practices with Black, watching them gets me focused.

 

Another thing to think about, given your interests, is conversions. While I will always have a fondness in my heart for Green Stuff, Procreate is so much better. It does not deform while curing and can be sanded. I'd buy at least one package of that for filling gaps along with a cheap set of metal sculpting tools off eBay.

 

Good luck!

[techsoldaten]

One last thing - my secret weapon for painting is Mr. Weathering. Their black makes it very easy to do panel lines, pin washes, and generally add contrast in the edges.

 

Could not imagine a painting setup without it. They also do a series of browns which are excellent for weathering large objects. I'd probably keep those on the list too. 

[Jolemai]

Look into a wet palette :tu:

[N1SB]

 

So while I've maintained my reading and interest in Warhammer, I've been out of the loop on painting for a long time, haven't really done any properly for many years now. This summer looks set to be a pretty firm stay-home break for me, so seems like an ideal time to venture into the basement, bust out some of my (many) unpainted models and get cracking. Hopefully to a better standard than in my youth too...

 

Having listened to your situation: try some GW Contrast paints.

 

You haven't been painting for a long time, have a huge backlog, are used to traditional brush painting techniques.  GW's new line of Contrast paints is essentially paint and shades in 1 coat (in fact, try NOT to do more than 1).  It's such a shortcut it feels like a cheat code.  You don't replace everything with Contrast, but I've replaced about half my painting with it.

 

1 warning - it works less well for flat surfaces.  I probably wouldn't use it for Space Marine pauldrons or vehicles...and even then, it depends on the situation.  You might want to test drive a pot, slap on 1 coat on a low priority mini, then put it aside and let dry.  It's a small thing that may or may not totally change the way you paint, but well worth trying in your situation.

[Arkhanist]

Oof. Having been through this myself a few years ago (long hiatus then a return to modelling and painting), a few pointers from my experience.

 

GW paint is not the cheapest per ml, by any measure. If you want equivalent standard paints but cheaper, then Army Painter is probably the best option for matching the sheer range of GW colours. The AP paints are decent quality, and around 1/3 cheaper by volume. However there are an utterly huge, stupendous amount of guides for painting citadel minis with citadel paints, including GW's own painting app and website. And despite starting back with a healthy amount of army painter paints (and smatterings of other ranges), I tend to reach for my ever-growing collection of GW paints simply because it's trivial to look up base, shade, highlight, final highlight for pretty much any colour and not have to try and work it out yourself. Especially coming back 'fresh', that help is not to be underestimated.

 

As N1SB says, the Contrast paints are also worth a good look. They combine basecoat and shading and a *little* bit of highlighting in one paint; it's a semi-translucent paint that goes over a near-white primer and is fairly unique. Combined with zenithal highlighting (which I'll get to in a minute) it really does speed up painting, a lot. Yes, you still need to use a bit of brush control, and do some final highlighting and details to really make it work - but for anything textured (flesh, cloth, leather, fur) it's just such a time saver it's my first choice; and I can easily paint entire models with nothing but contrast, a few highlights and normal metallics. The one case this isn't true for is models with lots of big curved plates. e.g. you *can* use it on space marines, but it does require quite a bit more work i.e. thinning. Yes, it's similar to glazing in principle; but as someone who's done a lot of glazing, the medium is pretty unique - it doesn't act like a glaze or a wash, but somewhere in between. They are pricy; but then you save on using several other paints.

 

Airbrushing is great. However it is not a trivial or cheap thing to get into, requires very different techniques from brush painting, and takes a bunch of time and effort to get good. Definitely worth it for doing things you can't do with a brush, and it's brilliant for priming/varnishing indoors, but I'd re-visit it a later point once you're comfortable with a hairy stick again, as that's still something you need to paint models with substantially even with an airbrush. There's a bunch of threads in this forum about good airbrushes for starting out with, so I won't repeat that now.

 

One of the nice things you can do with an airbrush is called "zenithal highlighting". Basically, you use a black primer from below, then spray a gray paint (or primer) from above and at about 45 degrees around the model, then plain white from directly above (or just two of the three for a less harsh zenithal) This lays out natural shadows and highlights in grayscale over the model, without doing any actual work. You can then use that to

a] paint normally, using the zenithal primer to guide your layers

or b] use contrast (or glazes, if you want to do a lot of layers) to add colour to the grayscale map already done, which boosts the Contrast effect.

 

You can do this almost as easily with just normal primer spray cans though, so an airbrush is not required. zenithal+contrast is basically how I paint most parts of most models now, and it's a huge time saver.

 

The one set of paints I don't recommend from GW is the metallics. There's a mix of newer ones, which are decent, and older ones, which are fairly trash. It's easier to just get metallics from army painter (good) or scale 75 (better, but more expensive) or darkstar (great, but terrible pots).

 

For any normal paints, such as basecoating or highlighting, buy or make a wet palette. Just Do It. It keeps the paint moist much longer, and makes get the paint the right consistency so much easier. Which brushes to go with is a hot topic, and there are many choices. Just not GW, they're seriously overpriced for what are fairly basic brushes. Maybe don't invest in top-of-the-line kolinsky sable to start with, as they require a fair amount of love and care to keep in good condition, and you don't want to accidentally destroy a £10 brush while rusty.

 

Duncan Rhodes did a lot of videos for GW, now he's freelance. Good place to start for painting tutorials in the GW style, but will go with non-GW products when they're better.

Edited May 19, 2021 by Arkhanist

[Arkhanist]

A couple more tips now I've thought of them.

 

If you do buy GW paints, especially the washes and Contrast, the taller pots are at more risk of getting knocked over and going everywhere - not using dropper bottles is the most annoying thing about citadel paint. I *highly* recommend getting an anti-spill bottle holder or two for your active pot - I use these pucks, but they're easy to 3d print or make out of mdf so there are many, many variants available locally wherever you are.

 

Do pick up a pot of Contrast medium though. Mixed 50/50 with washes (tested with citadel shades and army painter washes) turns them into 'super washes' that seek out crevices really, really well without staining the higher areas nearly as much. You can literally paint nuln oil (or dark tone) + contrast medium mix over a steel metallic and not need to do any other work on it. Also this combo works well as a 'preshade' over an offwhite primed model you're going to use Contrast on, if you don't (or can't) do a zenithal prime. I used to use army painter wash mixing medium for this, but Contrast medium works even better.

 

Painting handles are super-popular now, and for good reason. Again, there are many options; review link for the most common ones to see if any appeal. I personally use the redgrass games one now for models (along with some 3d printed custom caps for a brace, as my hands are a bit shaky), though for small parts I just pin them into a big cork.

Edited May 19, 2021 by Arkhanist

[sarabando]

an airbrush is hands down the most important hobby item i have received in the 26 years ive been hobbying. It has allowed me to finish more armies in the last 3 years than all the others combined. You can pick up a cheap brush and compressor for around £100 which is not that bad.

[Jason_In_Alaska]

an airbrush is hands down the most important hobby item i have received in the 26 years ive been hobbying. It has allowed me to finish more armies in the last 3 years than all the others combined. You can pick up a cheap brush and compressor for around £100 which is not that bad.

 

I agree with this but I think the barrier to entry with Airbrushes is less about cost and more about maintenance and upkeep. It is the reason I tell newbies to get a Harder & Steenbeck either evolution or infinity of some sort. Maintenance and upkeep of H&S airbrushes puts, Badger, Iwata/Mr.Hobby/Generic, Grex or Paasche to shame. I mean honestly the stupid engineering in Iwata airbrushes drives me nuts. 

[Thoridon]

As someone who also got back into the hobby after a long break, here are my suggestions:

 

1. Paints

Vallejo are great for getting back into painting, particularly the model colour range. Cheaper than Citadel paints, a dropper rather than their annoying flip lids and the paint quality is generally very good for an all-round acrylic. There are other brands like Scale 75, Kimera and so on which have different properties and excellent uses for display painting but as a workhorse paint you can't go wrong with Vallejo.

 

When it comes to metallic paints I highly recommend the Vallejo Metal Color (not the metallics from their normal ranges). The paint just goes on so smooth without the grainy pigment you tend to get with Citadel metallics.

 

As others have said, Citadel Contrast paints are fantastic for getting through armies, depending on what you want to paint. Rather than get a whole load I'd target specific things: I really like gulliman flesh for quickly doing loads of Imperial Guard faces, for example. A couple of colours could make a very quick and easy Tyranid colour scheme with their texture detail. Essentially anything with depth to it will be effective. Where I (personally) wouldn't use it is Space Marine armour and vehicles, as the bigger surfaces lack the texture to make it work properly and you end up with pooling.

 

2. Air Brush

These can often be a love it or hate it. From my perspective I find that an airbrush has been brilliant for Space Marine vehicles as you get a much smoother finish on the big flat surfaces than you could painting with a brush. That said, they do require plenty of cleaning so it's not something I like to use for smaller models with lots of colour switching. When it comes to a big tank or flier where I want a base layer and a couple of highlight coats I think they're fantastic. You can also use them effectively on anything like Marines or Tau that are mostly monocolour for batch painting the main colours of unit armour, then go in after with a brush for the details.

 

On the subject of brushes I'd try to get a few kolinsky sable brushes (a smaller, medium and large) for normal paints. They don't need to be W&N, there are plenty of cheaper sables out there that still give much better control than synthetics. But when it comes to metallic paints, save some heartache and use cheap synthetics.

 

3. Videos

As Bung said in the first reply, Vincent Venturella has a brilliant Hobby Cheating video series on Youtube. Hundreds of videos showing different things. Rather than "How to paint this model" it's more "How to paint effective skintones" or "How to create a good base". If there's anything you're not confident with he probably has a video on that topic with some tips.

[Shovellovin]

I’m going to echo what some other people have posted. I too returned to the hobby after a long hiatus. I left 40K at the beginning of 3rd edition and came back right before 8th edition was released. I don’t have children and I’m middle aged, so I have a lot more disposable income than I did when I was a teenager so if you’re not in the same boat, take my advice with a grain of salt. 
 

paints - GW has some great paints but IMO the kids seem designed to waste paint. GW paints are already expensive compared to other brands. Add in that you lose a lot of paint due to the container design and you’re looking at a hefty chunk of change being spent on paint. I use a mix of GW, Vallejo, Scale 75, FW inks and various oil paints. I’d recommend you star with Vallejo; dropper bottles are better than pots, hands down. Plus, Vallejo has an extensive range that has many GW equivalents (if you want the same colors as in the Warhammer tutorials). 
 

airbrush - get one. Don’t hesitate. Just do it. You’ll save loads of time even if all you do is use your airbrush for base coats.  Once you get the hang of it, an airbrush will become an invaluable tool. I started with the Master airbrush & compressor set on Amazon. I think it was $120. You’ll be amazed at how much you can do with an airbrush. There are plenty of videos online showing you the basics. Take advantage of them. 
 

video tutorials - tons and tons of content is out there. You’ll learn very quickly if you take the time to watch tutorials and practice. Don’t get stuck on using the exact shade of paint as your favorite tutorial, you’ll develop a style all your own. Focus on the techniques, not the exact shade of paint used by whomever you see online. 
 

welcome back! Remember, have fun and even though you may not paint as well as some of the other people here or elsewhere on the inter webs, if you keep at it, you feel a real sense of pride with your models when you see them all painted. 

Edited June 3, 2021 by Shovellovin

[Rik Lightstar]

Hi Tymell,

 

There's loads of great advice in here already.

 

To chime in on the point on paint brands

 

All ranges have some duds that can't be avoided and you may well find that you have a preference for one brand versus another over time be this down to how they flow, the consistency, the vibrancy of certain colours, the coverage, the pot/bottle style, how matte or gloss they are, or even just availability in your area. I'd say to try them all out over time, especially if you spot a colour that you really like.

 

For example loads of people rave over Scale 75, I'm not too fussed about them except Decayed Metal, which I'd happily pay twice the price for, because it's that good for coverage and giving a great base for any other metals. GW stuff is generally "fine", but again, Corvus Black is wonderful stuff as it gives a really nice VERY dark grey to use allowing you to still have black in recesses and give some "depth" to your blacks.

 

To give a more "Top Level" answer to your question about returning to painting

 

Well, for this I realised I was ending up with a really long wall of text, it's a great question and I think it deserves a really detailed answer for those who can be bothered to read it.

 

I'm going to get it down and formatted and then make a separate topic for it which I'll link to once it's done

 

EDIT: it's begun http://www.bolterandchainsword.com/topic/370536-advice-for-getting-started-with-or-returning-to-painting/

 

Rik

Edited June 3, 2021 by Rik Lightstar