Looks like we have embraced the Aquila

[Marcus_Iscariat]

As my title says it seems we have adopted the Aquila as our new EC has Aquila Rosary in his hand and the New Sword Brethren on the codex cover has it on his tilt shield.

[Acebaur]

As my title says it seems we have adopted the Aquila as our new EC has Aquila Rosary in his hand and the New Sword Brethren on the codex cover has it on his tilt shield.

 

We never not used it. Everyone loves to quote that ADB line but the real truth is he just thought it sounded cool.  That said, I'll be clipping the aquila off and putting a cross there :lol: 

[BLACK BLΠFLY]

Nothing wrong with it.

[BayOkuz]

Against the common knowledge, not all Black Templars are against the Aquila as a whole but, especially Chaplains and Inner Circle not prefer to wear it. There are a lot of examples in lore that Neophytes and Sword Brothers wear Aquila on the Chestplate. But the head of the Aquila is a cross.

 

But ınner Circle and Command structure along with veterans tend to choose no wear Aquila.

Edited August 17, 2021 by BayOkuz

[tvih]

Inner Circle? What, are we filthy Dark Angels now or something? :P 

[Brother Ramael]

Inner Circle? What, are we filthy Dark Angels now or something?

Oh come on, just because we occasionally misplace one or two of your cruisers...

[Medjugorje]

btw... you know that the lore hints more that it wasnt the loyal ones. The Ophidium Gulf was attacked by the traitor ones. 

[Marshal Reinhard]

It can be debated wether any dark angel is "loyal" :p

 

Regardless, there has not ever been a period where we didnt have aquila on our models. Gw and fw models both would have them

[Sword Brother Adelard]

Inner Circle? What, are we filthy Dark Angels now or something? :P

The inner circle of the Black Templars was established in Helsreach, and expanded upon in The Eternal Crusader.

 

Key members include:

 

High Marshal

Master of Sanctity

Reclusiarch

Master of the Forge

The Emperor's Champion (if one exists)

Sword Brethren

Dreadnoughts

Some high ranking serfs

 

The inner circle debated Grimaldus' succession of Mordred, and had a vote on it. Most backed Grimaldus, Bayard and Jurisian voted for Theodorich.

Edited August 17, 2021 by Brother Adelard

[Marshal Mattias]

I think the phrase "inner circle" is just a little misleading. It's the command structure of the chapter, and I don't think it's that different to many others aside from the titles used. Whether swordbrethren as a whole feature, I'm not sure. They make up part of the Marshal's household but beyond that...? It most likely comes down to the common theme of "ad-hoc" organisation - various crusades will have various levels of command briefing with different individuals in attendance.

 

None of this changes the fact that there is no single canon on either adhering to, or refusing to wear, the Aquila. There are only inconsistencies which boil down to personal choice.

Edited August 17, 2021 by Marshal Mattias

[Sword Brother Adelard]

The phrase 'inner circle' is used, because that's literally what ADB and Guy Haley called it.

[Halandaar]

Lower case inner circle as in the general concept of a small exclusive group who run things, not Inner Circle, the actual name of the organisation within the Dark Angels.

[Sword Brother Adelard]

Yes, that's pretty much the distinction.

[Acebaur]

Against the common knowledge, not all Black Templars are against the Aquila as a whole but, especially Chaplains and Inner Circle not prefer to wear it. There are a lot of examples in lore that Neophytes and Sword Brothers wear Aquila on the Chestplate. But the head of the Aquila is a cross.

 

But ınner Circle and Command structure along with veterans tend to choose no wear Aquila.

 

There's not really any evidence that I've found to support this

[redmapa]

I always thought it was a cheeky reference to the fact that none of our upgrade bits have an aquila, its either the wings plus a skull or a cross if Im not mistaken. 

[Closet Skeleton]

I always thought it was a cheeky reference to the fact that none of our upgrade bits have an aquila, its either the wings plus a skull or a cross if Im not mistaken. 

The wings are an aquila though, variations be damned. Most marine chest Aquila have a skull in place of the eagle heads and the original version had a gemstone.

[Marshal Mattias]

The phrase 'inner circle' is used, because that's literally what ADB and Guy Haley called it.

I was surprised to have forgotten this. You are quite right.

As I see you have discussed, this does indeed seem more like a description than a name.

Skimming back through the first few pages of Helsreach, there a mentions of:

 

"hierarchy of our most noble chapter"

"commanders of the Eternal Crusade"

"leader of our blessed chapter"

"a knight of the inner circle"

 

...all of which could reasonably be interpreted as synonyms for the same.

(Note the distinction of capitalisation for Eternal Crusade).

 

It certainly works as a descriptor, although I personally find it too intrinsicly indicative of the Dark Angels.

[lansalt]

 

The wings are an aquila though, variations be damned. Most marine chest Aquila have a skull in place of the eagle heads and the original version had a gemstone.

 

Are they? I thought the Aquila was the aquila (imperium icon since the start), the winged skull was the Imperialis (late heresy loyalist icon onwards), and other winged symbols are just their own custom thing (like the BA icon)

[Sword Brother Adelard]

How can we be sure it's an eagle without an eagle's head?

[Closet Skeleton]

How can we be sure it's an eagle without an eagle's head?

Can you differentiate birds of prey at that level of abstraction/stylisation?

 

 

 

 

The wings are an aquila though, variations be damned. Most marine chest Aquila have a skull in place of the eagle heads and the original version had a gemstone.

 

Are they? I thought the Aquila was the aquila (imperium icon since the start), the winged skull was the Imperialis (late heresy loyalist icon onwards), and other winged symbols are just their own custom thing (like the BA icon)

 

 

I have no idea about symbols that lexicanum has a single reference to from a Fantasy Flight Games sourcebook. Always used to be that it was Aquila armour and had wings on in but finding a chest piece with an actual eagle head on it was very rare.

 

You only got 1 two headed eagle chest piece on the sprues before they redid them in 7th ed and the original ones had none. So the lack of them on the BT sprue didn't differentiate them much from other chapters.

[Sword Brother Adelard]

 

How can we be sure it's an eagle without an eagle's head?

Can you differentiate birds of prey at that level of abstraction/stylisation?

 

 

No, it's 40k, even the fat little babies have feathery wings.

[Marcus_Iscariat]

 

 

 

How can we be sure it's an eagle without an eagle's head?

Can you differentiate birds of prey at that level of abstraction/stylisation?

 

 

 

 

 

The wings are an aquila though, variations be damned. Most marine chest Aquila have a skull in place of the eagle heads and the original version had a gemstone.

 

Are they? I thought the Aquila was the aquila (imperium icon since the start), the winged skull was the Imperialis (late heresy loyalist icon onwards), and other winged symbols are just their own custom thing (like the BA icon)

I have no idea about symbols that lexicanum has a single reference to from a Fantasy Flight Games sourcebook. Always used to be that it was Aquila armour and had wings on in but finding a chest piece with an actual eagle head on it was very rare.

 

You only got 1 two headed eagle chest piece on the sprues before they redid them in 7th ed and the original ones had none. So the lack of them on the BT sprue didn't differentiate them much from other chapters.

 

 

How can we be sure it's an eagle without an eagle's head?

Can you differentiate birds of prey at that level of abstraction/stylisation?  

 

 

The wings are an aquila though, variations be damned. Most marine chest Aquila have a skull in place of the eagle heads and the original version had a gemstone.

Are they? I thought the Aquila was the aquila (imperium icon since the start), the winged skull was the Imperialis (late heresy loyalist icon onwards), and other winged symbols are just their own custom thing (like the BA icon)

 I have no idea about symbols that lexicanum has a single reference to from a Fantasy Flight Games sourcebook. Always used to be that it was Aquila armour and had wings on in but finding a chest piece with an actual eagle head on it was very rare. You only got 1 two headed eagle chest piece on the sprues before they redid them in 7th ed and the original ones had none. So the lack of them on the BT sprue didn't differentiate them much from other chapters.

I had always inferred from the fluff and the fact that all Black Templar upgrades use the Imperialis or the Templar Cross instead of the Aquila that the convention was correct.

The Mark of Armour is classified as the Mk. VII Aquila Armour but pretty sure the Images always avoided the double headed eagle of the The Aquila on Black Templars.