Blood Angels Curse and the Genator-Magos'

[Minigiant]

When it comes to Blood Angels my knowledge is severely lacking.

 

1) How much would the Adeptus Mechanicus and their Genator-Magos' know about the curse before/during a founding from the Blood Angels?

 

2) Would it be reasonable for a Cursed Founding Chapter to be tampered with to try and fix their curse?

[Ayatollah_of_Rock_n_Rolla]

Lamenters were supposedly created in an attmept to "cure" the BA geneseed. The excerpt from IA9 Badab War Part One:

 

Addendum: The Cursed Founding and the Blood Angels Flaw

 

Named as one of the largest Foundings since the initial division of the Space Marine Legions in many sources, extant Inquisitorial reports tell that the Magos Biologis charged with overseeing the 21st Founding were either ordered or encouraged to attempt to refine, augment or otherwise enhance the gene-seed used to create the new Space Marine Chapters to be founded (although sources differ as to the extent of this practice). The wisdom in tampering with the Space Marine's genesis in this way appears to have been questioned, even at the time, and it is entirely possible that the full extent of the modifications performed were kept concealed even from the High Lords and Chapter Masters of the day -a theory easily given weight by the political turmoil and division that was widespread throughout the Imperium at the time. In the case of the Lamenters Chapter, the only Chapter known to have been created from the Blood Angels gene-seed in the 21st Founding, the efforts of the Magos Biologis seemed to have been geared in some way to removing or at least mollifying the so-called 'Sanguinius Flaw'. This flaw, whose true nature is known to very few outside the Blood Angels and their successors, taints this once most highly praised of the Emperor's Legions with a legacy of madness and slow descent into mindless fury. This degeneration, as much psychic as physical is a risk all Space Marines created with the Blood Angels gene-seed run; driving some into a terrible death-seeking madness that causes them to hurl themselves fearlessly at the foe, and be wracked it is said by a savage blood-hunger known as the Red Thirst. It is against this terrible affliction that the scions of Sanguinius must nobly strive to retain their sanity and their selfhood, so as to fulfil their oaths as the protectors of Mankind and the warriors in the Emperor's service. That use of the Blood Angels gene-seed was still pursued is both a testament to the glorious history of the Blood Angels themselves, and also to their gene- seed's other inherent strengths, which are not limited to its low rate of implant rejection and the aberrant factor that it produces by far the longest potential observed life spans of any Space Marine lineage. The Blood Angels themselves have long sought an answer to thein affliction, and it is likely that the experimental procedures performed on the Lamenters gene-seed during their creation were done with at least their progenitor's tacit approval. An inference perhaps born out by the fact that the Lamenters have always been recognisable in terms of organisation, ritual and special equipment as bearing the unique hallmarks of a Blood Angels Successor Chapter. The goal of reducing the effects of the flaw it seems at least initially was partly successful, with such records remaining showing that the number of the Chapter's brethren succumbing to the Red Thirst were very few. The counter to this success however, was that almost immediately certain idiosyncrasies of mind and temperament were noted within the Lamenters, factors that only grew more pronounced as the years passed: A dark melancholia seemed to take hold of the Chapter's soul and it was said of them by their fellow Blood Angels successors that they bore the grief of the loss of Sanguinius more keenly than any other, and in their hearts they heard the screams and sorrow of all the martyrs who cried out for vengeance across the cold stars. Whatever the truth of this, ill-fortune had already begun to follow the Lamenters liker an unwanted shadow, and by the end of M.36 it was already apparent that many of what had already become known as the Cursed Founding's children were succumbing to maladies and malevolencies as shocking as they were diverse. Given this and the fall from grace of many of the 21st's Founding's issue, the experimental procedures that created the Lamenters from the Blood Angel's gene-stock were not repeated, and the Chapter itself remains in its way unique in the Imperium's forces. As time has progressed since then, there has been a continued and observable increase both in the strange tendency for the macabre and melancholia that pervades the Chapter's psyche, and the Red Thirst which again has awakened in their ranks, slowly worsening, as by some reports it has, to varying degrees in all the Blood Angel's successors over time. Given the Chapter's most recent losses and the worsening maladies to which they are prey, it remains to be seen whether the Lamenters' long-term survival itself is now under question.

Edited August 26, 2021 by Ayatollah_of_Rock_n_Rolla

[Minigiant]

That is really cool thanks for sharing. Gives me a lot to work with

[Ayatollah_of_Rock_n_Rolla]

You're welcome. When it comes to the more recent times, Cawl tried to purify the BA gene-seed and initially it was thought that the Primaris  from the Ultima Founding are free from the Flaw. But then some time passed, yadda yadda it's back to normal.

[Minigiant]

I have no idea why this was moved. No wonder the Liber is dying. I want to talk about the intricacies of founding another cursed founding chapter of the Blood Angels alongside the Lamenters

 

You're welcome. When it comes to the more recent times, Cawl tried to purify the BA gene-seed and initially it was thought that the Primaris  from the Ultima Founding are free from the Flaw. But then some time passed, yadda yadda it's back to normal.

Which is a good thing, taking away a Chapers "tension" could take away a lot of their personality. Take for example the Relictors, they were once a Loyalist Space Marine Chapter with a dark edge to them. They were rumoured to have Daemonic Weapons and Artifacts. Then they get labelled Renegade and now they have lost their "edge".

Anyway the reason why I am asking about this is because I had an idea for a Khorne worshipping, Human sacrificing, Meso-American inspired Renegades. Inspired by these pieces. At the moment all I have got is  the curse made then anemic and that spiralled until drinking blood was their thing. I cut together a few things on how to begin.

 

 

Born from the clandestine experimentation of the 21st ‘Cursed’ Founding and the political turmoil and division rampant within the Imperium at the end of the 35th Millenium, the Red Hands of Kharneth were originally christened as the Carmine Cardinals by their creators. The High Lords of Terra and Adeptus Mechanicus sought to free the Blood Angels gene-seed from the so-called 'Sanguinius Flaw'. The gene-seeds flaw, whose true nature is known to very few outside the Blood Angels and their successors, would no longer taint this once most highly praised of the Emperor's Legions with a legacy of madness and slow descent into mindless fury. The Magus Biologis were however divided on how to proceed. 

The Magos Biologis found two options as to how to proceed with eradicating the flaw but even with the Blood Angels having long sought an answer to their affliction, it was determined unlikely that approval for experimental gene-seed procedures would be given to more than one Chapter. The progenitor was made aware of the creation of the Lamenters but were left uniformed of their stocked gene-seed’s use in another successor, ensuring no trace could lead the Blood Angels back to them. Rather, a cadre of Rainbow Warriors – deemed appropriate by virtue of their zealous nature and rigid adherence to the templates of the Codex Astartes - was assigned the task of leading the Carmine Cardinals through their first battlefields, while secretly reporting on the new Astartes’ idiosyncrasies and genetic purity.

[Xenith]

When it comes to Blood Angels my knowledge is severely lacking.

 

1) How much would the Adeptus Mechanicus and their Genator-Magos' know about the curse before/during a founding from the Blood Angels?

 

 

Bear in mind there are twin aspects to the BA: The 'Flaw', usually associated with the desire to drink, and apparently be rejuvinated by blood of the living, and the Curse, which is the Black Rage.

 

AdMech/others seem to know of the Red Thirst, the desire to drink blood, but this is baked into the BA gene code by the emperor himself, while the BA still try to keep the Black Rage a secret from the greater imperium...however every chaos sorcerer and his brother seems to know about it and spells to trigger it en-masse are readily found under the lazy plot device heading in Warp spell books.

[Ayatollah_of_Rock_n_Rolla]

 

I have no idea why this was moved. No wonder the Liber is dying. I want to talk about the intricacies of founding another cursed founding chapter of the Blood Angels alongside the Lamenters

 

You're welcome. When it comes to the more recent times, Cawl tried to purify the BA gene-seed and initially it was thought that the Primaris  from the Ultima Founding are free from the Flaw. But then some time passed, yadda yadda it's back to normal.

Which is a good thing, taking away a Chapers "tension" could take away a lot of their personality. Take for example the Relictors, they were once a Loyalist Space Marine Chapter with a dark edge to them. They were rumoured to have Daemonic Weapons and Artifacts. Then they get labelled Renegade and now they have lost their "edge".

 

Anyway the reason why I am asking about this is because I had an idea for a Khorne worshipping, Human sacrificing, Meso-American inspired Renegades. Inspired by these pieces. At the moment all I have got is  the curse made then anemic and that spiralled until drinking blood was their thing. I cut together a few things on how to begin.

 

 

Born from the clandestine experimentation of the 21st ‘Cursed’ Founding and the political turmoil and division rampant within the Imperium at the end of the 35th Millenium, the Red Hands of Kharneth were originally christened as the Carmine Cardinals by their creators. The High Lords of Terra and Adeptus Mechanicus sought to free the Blood Angels gene-seed from the so-called 'Sanguinius Flaw'. The gene-seeds flaw, whose true nature is known to very few outside the Blood Angels and their successors, would no longer taint this once most highly praised of the Emperor's Legions with a legacy of madness and slow descent into mindless fury. The Magus Biologis were however divided on how to proceed. 

The Magos Biologis found two options as to how to proceed with eradicating the flaw but even with the Blood Angels having long sought an answer to their affliction, it was determined unlikely that approval for experimental gene-seed procedures would be given to more than one Chapter. The progenitor was made aware of the creation of the Lamenters but were left uniformed of their stocked gene-seed’s use in another successor, ensuring no trace could lead the Blood Angels back to them. Rather, a cadre of Rainbow Warriors – deemed appropriate by virtue of their zealous nature and rigid adherence to the templates of the Codex Astartes - was assigned the task of leading the Carmine Cardinals through their first battlefields, while secretly reporting on the new Astartes’ idiosyncrasies and genetic purity.

 

 

Seems fine to me. There are loyalist BA successors practicing human sacrifice: Carmine Blades (initially did not know that are BA successors like your idea; currently trying to eradicate the custom) and Angels Vermillion (it is implied in BL books that this is the reason why Dante did not summon them to defence of Baal and dislikes them). Maybe also Flesh Eaters, but i don't know if they were "eating flesh" on the battlefield or ritually. So it's not that far of a leap. During Great Crusade, before reunification with Sanguinius BA were known for eating their enemies to terrorize them and for ritually eating fallen commanders to preserve their knowledge (Omophpagea sheningans; in this way the identity of the Legions commander, Ishidur Ossuros, was passed on until Sanguinius took over) - you might wish to build upon that.

 

 

Edited August 26, 2021 by Ayatollah_of_Rock_n_Rolla

[The Unseen]

It wasn't the fact that the Angels Vermillion were drinking blood, even the BA themselves drink wine spiked with mortal vitae, it was the industrialized and senseless slaughter of literally tens of thousands of imperial citizens to give them their blood for a couple decades.

Plus the horrific waste of having the high Sanguinary Priest kill himself by dumping all of his blood into the same mixture.

 

Rather than, idk, having a larger than normal complement of chapter serfs who donate a pint every other week or so.

With that and the following threat of giving puritanical members of the inquisition every dirty detail about all of Sanguinius' bloodline if they were censured for this.

 

Pretty clear the AV have pretty much gone off the deep end and are gonna end up like the Knights of Blood, but even worse. Since they have no problem effectively blackmailing the BA and EVERY successor chapter at once.

[Helias_Tancred]

Pretty clear the AV have pretty much gone off the deep end and are gonna end up like the Knights of Blood, but even worse. Since they have no problem effectively blackmailing the BA and EVERY successor chapter at once.

 

And on this note, I'd love access to lore that details which Blood Angel Legion characters founded and led which second founding chapters? Other than Amit and the Flesh Tearers.

[Xenith]

 

 

And on this note, I'd love access to lore that details which Blood Angel Legion characters founded and led which second founding chapters? Other than Amit and the Flesh Tearers.

 

 

Other than Raldoron and the Blood Angels, I believe that's literally the only lore on the matter!

[Closet Skeleton]

Horus Heresy Book 6: Retribution has a little on the Angels Vermillion and the name of their first Chapter Master but that's it for non-Flesh Tearers second founding chapters.