Black Templars FAQ thread (1st post updated 10/20/21)

[redmapa]

Maybe we could post these questions on reddit or on discord if there's one for the BT so others outside the forum can help send these questions throughout next week. 

[BitsHammer]

Maybe we could post these questions on reddit or on discord if there's one for the BT so others outside the forum can help send these questions throughout next week. 

I've shared it on the Black Templars Reddit page, and the Black Templar discord, but I think it might be good to cast a wider net after the book launches and reach out to r/warhammer and see if that gets the ball moving more before it goes in.

[Sword Brother Adelard]

I thought the section on the Emperor's champion not being a named character was pretty clear, and that strat seems almost designed for him.

[Tokugawa]

I think the questions should focus on blurry and conflicting rules problem. Focus on the questions which GW should answer and would like to answer.

 

Such like "Why my LRC can't transport primaris models" just made our BT players look acquisitive. And won't bring any reproductive result to us, from GW. Could I ask "Why my BT army can't beat Druks?" "Why my BT army are shot to pieces by Admech?"

[Marshal Reinhard]

Aquisitive, that's a good word. Or well I agree that you perhaps wanna tone down the "we want more options" angle... i dunno

 

There's a couple of questions I'd trim. Like the very first one is answered in the book in plain black and white. EC is not considered a named character, EC can thus use Heir of Sigismund.

 

I'd probably not ask the paragraph length one, or trim it. Focus it to be "Are sergeants of Intercessors squads and such considered Swordbrethren like with the crusader squad", then maybe lean in to armaments.

 

The Crusader squad armament question I feel on the one hand should really fair game though, as its not even cross kit, everything is the same kit. Ie, sword brother should be armable with chainsword, while it might be fair to give initiates access to the spare sword or axe INSTEAD of a powerfist or pyreblaster. If I WERE to hazard a guess why its only axe or sword though, my guess its because the cape included in the crusader kit doesn't lend itself to the arm positions of any of the chainswords. And GW don't want no little Timmy's who got just a crusader kit, to be unable to put something on the sword brother because it won't fit.

 

Land Raider and Primaris is a can of worms they just won't open in order to reply to this one mail, guaranteed. I'd remove it to increase the chances they answer the rest.

 

In nurgle's grip atm so brain not working at 100% capacity.

[Marshall Bretton]

Yeah questions about primaris using firstborn transports are pointless in general, it will never happen. It is clearly a marketing strategy so that as they do slowly release new transport models primaris players are forced to buy them. Their future sales would be lower if they allowed use of firstborn transports as half the player base would say they didn't need them.

 

Conscious I don't want to turn this into a debate about future releases etc though, I just want to highlight that it's a pointless question.

[Tokugawa]

Aquisitive, that's a good word. Or well I agree that you perhaps wanna tone down the "we want more options" angle... i dunno

 

There's a couple of questions I'd trim. Like the very first one is answered in the book in plain black and white. EC is not considered a named character, EC can thus use Heir of Sigismund.

 

I'd probably not ask the paragraph length one, or trim it. Focus it to be "Are sergeants of Intercessors squads and such considered Swordbrethren like with the crusader squad", then maybe lean in to armaments.

 

The Crusader squad armament question I feel on the one hand should really fair game though, as its not even cross kit, everything is the same kit. Ie, sword brother should be armable with chainsword, while it might be fair to give initiates access to the spare sword or axe INSTEAD of a powerfist or pyreblaster. If I WERE to hazard a guess why its only axe or sword though, my guess its because the cape included in the crusader kit doesn't lend itself to the arm positions of any of the chainswords. And GW don't want no little Timmy's who got just a crusader kit, to be unable to put something on the sword brother because it won't fit.

 

Land Raider and Primaris is a can of worms they just won't open in order to reply to this one mail, guaranteed. I'd remove it to increase the chances they answer the rest.

 

In nurgle's grip atm so brain not working at 100% capacity.

Didn't have hands touched on new crusader sprues, so don't know whether the recommended body of brethren directly compatible with fist part. If the joint sockets is not 100% compatible, though it may be easily assembled with some superglue, GW would treat it as "not recommended" configurations. This is the reason of why DG players can't give a flail to a plague marine squad champion.

[BitsHammer]

I thought the section on the Emperor's champion not being a named character was pretty clear, and that strat seems almost designed for him.

Traditionally he's been treated as a named character in the codex, so it's just good to get clarification.

 

As for some of the wargear options I'll revisit them once I get the box in my hands and get a better handle for the way the models build and what we can do with them. 

 

And I get the pessimism regarding some of the questions. I don't want to avoid providing feedback and telling them what people want, but I get what people say. It's a position I have mixed feelings on since GW tends to suffer from Ivory Tower syndrome and pushing things to them is much needed to get them to understand the kinds of things the community would like to see in the game beyond the competitive scene.

[Marshal Reinhard]

 

I thought the section on the Emperor's champion not being a named character was pretty clear, and that strat seems almost designed for him.

Traditionally he's been treated as a named character in the codex, so it's just good to get clarification.

Not needed. We have all the clarification we need on page 49. "Note that the Emperor's Champion is not considered to be a named character..."

[BitsHammer]

 

 

I thought the section on the Emperor's champion not being a named character was pretty clear, and that strat seems almost designed for him.

Traditionally he's been treated as a named character in the codex, so it's just good to get clarification.

Not needed. We have all the clarification we need on page 49. "Note that the Emperor's Champion is not considered to be a named character..."

 

Don't have the codex in hand yet (GW is notoriously bad with shipping pre-orders to me in a timely manner even if I manage to order within a minute of the pre-order opening in the US), so that's a page I haven't seen.

[Marshal Reinhard]

Don't have it either, making do with a very blurry photograph. It's on the page detaling warlord traits. It's doing some explaining about helbrechts and grimaldus wlt.

 

I suppose it highlights that we shouldn't send any mail whatsoever before we had a good reliable read of the entire thing.

[a_typical_hero]

I got my codex yesterday and I can confirm it.

 

The box titled "Named Characters and the Emperor's Champion" got the italic text saying "If one of the following characters gains a Warlord Trait, they must have the one shown below. Note that The Emperor's Champion is not considered to be a named character, but the Cenobyte Servitors in Chaplain Grimaldus' unit are considered named characters."

 

In addition, the EC got the special rule "Holy Wargear" which says "This model can never be given any Relics.", which would not be needed, as named characters can't take them to begin with.

 

If anybody got any questions regarding the codex, feel free to ask.

 

I want to reiterate here, that Paragon of Fury does not need a FAQ.

 

The WT got two parts, which are independent from each other. It literally says:

Paragon of Fury

- Add 1 to the Warlord's strength characteristic.

- Each time you...

[BitsHammer]

Don't have it either, making do with a very blurry photograph. It's on the page detaling warlord traits. It's doing some explaining about helbrechts and grimaldus wlt.

 

I suppose it highlights that we shouldn't send any mail whatsoever before we had a good reliable read of the entire thing.

Yeah, I agree that it's definitely important to wait longer since the book is apparently not completely out in the wild atm.

 

And Paragon of Fury definitely needs an FAQ since people who have the book kept reading it wrong so we just need GW to go "no, that's not how it works" so people stop trying to read it that way.

[Medjugorje]

Primaris crusader squad:

 

I am not sure how  the sentance is to read. 

 

"up to 2 models can replace...."

 

for 1...

 

 

Does it mean one Initiate can have a fist and another one a flamer OR 2  in any combination. For me it sounds like 2 fists are allowed or 2 Flamer are allowed or a mix between both.

[Sword Brother Adelard]

And what's wrong with that..? That sounds fine to me?

[a_typical_hero]

Primaris crusader squad:

 

I am not sure how  the sentance is to read. 

 

"up to 2 models can replace...."

 

for 1...

 

 

Does it mean one Initiate can have a fist and another one a flamer OR 2  in any combination. For me it sounds like 2 fists are allowed or 2 Flamer are allowed or a mix between both.

Any combination. That's the usual wording used everywhere else as well. For example see Vanguard Veterans.

[Marshal Reinhard]

Primaris crusader squad:

 

I am not sure how  the sentance is to read. 

 

"up to 2 models can replace...."

 

for 1...

 

 

Does it mean one Initiate can have a fist and another one a flamer OR 2  in any combination. For me it sounds like 2 fists are allowed or 2 Flamer are allowed or a mix between both.

You're correct. You can get two of either or one of each. If you get a full 20 squad, you can do any manner of combination for up to 4 models.

[Palmu]

Here's a strange question, which...Is probably more of a Space Marine question, but it specifically applies to us. I'm not sure if it's been asked yet, my quick search on google at least showed that it has not been FAQ'd by GW. So...

 

The Stratagem Commanding Oratory goes as follows: "...Select one unit from your army that has not recited a litany this turn. That model can recite one litany that has not already been recited by a friendly model this turn. That litany is automatically inspiring ( do not roll) and takes effect until the start of your next Command phase.

 

Note, in comparison to all other mentions of reciting litanies, for example the Master of Sanctity ability:

 

"if this model is on the battlefield, it can recite one additional litany it knows that has not already been recited by a friendly model that turn."

 

Note the difference? Commanding Oratory does not say you must recite a litany you KNOW. Just that you can recite one litany that has not been recited by a friendly model this turn.

 

Does it then mean, that a Chaplain using Commanding Oratory can recite any litany of battle that has not been recited, even if he does not know it? And more importantly for BT, does it mean that a BT chaplain can recite any litany from both litanies of battle, and litanies of the devout? 

[redmapa]

Im pretty sure thats already FAQd to mean that the Chaplain can only recite litanies it knows, it was also FAQd to mean this in the GK codex. 

[Medjugorje]

somebody in facebook said its wrong but he already answered that my opinion was correct

 

I had the game right now - but my crusader squad was used to screen my backfield because Necrons always use Veil of Darkness. Because I think a ten men squad with two fists is never wrong^^

[Marshal Valkenhayn]

Just a note, Fervent is misspelled in both Qs related to it. The language of the question about Crusader Squad upgrades should also clarify that these options are meant to join the other squad upgrades, such as power fists and flamers. 

 

I'd also drop the question about LR crusaders and potentially even the question about changing all SGT models to SB. We need actual rules updates and little changes more than multiple model updates.

[BitsHammer]

I put off actually sending this in due to a lot of people not having full access to the rules, so I feel continuing to collect FAQs for a mass submission by multiple people is still the correct action, though we definitely have longer thanks to the codex's wider release not coming for around a month.

 

WARHAMMER 40,000

Q: Does the Emperor's Champion Holy Wargear rule prevent him from gaining Crusade Relics?

 

Q: If I use the Shock and Awe stratagem from Codex: Space Marines does it prevent me from using the Shock and Awe stratagem in Codex Supplement Black Templars and vice versa?

  

Q: Paragon of Fury reads that the character who makes a charge gains +1 strength. Is this correct? 

 

Q: If so is the strength increase from the warlord trait Paragon of Fury permanent for the rest of the battle?

 

Q: Is strength increase from the warlord trait Paragon of Fury cumulative?

 

Q: Do Grimaldus' Cenobyte Servitors count as Character models for the purposes of rules such as Look Out, Sir! or secondary objectives such as Assassinate?

 

Q: Do Relic Bearers upgrades count as relics for the purposes of the Master-crafted Relic rule?

 

Q: For clarification: does an enemy shooting through dense cover suffer the -1 to hit when targeting a Black Templars unit under the Uphold the Honour of the Emperor Vow?

 

Q: As Devout Push is written it allows units affected to embark onto a transport at the end of their normal move. Is this working as intended?

 

Q: Sword Brethren have access to Astartes chainswords, but the Sword Brother in the Primaris Crusader can not. Is this intentional design despite their being enough Astartes chainswords in the kit?

 

Q: There are extra power swords and power axes in the Crusader kit left over after building the Sword Brethren. Is it possible for these to be made available to the Initiates in the squad in addition to the weapon options they already have access to?

 

KILL TEAM

Q: Is there plans to include a Crusader Squad or Sword Brethren Squad in Kill Team to reflect the updated models?

[Acebaur]

I was about to query the named characters thing, as traditionally the answer was in the points list, and the EC was listed under 'Named Characters' but in the supplement he's simply listed as a HQ, (as all three are.) So RAW, he's arguably not a named character...?

 

He is specifically not a named character. It is in the book under the WLT section. 

[Acebaur]

In an effort to get GW to answer some question I felt it was a good idea for us to collectively pool them so everyone submitting questions to 40kfaq@gwplc.com can hit the same points so we can hopefully see some of them answered. My intent is to collect questions through the week and send them in when the codex officially releases next weekend.

 

I put off actually sending this in due to a lot of people not having full access to the rules, so I feel continuing to collect FAQs for a mass submission by multiple people is still the correct action, though we definitely have longer thanks to the codex's wider release not coming for around a month. 

 

In an effort to get GW to answer some question I felt it was a good idea for us to collectively pool them so everyone submitting questions to 40kfaq@gwplc.com can hit the same points so we can hopefully see some of them answered. 

 

WARHAMMER 40,000

Q: Does the Emperor's Champion Holy Wargear rule prevent him from gaining Crusade Relics?

They are considered relics, so no

 

Q: If I use the Shock and Awe stratagem from Codex: Space Marines does it prevent me from using the Shock and Awe stratagem in Codex Supplement Black Templars and vice versa?

You can't. The rules are specific about stratagems of the same name

  

Q: Paragon of Fury reads that the character who makes a charge gains +1 strength. Is this correct? 

I fail to see why this is ambiguous 

 

Q: If so is the strength increase from the warlord trait Paragon of Fury permanent for the rest of the battle?

RAW yes, but I believe this does need a FAQ 

Q: Is strength increase from the warlord trait Paragon of Fury cumulative?

 

Q: Do Grimaldus' Cenobyte Servitors count as Character models for the purposes of rules such as Look Out, Sir! or secondary objectives such as Assassinate?

Again RAW yes but I think it's not intended so needs a FAQ

 

Q: Do Relic Bearers upgrades count as relics for the purposes of the Master-crafted Relic rule?

No, they are upgrades, despite the name. Same exact thing as Cryptek upgrades in Necrons

 

Q: For clarification: does an enemy shooting through dense cover suffer the -1 to hit when targeting a Black Templars unit under the Uphold the Honour of the Emperor Vow?

This also does actually need a FAQ because it's listed differently in two places of the codex

 

Q: As Devout Push is written it allows units affected to embark onto a transport at the end of their normal move. Is this working as intended?

 

Q: Sword Brethren have access to Astartes chainswords, but the Sword Brother in the Primaris Crusader can not. Is this intentional design despite their being enough Astartes chainswords in the kit?

 

Q: There are extra power swords and power axes in the Crusader kit left over after building the Sword Brethren. Is it possible for these to be made available to the Initiates in the squad in addition to the weapon options they already have access to?

 

KILL TEAM

Q: Is there plans to include a Crusader Squad or Sword Brethren Squad in Kill Team to reflect the updated models?

 

Answered most of your questions for you. Most of them do not need a FAQ 

 

The last two aren't FAQ material either tbh. They specifically gave us the options we did for a reason. There are "leftover" weapons because you get 2 sets of the same sprue. 

 

KT is a completely different game, why are we emailing the FAQ team about this?

[Sword Brother Adelard]

 

 

I was about to query the named characters thing, as traditionally the answer was in the points list, and the EC was listed under 'Named Characters' but in the supplement he's simply listed as a HQ, (as all three are.) So RAW, he's arguably not a named character...?

He is specifically not a named character. It is in the book under the WLT section.

We hadn't seen that page when I posed that question. Its pretty clear now.