Spoiler Warning - Hammer and Bolter Episode 6 - AMAZING

[Vinny]

Just saw that Episode 6 of Hammer and Bolter on Warhammer+, with the aeldari.

 

Holy crap, such bold writing. I love the direction GW is going with their writing. 

 

So Ultramarine 5th Company now committing atrocities against Craftworld Aeldaris? And they are all Primaris (suggesting this was post-Guilliman resurrection.)

 

I thought there was a truce between Imperium and Craftworld Aeldaris and Ynnaris? Or did 5th Company go rogue?

 

What an amazing show, they need a full, annual 20-episode season of this show. Hands down, the best offering on Warhammer+. Very much like Love, Death, Robot. Awesome format for the 40k world. 

[Captain Idaho]

I'm fairly concerned by the all Primaris part. It either heralds an intention to completely move the Chapter in that direction or it means Hammer and Bolter will take fluff liberties.

 

However, atrocities against Eldar? Nah that's just doing the Emperor's work! ;)

[Lord_Ikka]

 

I thought there was a truce between Imperium and Craftworld Aeldaris and Ynnaris? Or did 5th Company go rogue?

 

No truce as such, Gulliman just has directed his efforts more towards active threats to the Imperium, such as the Great Rift Chaos warbands, Death Guard invasion of Ultramar, and various Ork/Necron assaults. The Aeldari helped him resurrect, but that isn't widely known and it seems that he is giving them a little leeway by not actively attacking them often.

[BLACK BLΠFLY]

No love for eldar here. Episode was amazingly Terribad.

Edited October 29, 2021 by Black Blow Fly

[Captain Idaho]

Filthy Xenos... my heart is like ice to their plight.

[BLACK BLΠFLY]

I drink their tears and laugh.

[Prot]

The Xenos hate is more than welcome but... is it a decent episode to watch? Entertaining?

[BLACK BLΠFLY]

It really depends.

[techsoldaten]

Wasn't sure if the op was being ironic.

 

Maybe I'm not the audience, this just wasn't entertaining. Felt a little hyper, there's too much going on.

 

To each their own. 

[Vinny]

The Xenos hate is more than welcome but... is it a decent episode to watch? Entertaining?

 

Yeah, I can definitely recommend this show. Solid episode. Love the voice acting, the sound effects, and music. 

 

Hopefully in the future they clean up the drawings a bit, but otherwise I can't wait until the next 3 episodes release.  

 

IMDB shows the season finale is titled "Cadia Stands." I am prepared.

[BLACK BLΠFLY]

Let’s keep the general discussion Ultramarines related. I watched the episode, didn’t like it… must have been written by an elder fanboi.

[Vinny]

So looking into the lore, it seems the 5th Ultramarines Company might not have much contact with Ultramar higher command structure: "Fighting far from Ultramar for years or even decades at a time, 5th Company strike forces tend to be self-reliant warrior fraternities who may fight together over the course of multiple campaigns without ever seeing another Ultramarine. Those who survive the rigors of their long crusades build unbreakable bonds of loyalty and comradeship that are symbolized by the shared campaign badges proudly displayed upon their armor and standards." (per Lexicanum, dunno how accurate this lore.)

 

It's possible then that the 5th Company did go rogue or didn't get the memo to prevent huge escalation of violence against Craftworld Aeldari.

 

Also possibly that the unnamed Craftworld was not aligned with Ynnari faction, and are fair game for Ultramarines. 

 

Very interesting lore path. 

[Vinny]

I'm fairly concerned by the all Primaris part. It either heralds an intention to completely move the Chapter in that direction or it means Hammer and Bolter will take fluff liberties.

 

However, atrocities against Eldar? Nah that's just doing the Emperor's work!

 

Seems like they're going for a Witcher-style of writing, which is very dark and gritty. No good guys except for very select few named characters (in this case probably no good guys, period.) Also likely Imperium and Space Marines were always committing atrocities like this, we just never saw it tangibly displayed in animation form and only read about it in obscure books. 

 

Overall, definitely takes the lore deeper than its miniature-game roots. I approve! 

[Charybdis]

It should probably be noted that the story is from the Aeldari perspective so the Ultramarines are the antagonists. I thought it was phenomenally done where the lethality of the Emperors finest was really well shown.

Even the usual 'For the Emperor' type phrases which I always thought sounded rather inspiring and heroic when viewed from the Imperial perspective sounds utterly terrifying when seen from the side of the Xenos.

 

Isn't there a move in the lore to have the Primaris be a lot more merciless and inhumane than the first born?

I think it was in the last Uriel Ventris novel that a first born brother remarks that he has become a lot more merciless after crossing the rubicon. Possible reason for all Primaris here?

 

I'd have to agree with the OP for anyone who hasn't seen it, highly recommended. 

[Captain Idaho]

I don't recall reading that but it could be a thing. Interesting to know if that's the case. Weren't Thunder Warriors more brutal and aggressive beasts too, so maybe the genetic adjustments Cawl made were pilfered from the Emperor's work on the Thunder Warriors?

[Charybdis]

I don't recall reading that but it could be a thing. Interesting to know if that's the case. Weren't Thunder Warriors more brutal and aggressive beasts too, so maybe the genetic adjustments Cawl made were pilfered from the Emperor's work on the Thunder Warriors?

In 'The Swords of Calth' (Uriel Ventris novel) it's noted how different Ventris is behaving now he's Primaris.

 

Not so much aggressive as cold and calculating. I think the premise is that with even more power the Primaris have become even further removed from their humanity (i.e empathy/compassion) than first born astartes. 

 

No idea if this is going to become a new direction for Primaris or if it's just Graham McNeill going off on a tangent with Uriel. If it is going to become established lore then the Iron Hands will be bloody terrifying. 

[Captain Idaho]

It would give a genuine conflict point between Astartes to emphasise that. I'd approve, especially if Firstborn went a bit rogue and got a separate Codex for a separate faction...

[lansalt]

I found the inclusion of the UM 5th company made up of primaris nonsensical, unless the story is set way after the Indomitus crusade, Plague Wars, Vigilus, etc. The "Wardens of the Eastern Fringe" should be too busy to chase a Craftworld full of civilians without a clear objective, do warcrimes, and leave there the bodies of dozens of brothers, their captain, a dreadnough, and the company banner (!).

 

I suspect this tale was originally envisioned with firstborn marines set in the past, but was later changed to feature primaris for marketing reasons.

Edited November 11, 2021 by lansalt

[Captain Idaho]

Wait, did they lose? They lost a Captain as well? So Galenus?

[Charybdis]

Wait, did they lose? They lost a Captain as well? So Galenus?

Not lose, the Craft World was righteously purged in the Emperors name, but the Aeldari got a few kicks in before we saw them off. 

 

It didn't specify the captains name, just that it was an Indomitus captain. 

 

To be honest I think there's going to be a few lore inconsistencies between Hammer and Bolter and Black Library/Codex's etc. 

[Prot]

The story really wasn’t that memorable for me. I mean it was entertaining, but entirely the type of Craftworld dribble you’d expect from Eldar. 
 

I believe ADB wrote that episode. I think at one point the Eldar bring in an Avatar of Khaine. There’s a lot of angry marines blowing them away but I don’t recall what the cause of the event was… perhaps intentionally vague.  

[MegaVolt87]

The story really wasn’t that memorable for me. I mean it was entertaining, but entirely the type of Craftworld dribble you’d expect from Eldar. 

 

I believe ADB wrote that episode. I think at one point the Eldar bring in an Avatar of Khaine. There’s a lot of angry marines blowing them away but I don’t recall what the cause of the event was… perhaps intentionally vague.

 

SMH, you thin-bloods forget your legion heratige. Do you really need a valid excuse to do some xenos purging? ;) Like xenos would abide by diplomacy anyways.

 

Can't fight aspect warriors if they never get the chance to train. *5th co UM Captain taps head.*

[crazyterran]

The Primaris leader that died in the episode was a lieutenant if I recall?

[Prot]

The Primaris leader that died in the episode was a lieutenant if I recall?

 

Well the Emperor knows we got plenty more of those, don't we?!?!

 

I've always believed since old history classes that a tale of war is always extremely skewed by the teller of the tale. This is no exception, and I believe it is an intentional bias injected into 40K fiction because it becomes very easy to say, 'well that never happened', and move on ignoring a moment in 'history'.

 

Case and point: I'm reading the third Ultramarines Blight novel... vs. Deathguard (Post Indomitus). It is taking place in a fairly recent area of time.

 

I don't want to spoil anything big, BUT just for the sake of this conversation let's say the Eldar are (reluctantly) respected, yet still simultaneously despised by Guilliman and the Ultramarines (new and old alike). 

 

There is a very shaky peace accord of sorts I believe, but we all know how those work (if history serves us).

[Captain Idaho]

Yeah it is worth noting that siding with Eldar and other Xenos against common enemies doesn't mean they are now friends. It's a binary attitude, either friend or foe, that misses the complexity of relationships and pragmatism.

 

It's quite possible Ultramarines will defend Ichar IV alongside Eldar and still hate their guts and want to kill them at a later date.

 

And to me the Eldar are possibly the worst Xenos in many ways. They aren't honest in their intentions or actions and utterly egocentric and self serving. Least Orks and Tyranids are honest in their endeavours and predictable for it. The Eldar choose to be the way they are on many levels whilst Orks and Tyranids are at least slaves to their natures.

 

Sorry about that but I feel there aren't enough Xenos hating rants on the board anymore! We used to shoot them on site but now we let them post army lists! ;)