Iron tenth allied detachment

[GodEmperorOfMankind]

Hey all, I'm making an allied detachment for iron hands that consists of a squad of breacher, a squad of immortals and a heavy support squad for some firepower, with a siege breaker attached to them. @1k points that's about the size of them, and @1.5k add 2 land raiders and a rhino.

 

Makes a nice allied detachment, my question is what to run the H support squad with?

 

I was thinking MM for some nice anti armour option, but would plasma or lascannons bet a better option?

 

Plans are to use company of bitter iron RoW to make them a primary detachment at some point, and add apothecaries in a ZM setting.

[Lautrec the Embraced]

Not a IH player here but considering Heavy Support squad - I have never seen a Multi melta squad.but maybe I'm left in the dark. Price tag's not that bad but the range is a problem. Footslogging won't cut it.

 

Lascannons are of course the premium tank hunting choice but at 20 pts per model... well, it's a big investment but they'll tackle anything short of Spartan with an added Siege Breaker. But better hide them somewhere safe.

 

Plasma cannon are in my opinion too expensive and somehow counterproductive to Breaker's buffs.

 

Budget choice would be cheaper missiles or autocannons. Launcher is a flexible weapon that can also shoot at infantry. Autocannons may be somewhat underwhelming in HH but Siege Breakers does wonders on them; they won't penetrate as often but they are better at stripping hull points than missiles against any target softer than Land Raider. 

 

So, the question is: what do you expect them to do? How should they augment your main detachment? Want them to target  tough LRaiders or just vehicles in general?

[GodEmperorOfMankind]

Hey cheers for the response.

 

The MMs I was hoping to tackle any hard armour, generally kill off any vehicles or dreads, or scary the holy hell out of any infantry.

 

The rhino was to circumvent the range issues, I'd probably only run the 1000pt list in ZM where range isnt a problem.

 

Im not attached to the H support squad, or the siege breaker, they're there to round out the points for an allied detachment. I have a squad of breachers and immortals, and without making a primary detachment I wanted to be able to run them.

 

If anyone has any suggestions on a better way of running those 2 units I'm open to it, just don't tell me to drop either because I like them. Yeah I know breachers are poor compared to vets etc. I like breachers :)

 

Cheers

[Lautrec the Embraced]

I mean, HSupport is pretty thematic for IH; Multi-meltas may be appealing but it's a bonkers move imo, as Rhino is hardly a real protection in HH and they would have to snapfire after disembarkation anyways. And armoured ceramite will likely be purchased for the toughest vehicles. Maybe for ZM...

 

I'd say pick Las if it's hard armour that you're after. Autocannons are only good for light armour and missiles can't explode stuff.

Edited November 2, 2021 by Lautrec the Embraced

[LameBeard]

Can I just put in a suggestion of heavy flamers if it’s for ZM? And then to deal with dreadnoughts: as much grav, meltabombs, powerfists and melta or combi melta as can be squeezed into the list?

 

If you are thinking about ZM force you already have your compulsory troops and elites so you can choose anything really, right? Doesn’t even have to be infantry? Or do you already have the models? Because If you like breachers you could run … more breachers?

[GodEmperorOfMankind]

I was thinking heavy flamers, because well, heavy flamers! :D but wouldn't I struggle against harder targets like termies and such? Also then what would my siege master do?

 

I was trying to build a well rounded force that I could expand on at some point. I could do more breacher, but I have plenty of them in other legions already.

 

Lascannons for the h support is an option, will they work in zm as well as in a regular game?

[LameBeard]

Yeah I think Siege Breaker gets downgraded to Centurion or Delgatus in that list. I see what you mean - in ZM what to take against terminators. And what fears the lascannons? Ironically I’m coming round to multi-meltas: bring pain to terminators and Dreadnoughts in ZM where range is not an issue!

[GodEmperorOfMankind]

That's what I figured, and out of zm stick them in a rhino following behind the landraiders

[Unknown Legionnaire]

Can't take a Delegatus in an allied detachment though. Boop.

 

What's your primary detachment ???

 

IF you are planning to expand it to a full-fledged primary detachment ('Bitter Iron') of its own at one point anyways, go for the following:

 

Praetor  (otherwise no RoW for you in an allied detachment)

Immortals as troops via 'Bitter Iron'

Termite Assault Drill (for the Praetor & the Immortals)

Lascannon Heavy Support Squad.

 

But note that you won't get the 'Immortal Hatred' buff in an allied detachment !! 

[LameBeard]

Can't take a Delegatus in an allied detachment though. Boop.

Ah! Because he has to be the Warlord unless his Primarch is present - good spot.

 

But I was assuming in ZM this would not be an allied detachment, but the only detachment, because 1000 points is fine for ZM, and so is one troops choice on the ZM org chart. I should have spelt that out, maybe it’s a wrong assumption - maybe you like big ZM games!?

[GodEmperorOfMankind]

Lamebeard has the right thought, in ZM it'll be a force of its own for the most part (unless I end up with a massive ZM game).

 

Primary detachment is currently fists, with breachers and warders as their troops (mainly).

 

Yeah I was looking at bitter iron Row if they went full primary (you never go full primary).

 

At that point is was gonna be apothecaries for the squads, and find a way of transporting squads larger than 10 without a spartan or kharybdis. Are you saying termites can do that?

Also what about the gorgons head for a Row?

 

Support squads of graviton sounds nice

[Bung]

Termites can carry 12 Power Armoured models.

[GodEmperorOfMankind]

Guess I know what's going on my Christmas list then! :D

[Gorgoff]

Guess I know what's going on my Christmas list then!

Great model although the interior is very disappointing.

But who paints that anyway?  

Nice rules, too. 

[GodEmperorOfMankind]

I paint interiors, black. :D

 

It's a shame they don't allow for land raider crusaders really, they can transport 12 right?

 

I'm gonna stick with MMs on the heavy support squad I reckon, in ZM they'll be good, and in larger games I'll have them as allies and the primary detachment will have some heavier anti tank support.

 

Just gotta get what I have painted, and buy the rest I guess!

 

Termites can't be taken as dedicated transports can they, FA slots right?

[Bung]

Land Raider Crusaders could carry 16 models but werent invented im the Heresy.

 

Termites can be taken as a dedicated transport for Destroyer Squads, for everyone else its a FA choice.

[Gorgoff]

HSS with MM are in ZM even worse to be honest.

You want a mobile unit there and not some fixed squad.

 

I dare to say that MM HSS are only viable for RG and AL because of infiltrate and any army who either gets scout or infiltrate by any source.

Otherwise they are not very good.

 

Lascannon HSS can shoot from turn one but are very expansive. I'd take missle launchers instead.

[Lucien Eilam]

Have you considered volkite? In Zone Mortalis, there’s only light armour to shoot at. In Spartan Town, HSSs are rarely the most efficient or effective anti-tank choice whatever they’re armed with, so you may as well build them to excel at a different job.

 

Even if a culverin squad has to move, 40 shots at S6 with deflagrate and tank hunters will kill 2-3 Marines or a Javelin. When they don’t move, it’ll delete whole squad(ron)s.

 

And either way, they’ll look cool doing it.

Edited November 4, 2021 by Lucien Eilam

[GodEmperorOfMankind]

Aren't missile launchers heavy as well, so the same issue as MMs and Lascannons? I was thinking about H flamers, or volkite, but they don't pack enough of a punch against the inevitable dreads or termies in ZM.

 

I was planning on having the immortals taking volkite tbf

[Lucien Eilam]

If you’re specifically targeting Terminators and Dreadnoughts in Zone Mortalis, I’d probably think about Tactical Support with plasma or melta, or Seekers with combi weapons, ahead of any variety of Heavy Support Squad.

 

Either of those squads would still work great in big games coming out of a Termite.

[GodEmperorOfMankind]

That's a good shout actually, I might take meltas rather than MMs.

[LameBeard]

They’d be scoring too.

[GodEmperorOfMankind]

Cheers guys, tactical support squad it is then!