9x19 Parabellum Posted October 18, 2021 Share Posted October 18, 2021 The more I think about this, the more I realize what is driving me nuts is the 40 mm bases. I absolutely can't stand it. I have a unit of 10 veteran interecessors that were painted in advance to be sword brethren if/when a codex ever came out. Now I either have to rebase them and commit them to being Sword Brethren and NOT use them as veteran intercessors, or else leave them as is and not be able to use them as SB. It makes zero sense that they should be on 40mm bases when they have the same statline as a basic primaris dude. tychobi, Marshal Loss and Medjugorje 3 Back to top Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/372588-sword-brethren-loadout/page/4/#findComment-5754707 Share on other sites More sharing options...
tvih Posted October 18, 2021 Share Posted October 18, 2021 It is a bit of a strange decision for sure. They do take up a lot of board space, which can be both a curse and a blessing. It certainly does make it harder to, say, use them as the Sword Brother for an Assault Intercessor squads as well. I suppose one "reasonable" way to do it would be to magnetize them to their bases, but that could also just be my magnet addiction talking. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/372588-sword-brethren-loadout/page/4/#findComment-5754711 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Palmu Posted October 18, 2021 Share Posted October 18, 2021 I do find the minimum size of 4 strange. What's even the purpose, or is it some kind of a remnant from how marine units usually have 1-4 dudes + 1 Sergeant-equivalent, and they just deleted the line that adds a Sergeant into the unit...? Now that I think on it, that's actually the most likely outcome. No mysteries, just good ol' GW incompetence. It's because one of the models can be made into a Castellan. Once again my hatred of GW has blinded me to the truth. Though this is just starting to remind me of Todd Howard memes, now they're sneaking Skyrim Primaris Lieutenants into boxes of other units. Khornestar 1 Back to top Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/372588-sword-brethren-loadout/page/4/#findComment-5754745 Share on other sites More sharing options...
BitsHammer Posted October 18, 2021 Share Posted October 18, 2021 I do find the minimum size of 4 strange. What's even the purpose, or is it some kind of a remnant from how marine units usually have 1-4 dudes + 1 Sergeant-equivalent, and they just deleted the line that adds a Sergeant into the unit...? Now that I think on it, that's actually the most likely outcome. No mysteries, just good ol' GW incompetence. It's because one of the models can be made into a Castellan. Once again my hatred of GW has blinded me to the truth. Though this is just starting to remind me of Todd Howard memes, now they're sneaking Skyrim Primaris Lieutenants into boxes of other units. I mean I'd probably get at least one box to make a Castellan and then the other four to be conversion parts to replace Sergeants in other units like Intercessors. MegaVolt87 and Khornestar 2 Back to top Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/372588-sword-brethren-loadout/page/4/#findComment-5754746 Share on other sites More sharing options...
a_typical_hero Posted October 18, 2021 Share Posted October 18, 2021 Yep, same with Sanguinary Guard. Min 4 models as one guy is supposed to become an Ancient. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/372588-sword-brethren-loadout/page/4/#findComment-5754818 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marshall Bretton Posted October 18, 2021 Share Posted October 18, 2021 On a fluff side I found it interesting that gw specified in the book that there is a distinction between veterans and sword brethren. Veterans are fairly like other chapters and make up veteran intercessors, vv, bgv etc, whilst sword brethren are another level above these hence being their own squad and having the extra rule about ignoring passions. Feels a bit like creating fluff to fit the rules tbh and slightly disappointing but never mind Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/372588-sword-brethren-loadout/page/4/#findComment-5754846 Share on other sites More sharing options...
9x19 Parabellum Posted October 18, 2021 Share Posted October 18, 2021 On a fluff side I found it interesting that gw specified in the book that there is a distinction between veterans and sword brethren. Veterans are fairly like other chapters and make up veteran intercessors, vv, bgv etc, whilst sword brethren are another level above these hence being their own squad and having the extra rule about ignoring passions. Feels a bit like creating fluff to fit the rules tbh and slightly disappointing but never mind agreed. You know what level of "veterancy" comes after veteran? Dreadnought. templargdt 1 Back to top Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/372588-sword-brethren-loadout/page/4/#findComment-5754854 Share on other sites More sharing options...
BitsHammer Posted October 18, 2021 Share Posted October 18, 2021 Sword Brethren are hand picked by the Crusade's Marshall and stand apart, so it sort of makes sense that they're not just Veterans. Khornestar and BLACK BLΠFLY 2 Back to top Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/372588-sword-brethren-loadout/page/4/#findComment-5754856 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlo Posted October 18, 2021 Share Posted October 18, 2021 Yeah 100%, they're quite literally the highest honour in the Crusade outside of Castellan/ Marshall. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/372588-sword-brethren-loadout/page/4/#findComment-5754890 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marshall Bretton Posted October 18, 2021 Share Posted October 18, 2021 It does make sense with the way it has been written, it's just disappointing, particularly as it also states terminators are just veterans, not sword brethren, which is directly contradicting older lore. It just feels to me like a way to excuse not giving the sword brethren rule to loads of other units Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/372588-sword-brethren-loadout/page/4/#findComment-5754900 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Medjugorje Posted October 18, 2021 Share Posted October 18, 2021 the main problem is that even terminators are not sword brethren anymore ( in the game). And Sword Brethren used to be in every Veteran squad. If GW decided that not all Veterans are Sword Brethren then we should have the ability to make whatever veteran squad into sword brethren. There is no reason why a Blade Guard put its good mastercrafted sword away and becomining a sword brother with a normal sword... If you want it to sounds cool then okay. They should have given us an additional upgrade next to relic bearers for just very few points for BGV to make them Sword Bothers too. Just 1-5 points each model. But they didnt because they want to sell Sword Brethren. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/372588-sword-brethren-loadout/page/4/#findComment-5754911 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlo Posted October 18, 2021 Share Posted October 18, 2021 They've done similar with Dark Angels and Deathwing, but they didn't get new models I suppose :) BLACK BLΠFLY 1 Back to top Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/372588-sword-brethren-loadout/page/4/#findComment-5754912 Share on other sites More sharing options...
OttoVonAwesome Posted October 18, 2021 Share Posted October 18, 2021 Not the first instance where a unit should have a keyword it doesn't. Veteran Assault Intercessors come to mind. It really does feel like marketing is involved with some of these desicions, this last edition especially with first born and veterans losing a bunch of strategems and other losing thier special rules for no clear reason (Agressors, Inceptors) making the new Indomitus units clear winners and thus taking place to rule the meta wich is a huge driver in sales. Same thing might have happened to Dark Angels if it wasn't such a huge part of thier identity but at the same time it really makes the case for Terminators at the very least getting the sword brethren special rule and is frustrating cuase having that rule on other veteran units would really open more list build options. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/372588-sword-brethren-loadout/page/4/#findComment-5754987 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mandragola Posted October 18, 2021 Share Posted October 18, 2021 It’s one of those things that makes sense for the models, as they’ve designed a SB badge now that only SB models have. Meanwhile for the datasheet they can can now declare that these rules apply only to this unit, rather than having to put in a new army rule that arbitrarily buffs stuff all over the book… though of course they had no issue doing that for deathwing and ravenwing a few months ago. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/372588-sword-brethren-loadout/page/4/#findComment-5755006 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kastor Krieg Posted October 18, 2021 Share Posted October 18, 2021 Why are people thinking the Firstborn SB kit is not coming back? How else are people supposed to make Firstborn Crusader Squads with an FSB leading them? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/372588-sword-brethren-loadout/page/4/#findComment-5755013 Share on other sites More sharing options...
BitsHammer Posted October 18, 2021 Share Posted October 18, 2021 Why are people thinking the Firstborn SB kit is not coming back? How else are people supposed to make Firstborn Crusader Squads with an FSB leading them?Because it's Finecast. BLACK BLΠFLY 1 Back to top Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/372588-sword-brethren-loadout/page/4/#findComment-5755015 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Acebaur Posted October 18, 2021 Share Posted October 18, 2021 The more I think about this, the more I realize what is driving me nuts is the 40 mm bases. I absolutely can't stand it. I have a unit of 10 veteran interecessors that were painted in advance to be sword brethren if/when a codex ever came out. Now I either have to rebase them and commit them to being Sword Brethren and NOT use them as veteran intercessors, or else leave them as is and not be able to use them as SB. It makes zero sense that they should be on 40mm bases when they have the same statline as a basic primaris dude. The real question is why were you running veteran intercessors to begin with? They are even more useless(if that's possible) now that Sword Brethren exist the main problem is that even terminators are not sword brethren anymore ( in the game). And Sword Brethren used to be in every Veteran squad. If GW decided that not all Veterans are Sword Brethren then we should have the ability to make whatever veteran squad into sword brethren. There is no reason why a Blade Guard put its good mastercrafted sword away and becomining a sword brother with a normal sword... If you want it to sounds cool then okay. They should have given us an additional upgrade next to relic bearers for just very few points for BGV to make them Sword Bothers too. Just 1-5 points each model. But they didnt because they want to sell Sword Brethren. Rules =/= Lore my dude. Marshal Loss, Sword Brother Adelard and BLACK BLΠFLY 3 Back to top Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/372588-sword-brethren-loadout/page/4/#findComment-5755039 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Schlitzaf Posted October 18, 2021 Share Posted October 18, 2021 Also to be slightly pedantic SBros are a Marshal hand chosen warriors to serve in his household while Veterans are well Veterans. All SBros are “Veterans” but not all Veterans are SBros. And a SBro in one Crusade might not be an SBro in another Crusade BitsHammer 1 Back to top Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/372588-sword-brethren-loadout/page/4/#findComment-5755041 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sir Clausel Posted October 18, 2021 Share Posted October 18, 2021 Dont know if anybody has seen this but this is from the codex. Looks like some different poses and one of them is without a doubt a 2-handed grip! Marshal Loss, BitsHammer, painting.for.my.sanity and 2 others 5 Back to top Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/372588-sword-brethren-loadout/page/4/#findComment-5755042 Share on other sites More sharing options...
9x19 Parabellum Posted October 18, 2021 Share Posted October 18, 2021 (edited) The more I think about this, the more I realize what is driving me nuts is the 40 mm bases. I absolutely can't stand it. I have a unit of 10 veteran interecessors that were painted in advance to be sword brethren if/when a codex ever came out. Now I either have to rebase them and commit them to being Sword Brethren and NOT use them as veteran intercessors, or else leave them as is and not be able to use them as SB. It makes zero sense that they should be on 40mm bases when they have the same statline as a basic primaris dude. The real question is why were you running veteran intercessors to begin with? They are even more useless(if that's possible) now that Sword Brethren exist My veteran intercessors were begun in 8th edition when it was a strat to upgrade regular intercessors to veterans (and they were still troops). After the assault intercessor kit came out last year for Dominus, before we had the 9th codex, I did the arms as chainsword/heavy bolt pistol. I used them several times in the interim as a blender unit, while I continued to build out the elites for my BT 9th edition army. 50 chainsword attacks on the charge before buffs was pretty tasty. I also gave the Sgt. the Sword of Judgment at the time. They weren't awesome, but they had a place in my list. I could also, in a pinch, because of base sizes, use them as assault intercessors. The hope was that with the new codex, SB would be well worth the effort of rebasing them to 40. It is not. To your point, they are also not worth it as Veteran Intercessors. So yeah....I'm pretty letdown...letdown that my beautiful 10 man squad of....something....is basically useless. Edited October 18, 2021 by 9x19 Parabellum Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/372588-sword-brethren-loadout/page/4/#findComment-5755048 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sword Brother Adelard Posted October 18, 2021 Share Posted October 18, 2021 Why are people thinking the Firstborn SB kit is not coming back? How else are people supposed to make Firstborn Crusader Squads with an FSB leading them? The same way we did before? Using an initiate body and the weapons from the upgrade kits? CastellanDeMolay 1 Back to top Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/372588-sword-brethren-loadout/page/4/#findComment-5755050 Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaxom Posted October 18, 2021 Share Posted October 18, 2021 Dont know if anybody has seen this but this is from the codex. Looks like some different poses and one of them is without a doubt a 2-handed grip! And it’s actually both hands on the grip! Crap, now I have to wait for the SB kit before attempting to convert my Emperor’s Champion. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/372588-sword-brethren-loadout/page/4/#findComment-5755054 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mandragola Posted October 18, 2021 Share Posted October 18, 2021 One thing we kind of know about the kit is that it has at least five power swords. The unit entry lets you take them on everyone, and otherwise only allows you to take stuff in the kit. There might even be extra special stuff for the Castellan. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/372588-sword-brethren-loadout/page/4/#findComment-5755073 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sete Posted October 18, 2021 Share Posted October 18, 2021 Dont know if anybody has seen this but this is from the codex. Looks like some different poses and one of them is without a doubt a 2-handed grip! Nice find my dude! Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/372588-sword-brethren-loadout/page/4/#findComment-5755074 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marshal Loss Posted October 18, 2021 Share Posted October 18, 2021 (edited) Goddamn the more I look at that kit, the more I love it. Looks like the box will come with enough power swords for everybody as well which is fantastic. Edited October 18, 2021 by Marshal Loss BLACK BLΠFLY 1 Back to top Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/372588-sword-brethren-loadout/page/4/#findComment-5755081 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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