Tau Hammerheads Main Gun vs Repulsor Exeuctioner Main Gun

[Lord Blackwood]

I like the design strategy of the weapon , its very powerful. 



Hits Far, Inbuilt re roll , Wounds T7 on 2s , punches through INVUL SAVES , d3+6 damage 


In comparison the Repulsor Executioner is pretty lacking. 




I feel like the heavy laser destroyer probably needs a little bit of a tweak.

[Orange Knight]

Hah, it needs to be completely re-written, unfortunately.

 

Let's hope we don't have to wait too long for a new codex.

[Cpt_Reaper]

The Railgun is actually D3+9 Damage. Don't forget, successfully wounding the target does 3 mortal wounds.

[Cruor Vault]

It's grossly bad for the health of the game.  The extreme escalation of damage outputs is going to make 9th into an only slightly less toxic version of 7th edition's rocket tag (at least everything isn't invisible with a 2++ lol).

 

Frankly the gun would still be fantastic if it lost the ignores INV saves.  Getting 3 free MW just for wounding the target is extremely good.  Ignoring INV saves makes a huge number of large profile models like Primarchs, TSK, and Knights all into highly risky prospects (IE unplayable).  The only way back from this is for GW to proliferate the "Can only take X wounds per/phase" abilities that Ctan and Gaz have.

 

The Executioner's main weapon is fantastic.  The problem isn't with the weapon, it's with the platform and 9th's absurdly high damage units. 

 

Before things D3+3 weapons or Meltas with +4 damage a T8 W16 tank would have been decently resilient.  GW needs to dial back the damage, not keep upping it.

Edited December 30, 2021 by Cruor Vault

[Orange Knight]

I made thus comment on the other topic also:

 

This weapon really does remind me of the D weapons from 6th and 7th.

 

I don't like how it's equally effective at destroying the most elite infantry.

 

If you score a wound roll, you immediately remove 2 Custodes from the table. No saves, no invuls, no interaction.

 

It will also deal a minimum of 10 wounds to a vehicle, on average 11, meaning that units like a Relic Contemptor Dreadnought are simply removed from the table on a roll of 2+

[Skywrath]

I think we might have found the daddy of the Repulsor Executioner, folks.

[Helias_Tancred]

Things like this, and previous golly gees have soured me on 9th beginning a while back. I still play, but I've got some beefs lol. One of the major themes here, dial back damage output, I agree with completely.

[Karhedron]

One thing to remember about these high damage weapons is that GW seems to balance stuff for use on tables that have fairly dense terrain. I think the idea is that players should be able to avoid exposing valuable units to such firepower if they wish, meaning it then becomes a tactical decision as to whether to risk the firepower for the reward of doing more damage to the enemy.

 

This is what GW thinks 9th edition boards should look like. If you consider this, there are huge swathes of board where you can hide even a big model like a Daemon Primarch. Those larger terrain pieces are over 12" across.

 

 

[Lord_Ikka]

Not a big fan of the mortal wounds- if anything they should proc on 6+ to Wound and be d3 rather than fully auto. Invuln removal would be much better if the AP was -3 or 4 rather than -6, because then you at least have a possibility of a save. The base damage is good, but not overwhelming- d3 + 6 is higher that almost every other single shot weapon, but truly a real anti-tank weapon. 

 

The points and the rest of the codex will determine if the railgun Hammerhead will change the meta; they still don't have Obsec and can only kill a max of 1 light tank/4 infantry per turn (unless they use the strat on a big unit) and 9th is all about holding objectives rather than killing off your enemy. 

[Closet Skeleton]

The Executioner's main weapon is fantastic.  The problem isn't with the weapon, it's with the platform and 9th's absurdly high damage units. 

 

 

The Executioner's main weapon is garbage compared with the melta units in the same book. Nobody used lascannons or Railguns in 8th. Fixing internal balance is not power creep.

 

The Hammerhead is just its main gun, the Executioner is a moving fortress of weapons. If the Hammerhead misses with its gun then the whole unit is a dud for a turn which the Executioner can miss with its main gun and still kill whole squads of guardsmen. The Gladiator Lancer is a better comparison that unfortunately is tied to the same kind of gun as the Executioner. Both need to be 3+d6 to make them not a complete joke compared to melta and wouldn't be unbalanced at 6+d3.

 

Its too early to say if the Tau codex will be bad or good for game balance but this kind of drastic experimentation in damage output is just necessary to balance vehicles that rely on a single shot main gun.

 

 

If you score a wound roll, you immediately remove 2 Custodes from the table. No saves, no invuls, no interaction.

 

 

I must have missed the warhammer community article or leak that told us arcane bio-alchemy (or whatever transhuman physiology is called for custodes) was gone because that stratagem can still heavily neuter this gun.

Edited December 30, 2021 by Closet Skeleton

[Brother Kraskor]

I wonder how many points the Hammerhead will cost. I expect there will be rage if it costs much less than 200pts. 

 

Mortal Wounds, eh. chuckles in Templar

[Sergeant Centurion]

Nah, dont worry, they will patch it in a few months or bring another weapon more powerfull.

[Captain Idaho]

The problem with having to patch it (and other stuff) so early is twofold:

 

1) The ever evolving changing of rules we have to keep up with.

 

2) It shows a lack of playtesting and incompetence or it's deliberately done to sell models.

 

Don't get me wrong, I'm up for GW patching problems but so far they've only really changed points rather than stats and printed special rules. I fear the worst here.

 

Now how will we deal with this? Less vehicles will be seen on the table, which are already in low numbers. But perhaps more lighter vehicles would work? Kill 1 of 3 Land Speeders and I still have 2 Rhinos and a pair of Dreads.

[KnightofSigismund]

I just don’t understand why the repulsor costs so much, I never looked at the price until this morning and nearly spit out my damn coffee.

[Lord Blackwood]

I just don’t understand why the repulsor costs so much, I never looked at the price until this morning and nearly spit out my damn coffee.

I think its just cursed with trying to be too much. 

6 slot transport is really redundant you are better off taking an impulsor  , Gun Fortress sure but were talking 2 main guns and then a plethora of just weight of fire dakka. 

 

Dont get me wrong I love all the primaris grav tanks , I just feel like they need gentle adjustments and a sense of direction. 

There is a reason why  people dont put Spartans and Land Raiders on the board  and why you certainly dont fill them with things you need to get from point a to point b

[phandaal]

The problem with having to patch it (and other stuff) so early is twofold:

 

1) The ever evolving changing of rules we have to keep up with.

 

2) It shows a lack of playtesting and incompetence or it's deliberately done to sell models.

 

Don't get me wrong, I'm up for GW patching problems but so far they've only really changed points rather than stats and printed special rules. I fear the worst here.

 

Now how will we deal with this? Less vehicles will be seen on the table, which are already in low numbers. But perhaps more lighter vehicles would work? Kill 1 of 3 Land Speeders and I still have 2 Rhinos and a pair of Dreads.

It is certainly done to sell models. Everything they do is done to sell models in some way or another.

 

Although if you could somehow ask the person who made this rule they would probably say something like "we just wanted to give people something cool."

[Brother Kraskor]

Watch one of their HQs give a shoot twice ability to a unit within 6". 

[tychobi]

I like it. A weapon to fear to be sure. Wonder how many points a hammerhead will cost now?

[Malakithe]

Man i feel sorry for Necron players lol

[phandaal]

Well Valrak just said he heard Space Marines are getting a new non-LoS rocket unit. The arms race continues!

[Malakithe]

Good ol escalation 

[BLACK BLΠFLY]

Quantum shielding will help Necrons.

[Lord_Ikka]

Quantum shielding will help Necrons.

Except for the Monolith...

[Malakithe]

The issue with Necrons is all their that are supposed to be super strong are all based on d6 which is trash. Everyone else out there has something like d3+x or d6+x

[BloodyB]

I think that I'll be taking on my local T'au player with a little more caution from now on. I feel like while the changes are a sign of power creep, it isn't as bad as I thought it would be. My only quibble with this unit now is the ignores Invuls bit, it just seems like they were trying to make these things viable, and leaned too hard into it.

 

On the other hand, from now on I will be taking a unit of cheap deepstrike models, probably assault marines, just to tie things like this up. A melta, eviscerator and maybe a power weapon on the Sgt and they shouldn't have any trouble bracketing the thing at least, backed up by Suppressors and they should do that job well.