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Jarms48 is correct, I did this all wrong (my apologies gang!)

 

I compared the GW App to Battlescribe, forgetting that Battlescribe auto-includes the points for some things, while the GW app does not.

 

 

 

Looking at the GW app, it looks like we're actually getting a few points drops:

 

  • Chimera now 65 from 75
  • Lord Commisar 35 from 40
  • Pask - 200 PPM from 220
  • LRBT: 140 from 155, hull & sponson weapons stayed the same
  • Tank Commander 175 from 195, DC is still 5 points, for a total of 180, hull & sponson weapons stayed the same

With 3 TCs, that's a 60 point drop to our list, 80 if you run Cadians with Pask.  That's enough for a few sponson upgrades. 

 

The LRBT is still too over-costed (140 would be good with 2 sponsons and hull LC).  So it's at least promising.  If anything, it pays for an additional psyker for Psychic Barrier or Nightscroud.

Edited by Brainpsyk
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These changes don't feel like they'll do a great deal, but the option to add a few more things after point drops in is always nice. I think the Chimera change stands out the most, I will take a fresh look at them next list I'm crafting.

I mean TCs down 20p instantly frees up 60p in most people's lists. That's not bad. I'm not sure 10p down will get the standard Russ there still...I think they're still more expensive than they used to be in 8th (was it 130p base?) and they were still a bit of a questionable choice then.

 

Chimeras dropping further is nice, question is whether that's enough to compensate for giving up 2VP on Bring it Down again. If you brought a normal mechanised list with 3 TCs and 6 IS in Chimeras, you're up 120p now.

 

Pask and LC...yeah okay, nice to have. Not sure it'll change much for their use. I find Pask to not offer enough for the extra cost. If he could take Gatekeeper he'd be in every tank list I bring. Guess you could give him a Demo for reliable damage, but then he's more of a pricey distraction unit. Wish the Exterminator/Vanquisher was worth taking...anyway, he's still only ranks behind normal TCs for me.

 

The Lord Commissar is nice at the same price point as a CC, but he's too squishy to be a brawler so doesn't really have any synergy in most Guard lists. So a drop here is neat if you use him, but I don't see it convincing anyone to suddenly start taking him over other stuff.

Edited by sairence

In the app, the Infantry Squads/Conscripts/Scions stayed the same points cost.

 

The Tempestor Prime is unique, because we take them in separate patrols to get Scions buffs & orders.

 

There's 2 problems with the Lord Commissar:

  1. Takes a slot away from a needed TC
  2. Does not have the ability to give orders

The Lord Commissar is actually a cool model, and the leadership with Summary execution would give them a lot of play at 35PPM.  But #1 is the same problem for the Primaris Psyker: as long as we're required to take TCs/Pask to compete, they're non-starters.  This does open up

 

The median damage for a LRBT (no orders) with a BC & HB is 2.5, mean of 3.  That's 160 points to kill 1 model.  Going to the DemoCannon, that's median/median 5.5 dmg, but still 2 2W models, but not enough to kill 1 T6 6W model on average.  Plus, there's no orders for a normal LRBT, as the order is better spent on the TC.

 

This does open up an option for an additional Scion squad or Astropath, which with the new Retrive Nachmund Data or EoaF it's cool, and it's a step in the right direction, but still not far enough.

Very disappointing if that's all the changes:sad.:

 

Guard at 55 are too much, scions being same points as skittari isn't great:no:

 

I could rabble on about everything else that needs a drop but I cant be bothered:laugh.: :laugh.: :laugh.:

Edited by Emperor Ming

Any idea if Forgeworld stuff will have any changes?

Us Kriegy boys are likely still in the cold for a while on that front.  Might not be unheard of them to modify them as part of the CA, but I would assume "no" given that the macharius vanquisher has had what I assume is the "new vanquisher" statline throughout 9th, and points to reflect that. (Too expensive, imo, but still.)

 

I expect FW updates to guard goodies won't come until the guard dex itself, does. Hopefully I'm wrong!

Edited by Dark Legionnare
No more mixed regiments is a big nerf IMO. Tank commanders get cheaper but you can’t put them in a gunnery/spotter detachment unless you want your entire army in that regiment. Fortunately it looks like you can still ally in scions since they don’t use <REGIMENT>

To be fair, the strats Cadians have access to now have largely made them the better if you want to talk competitively. And if it means a bit less DE nonsense, only GMNDK and less Ork-silliness I think it's an okay trade.

It’s still the tail wagging the dog. Because tournament players like to min/max and soup and find and exploit broken combos guard have lost:

-Large thematic groups of massed <insert unit here> to the rule of 3

-The ability to take aircav thanks to an aircraft cap that degrades a fun and intended build

-the ability to take multiple differing regiments that have been a feature of the guard since second edition

 

While I am all for fairer play, and the eternal striving for balance, there were lots of fun, thematic and fluffy lists that are negatively impacted that weren’t top tier or game breaking. It seems that as 9th progresses guard builds will look more and more bland, which is silly for a force that is supposed to encompass all the disparate worlds of humanity.

Pretty sure all of these are wrong.

 

- The Chimera is 65 points but you have to pay 10 for a hull HB or HF.

- Lord Commissar is 35 points, but you have to pay 5 for the mandatory power sword.

- Pask is 200 currently. You have to pay 15 for a hull HB or HF, then 5 for a BC or DC. So no change there.

- Pretty sure the Leman Russ and TC are the same as Pask. Gotta pay 15 for HB or HF.

Edited by jarms48

No worries, it happens.

And it gave us a moment of hope before we realised what was actually changed.

For the record

Leman Russ -10p

Manticore +10p

Deathstrike -20 or 30p

Nothing that is really going to make any notable difference whatsoever. Except having to find an extra 20p.

Banewolf also went down 10 from memory. This whole MFM was a joke.

That’s pathetic. Really goes to show that they just look at what units show up (nerf the manticore) and not address army strength, because guard are in the absolute toilet outside of Cadian gimmicks and to raise the cost on any units in an army in this state is just rude.

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