Novice question on Cheap HQs…

[Shadowscream]

For a 500 point Primaris List what are the most points efficient cheap HQ choices (that won’t just immediately die)?

(White Scars)

Thanks in advance!

[tychobi]

No such thing as a cheap hq for marines. Capt or chap on bike should do serious work for their points

[phandaal]

The Indomitus lieutenant is relatively cheap (points and cash on eBay). He has the extra durability from his storm shield and you can also give him the Obsidian Aquila for a 6+ feel no pain for him and everything in a 6" bubble around him.

Not too shabby for 90 points.

 

Edit: Forgot how to brain - the aquila is a Salamanders item only. Primaris LT with a shield is still durable as-is.

Edited February 1, 2022 by phandaal

[Orange Knight]

A Primaris Captain with MC power sword and plasma pistol is 95 points.

 

A Primaris Lieutenant with MC power sword is 75.

 

Both are very useful.

Edited January 29, 2022 by Orange Knight

[Dark Shepherd]

Foot Chaplain?

[ValourousHeart]

No such thing as a cheap hq for marines. Capt or chap on bike should do serious work for their points

 

The way to make HQ cheap for marines is to take very few HQ units.

 

(that won’t just immediately die)?

 

The way to keep them from dying right away is to keep them with other units.

 

Always pick your HQ themed to the rest of your list.  If you make them a lone wolf style character, you increase the chance they they will get kicked off early.

 

I play Ravenwing, so it is similar to how I often see White Scars run.  Make a serious effort to pick an Outrider detachment, save yourself the 3 troop units and 1 HQ tax.  Grab some Bike Squads, attack bikes, Outriders and an HQ on bike.

[Tokugawa]

In lower points game, every character need to have ability to do "heavy lifting" work. Pure buff character usually can't earn its cost back, since there really aren't many "soldiers" to receive the buff.

For marine HQ, it means you need to pick a character with inv save, and weapon better than dmg1 sword. A bike character with relic weapon upgrades may be good.

[Rik Lightstar]

Sticking with Primaris limits you a fair bit, I've tried to do the same. Marine HQs aren't cheap

 

Wanting some survivability means you really do need and Invulnerable Save which means your options are Captains, Chaplains or the Indomitus Lieutenant.

 

Especially in smaller games you'll also need them to be able to add something other than look pretty and chuck out some rerolls.

 

For my money your options (both T5 W7 3+/4+) are:

• Primaris Chaplain on Bike @ 115 - His 4 Bolt Rifle shots add a bit of firepower and the "Benediction of Fury" Relic Crozius isn't too shabby either
• Primaris Chaplain on foot @ 85 - as above but slower and no bike bolters
• Captain with Master-crafted Heavy Bolt Rifle @ 105 - The gun is pretty good and he has a Master-crafted Power Sword too with the option to upgrade it to the "Burning Blade"

Either benefits from the Imperium's Sword Warlord Trait and White Scars Chapter Tactics lets even the guys on foot be in combat pretty early with Advance & Charge.

 

Your other option is to go absolute bare bones on a Primaris Lieutenant or Techmarine at around 80 points.

 

Rik

[Karhedron]

If you want an HQ who is hard to kill then a Biker Chaplain is a gerat start. Give him the Armour Indomitus relic and the Iron Resolve warlord trait. He comes with Litany of Hate by default for giving melee rerolls to nearby units. As his extra Litany, take the Mantra of Strength.

 

Defensively you have model with 9 Wounds at T5. He has a 2+ save, 4+ Invulnerable save and a 6+ Ignore Wounds roll. Once per game you can upgrade his Invulnerable to a 3+ for a phase in case he needs to tangle with any heavy hitters. There is not much in a 500 points game that can one-shot this guy so he will definitely stick around to do some damage.

 

Speaking of damage, the regular Crozius is pretty decent in the hands of White Scars. By Turn 3 when you get into the Assault Doctrine, he will be getting 5 attacks at S6 with Ap-2 and 3 Damage thanks to the WS Chapter trait. If that is not enough, you chant the Mantra of Strength to boost him up to 6 attacks at S7 with 4 Damage. That should pulverise most opponents.

[Rik Lightstar]

One thing to be wary of with a Chaplain on Bike or any other "fast" character in 500 point games is being conscious of how much support he has that can move with him.

 

Karhedron's build is indeed very tanky, BUT if you over commit with it which will often be tempting given his speed and the very real possibility 24" + movement when advancing and charging then he can end up isolated and having to deal with the entire enemy force by himself.

 

Rik

[Karhedron]

Karhedron's build is indeed very tanky, BUT if you over commit with it which will often be tempting given his speed and the very real possibility 24" + movement when advancing and charging then he can end up isolated and having to deal with the entire enemy force by himself.

A very good point. Just because he has a huge potential threat range, you don't necessarily want to send him off like a self-guided missile at the first opportunity. He is both tanky and punchy for his points but cannot solo multiple units.

 

On the other hand, in the late game, your opponent may have under-strength units out on limb. He is quite capable of boosting off an wiping a weakened unit off an Objective once your opponent'a army has been thinned somewhat. You don't have to do that and it might not be wise in every game but it is nice to have the option.

[phandaal]

All low-points games I have played do not really end up having a late game. They go maybe 3 rounds and then one army is gone. Usually something like 2.5 rounds.

 

That, and the board is small at 500 points. Footslogger characters will do just fine. Bikes are neat for White Scars though.

[BLACK BLΠFLY]

Remember that for the most part 4++ is as good as it gets now so you don’t has to waste points on a shield anymore if you wanna save some points.

[Jorin Helm-splitter]

Yeah for 500-point games, I'd just go with a foot captain. For scars the new Gravis Captain would be pretty good, being able to charge after advancing, and the damage boost from the chapter doctrine bonus are both great for the model. It's pretty flexible because it has a lot of options for relics, so it's a good model to pick up. The bike chaplain is another excellent choice, but you don't need the speed on the smaller tables, and it's hard to find units that can keep up with him.

 

That if you're just starting the fraction and plan on playing in bigger games latter on go with Primaris Bike Chaplain. It's a really flexible choice that can be tailored to your playstyle and on the bigger tables the speed is really nice.   

[ValourousHeart]

Screw playing it safe... fortune favors the bold.

 

Prime Chaplain on Bike - 115

Outrider Squad 1 - 150

Outrider Squad 2 - 150

Invader ATV - MM - 85

 

500 points on the nose... unless chapter approved just changed that.  I still need to pick up my copy.  But I don't recall hearing about those 3 units changing points.

 

As I said further up, I play Ravenwing, so list are often similar.  Since my store reopened the players tend to play 50 Power / 1000 Point games, but I'm preparing for us to switch back to 100 Power / 2000 Point games once the   subsides.

 

So my two 50 Power / 1000 point lists that will be combined to make my 100 Power / 2000 Point list are.

 

List 1

Talonmaster

3 Land Speeder Tornados

3 Land Speeder Tornados

3 Land Speeder Typhoons

 

List 2

Prime Chaplain on Bike

Outrider 1

Outrider 2

Invader ATV Squad - 3 models, 3 MM

Black Knight Squad

 

And it all fits in to a single Outrider Detachment.

 

As a White Scar player you won't have access to the Talonmaster or the Black Knights,  but you also won't be restricted from other interesting units that the 2nd Company rule blocks for me. 

 

At the top of my list would be Invictor Warsuits, because they are fast dreadnoughts that can potentially keep up with your other units and bring some additional pain with them.

 

Second choice would be dropping in some Reivers, mostly because they look awesome, and one day I'm confident that their rules will reflect that.  With Grav-Chuts you can drop them in near your bikes to support them on their charges, and with Grapple Launchers they can clear units in ruins that have been softened up by your shooting.

 

Third would be Suppressor, because Jump Pack troops with Autocannons that pin units are awesome.  If you'd rather aggressors, then scratch build them using Suppressors or Reivers, because Aggressors look stupid IMO.

 

One last bit.  You might have noticed that I didn't actually give you a build for your HQ.  That is because I honestly think that it doesn't really matter.  If you built a list where all of the elements support each other purely based on the basic characteristics of the units then you'll do just fine... even without Warlord Traits, Relics, or other pixie dust.

 

What you may end up finding is that you focused your chaplain build based on diving in to assault with a couple other units, but after several games you discovered that with your play style and your regular opponents you spend 3-4 turns killing everything with shooting and really only get 1 decisive round of assault in during the game.  At that point you might switch things up and spec out for ranged combat, and realize that the one round of assault turns out the same where your base level assault power is enough given how effective you made your shooting during the other 3-4 turns.

[9x19 Parabellum]

The Chappy on Bike went to 125.

[Son of Sacrifice]

I was running the Indomitus LT at 500 points, he was pretty nasty with the volkite pistol and the burning blade.

[ADragonuFear]

Screw playing it safe... fortune favors the bold.

 

Prime Chaplain on Bike - 115

Outrider Squad 1 - 150

Outrider Squad 2 - 150

Invader ATV - MM - 85

 

500 points on the nose... unless chapter approved just changed that.  I still need to pick up my copy.  But I don't recall hearing about those 3 units changing points.

 

My dude, the post is asking for a 500 point game. The core rules say combat patrol missions REQUIRE a patrol detachment and no other detachments are allowed, unless you are playing knights where you must take a superheavy detachment of armigers. At minimum our fellow needs one hq and one troop unit for their primaris 500 pt list.

[BLACK BLΠFLY]

He prolly didn’t know… not a big deal.

[Inquisitor_Lensoven]

One thing to be wary of with a Chaplain on Bike or any other "fast" character in 500 point games is being conscious of how much support he has that can move with him.

 

Karhedron's build is indeed very tanky, BUT if you over commit with it which will often be tempting given his speed and the very real possibility 24" + movement when advancing and charging then he can end up isolated and having to deal with the entire enemy force by himself.

 

Rik

not to mention expensive…115pts at 750 or less is a big investment gravis captain with bolt rifle is 10pts cheaper and can be set up to be very tanks as well. He’s also not at risk of out running anything either

[Jacques Corbin]

Well, I would suggest a Primaris Chaplain with Chogoran Storm, Catechism of Fire, and the Plume of the Planesrunner relic.

 

For troops, Intercessors with Assault Bolters, a Grenade Launcher, and a melee weapon on the sergeant.

 

Then add a unit of Bolter Aggressors, as well as a unit of Outriders.