jimbo1701 Posted February 13, 2022 Share Posted February 13, 2022 Greetings brothers / sisters. I have a game against tau in a week and was wondering what tactics and Units may be best to take? I have primaris and firstborn elements but nothing overly competitive. My opponent Leans more towards mobile tau so the new book suits him. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/373313-how-will-we-deal-with-new-tau/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tiger9gamer Posted February 13, 2022 Share Posted February 13, 2022 Don't worry brother I got the secret to dealing with overly competitive tau players: "Do you want to play a game against my 3 rip tide and a storm surge tau?!""No" seriously, Tau will be a tough nut to crack. I'm thinking Armor saturation, bringing more marines in rhinos / impulsors, and dreads. I say this because if you have enough guys then any enemy will have a hard time figuring out who to shoot down. something will slip through the cracks In Theory. If they shoot your dreads then cool, your marines are able to get up the table. If they waste their guns on rhinos then... well, they wasted shots on rhinos.We can get into combat fairly easily all things considered if we are close enough. bring stuff that allows that and we should have enough to punch the tau in the face. Suppressors could help against overwatch by split firing at seperate targets that you wanna charge. templargdt, Metic and jimbo1701 3 Back to top Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/373313-how-will-we-deal-with-new-tau/#findComment-5796089 Share on other sites More sharing options...
BLACK BLΠFLY Posted February 13, 2022 Share Posted February 13, 2022 No pity !!! No remorse !!! No fear !!! jimbo1701 and templargdt 2 Back to top Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/373313-how-will-we-deal-with-new-tau/#findComment-5796094 Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimbo1701 Posted February 13, 2022 Author Share Posted February 13, 2022 No pity !!! No remorse !!! No fear !!! The solution to every problem. Forgive my lack of insight brother, I will do penance. Son of Sacrifice and BLACK BLΠFLY 2 Back to top Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/373313-how-will-we-deal-with-new-tau/#findComment-5796107 Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimbo1701 Posted February 13, 2022 Author Share Posted February 13, 2022 Don't worry brother I got the secret to dealing with overly competitive tau players: "Do you want to play a game against my 3 rip tide and a storm surge tau?!""No" seriously, Tau will be a tough nut to crack. I'm thinking Armor saturation, bringing more marines in rhinos / impulsors, and dreads. I say this because if you have enough guys then any enemy will have a hard time figuring out who to shoot down. something will slip through the cracks In Theory. If they shoot your dreads then cool, your marines are able to get up the table. If they waste their guns on rhinos then... well, they wasted shots on rhinos. We can get into combat fairly easily all things considered if we are close enough. bring stuff that allows that and we should have enough to punch the tau in the face. Suppressors could help against overwatch by split firing at seperate targets that you wanna charge. Food for thought thanks. He’s a great guy so I don’t expect spam. He was running devilish breachers throughout 8th / 9th and is excited for more mobile tau. (Good good, come closer..) I’ll probably take this list: ++ Battalion Detachment 0CP (Imperium - Adeptus Astartes - Black Templars) [97 PL, 1,999pts, 12CP] ++ + Configuration + Battle Size [12CP]: 3. Strike Force (101-200 Total PL / 1001-2000 Points) Chapter Selection: Black Templars Detachment Command Cost + HQ + Chaplain Grimaldus [7 PL, 140pts]: Litany of Hate, Warlord Primaris Chaplain on Bike [6 PL, 125pts]: Litany of Hate + Troops + Intercessor Squad [5 PL, 105pts]: Astartes Grenade Launcher, Auto Bolt Rifle . 4x Intercessor: 4x Bolt pistol, 4x Frag & Krak grenades . Intercessor Sergeant Primaris Crusader Squad [10 PL, 203pts]: Bolt Pistol and Astartes Chainsword . 3x Primaris Initiate w/Chainsword & Heavy Bolt Pistol: 3x Astartes Chainsword, 3x Frag & Krak grenades, 3x Heavy Bolt Pistol . Primaris Initiate w/Power Fist and Heavy bolt pistol: Power fist . Primaris Initiate w/Pyreblaster: Pyreblaster . 4x Primaris Neophytes: 4x Frag & Krak grenades . Primaris Sword Brother: Heavy Bolt Pistol, Power sword Primaris Crusader Squad [10 PL, 203pts]: Bolt Pistol and Astartes Chainsword . 3x Primaris Initiate w/Chainsword & Heavy Bolt Pistol: 3x Astartes Chainsword, 3x Frag & Krak grenades, 3x Heavy Bolt Pistol . Primaris Initiate w/Power Fist and Heavy bolt pistol: Power fist . Primaris Initiate w/Pyreblaster: Pyreblaster . 4x Primaris Neophytes: 4x Frag & Krak grenades . Primaris Sword Brother: Heavy Bolt Pistol, Power sword + Elites + Bladeguard Veteran Squad [10 PL, 175pts] . 4x Bladeguard Veteran: 4x Frag & Krak grenades, 4x Heavy Bolt Pistol, 4x Master-crafted power sword, 4x Storm Shield . Bladeguard Veteran Sergeant: Heavy Bolt Pistol Primaris Apothecary [4 PL, 80pts] Redemptor Dreadnought [9 PL, 195pts]: 2x Fragstorm Grenade Launchers, Icarus Rocket Pod, Macro Plasma Incinerator, Onslaught Gatling Cannon Terminator Squad [9 PL, 215pts] . Terminator Sergeant . Terminator w/ Chainfist . Terminator w/ Heavy Weapon: Power fist . . Cyclone Missile Launcher and Storm Bolter: Cyclone missile launcher . 2x Terminator w/ Power fist: 2x Power fist, 2x Storm bolter Vanguard Veteran Squad [7 PL, 143pts]: Jump Pack . Vanguard Veteran: Bolt pistol, Power fist . Vanguard Veteran: Bolt pistol, Power sword . Vanguard Veteran: Astartes Chainsword, Storm shield . Vanguard Veteran: Bolt pistol and Chainsword . Vanguard Veteran Sergeant: Storm shield, Thunder hammer + Fast Attack + Outrider Squad [6 PL, 150pts]: Outrider Sgt . 2x Outrider: 2x Astartes Chainsword, 2x Frag & Krak grenades, 2x Heavy Bolt Pistol, 2x Twin Bolt rifle + Heavy Support + Eradicator Squad [7 PL, 135pts]: Melta rifle . 2x Eradicator: 2x Bolt pistol . Eradicator Sgt + Dedicated Transport + Impulsor [7 PL, 130pts]: 2x Fragstorm Grenade Launchers, Multi-melta ++ Total: [97 PL, 12CP, 1,999pts] ++ Created with BattleScribe BLACK BLŒ FLY 1 Back to top Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/373313-how-will-we-deal-with-new-tau/#findComment-5796110 Share on other sites More sharing options...
BLACK BLŒ FLY Posted February 14, 2022 Share Posted February 14, 2022 To beat the enemy you must be able to think like the enemy.… Here’s an article by Siegler: https://www.goonhammer.com/war-zone-nachmund-faction-focus-tau-empire/ Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/373313-how-will-we-deal-with-new-tau/#findComment-5796549 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tokugawa Posted February 15, 2022 Share Posted February 15, 2022 Wait them be nerfed.(laf) New tau is very aggressive and grab objectives quickly. Mixed weapons choice of XV8 made them good at dealing any type of unit(since the basic cost is obviously undercosted). Maybe the only answer is focus on mission? Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/373313-how-will-we-deal-with-new-tau/#findComment-5796572 Share on other sites More sharing options...
BLACK BLŒ FLY Posted February 15, 2022 Share Posted February 15, 2022 Tau has alway been weak holding objectives outside their deployment zone — I don’t think that will change, even if they load up on devilfish. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/373313-how-will-we-deal-with-new-tau/#findComment-5796585 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tokugawa Posted February 16, 2022 Share Posted February 16, 2022 Tau has alway been weak holding objectives outside their deployment zone — I don’t think that will change, even if they load up on devilfish. Fire warriors are squishy, but suits are not. XV8 has T5 W4,XV88 has W8. And they can shoot in melee. Once you have chance to catch them in melee, you must finish them ASAP. WrathOfTheLion 1 Back to top Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/373313-how-will-we-deal-with-new-tau/#findComment-5796927 Share on other sites More sharing options...
BLACK BLΠFLY Posted February 16, 2022 Share Posted February 16, 2022 They are also slow as molasses. If they are moving into midrange to hold objectives then thank your opponent for me . Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/373313-how-will-we-deal-with-new-tau/#findComment-5796948 Share on other sites More sharing options...
WrathOfTheLion Posted February 16, 2022 Share Posted February 16, 2022 (edited) They are also slow as molasses. If they are moving into midrange to hold objectives then thank your opponent for me . Crisis suits can deepstrike, and Fire Warriors can be in devilfish and move very quickly onto forward objectives. They can pounce on that stuff very quickly with Mont'ka. I think they'll be even more tough when the inevitable Farsight Enclaves supplement comes out in one of the campaign books. Already that way of play is very strong for T'au, and it will almost certainly be more strong when Farsight gets more faction-specific rules. As for the original post topic, mobile T'au is going to be very good. I haven't quite read through my book yet, but there's a lot of stuff to just get there, which is what matters in a scoring game. I'm impressed with their rules so far, they have a lot going for them which makes up for their lack of melee and psychic capabilities. Subfactions like Farsight Enclaves will have even some strong melee and anti-psyker powers (doesn't matter vs BTs, but handy overall), so they have some tricks up their sleeves. Farsight with his Dawn Blade at 5 attacks, WS 2+, S 10, AP -3, D 3 is going to brutal. Even with an invuln save, he'll be reliably taking heads in melee. Edited February 16, 2022 by WrathOfTheLion Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/373313-how-will-we-deal-with-new-tau/#findComment-5796954 Share on other sites More sharing options...
BLACK BLΠFLY Posted February 16, 2022 Share Posted February 16, 2022 (edited) I was referring to the XV88. Edited February 16, 2022 by Black Blow Fly Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/373313-how-will-we-deal-with-new-tau/#findComment-5796963 Share on other sites More sharing options...
MegaVolt87 Posted February 16, 2022 Share Posted February 16, 2022 SM should do what CSM do- get tabled but win on objectives against new Tau haha. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/373313-how-will-we-deal-with-new-tau/#findComment-5796965 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marshal Mittens Posted February 17, 2022 Share Posted February 17, 2022 Eradicators in their sniper form, 3 sets to shoot all their HQ and market light guys. Supressors for killing suits and maybe market light guys. Assault Hellblasters, don't need to over charge really, they eat suits. Still hard for them to deal with a lot of blade guard or van vets too. Three squads of van vets really ruin their day, I would imagine. Our murder Chaplin with Bones can still mess up big suits too. BLACK BLΠFLY 1 Back to top Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/373313-how-will-we-deal-with-new-tau/#findComment-5797649 Share on other sites More sharing options...
BLACK BLΠFLY Posted February 18, 2022 Share Posted February 18, 2022 Suppressors turn off overwatch and now every suit is infantry. Make them cry. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/373313-how-will-we-deal-with-new-tau/#findComment-5797673 Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimbo1701 Posted February 19, 2022 Author Share Posted February 19, 2022 (edited) Had the game last night. We ran out of time so called it a draw as too close to call. Wow devil fish are fast! He had turn one and breachers were in my face immediately. Managed to weather the first turn fire due to ++ saves. Bike chaplain and outriders tied up broadsides but then just got shot up by them in melee next few turns. His crisis commander was a beast with the relic flamer and onager. I forgot a couple of key strats which would have helped but other than that feel it went about as well as it could have. List as below: ++ Battalion Detachment 0CP (Imperium - Adeptus Astartes - Black Templars) [98 PL, 2,000pts, 10CP] ++ + Configuration + Battle Size [12CP]: 3. Strike Force (101-200 Total PL / 1001-2000 Points) Chapter Selection: Black Templars Detachment Command Cost + Stratagems + Strategem: Relics of the Chapter [-1CP]: Number of Extra Relics + HQ + Chaplain Grimaldus [7 PL, 140pts]: 1. Litany of Divine Protection, 2. Psalm of the Remorseless Persecution, Litany of Hate Primaris Chaplain on Bike [6 PL, 125pts]: 2. Catechism of Fire, Iron Resolve, Litany of Hate, Tannhauser's Bones, Warlord + Troops + Intercessor Squad [5 PL, 100pts]: Auto Bolt Rifle . 4x Intercessor: 4x Bolt pistol, 4x Frag & Krak grenades . Intercessor Sergeant Primaris Crusader Squad [10 PL, 203pts]: Bolt Pistol and Astartes Chainsword . 3x Primaris Initiate w/Chainsword & Heavy Bolt Pistol: 3x Astartes Chainsword, 3x Frag & Krak grenades, 3x Heavy Bolt Pistol . Primaris Initiate w/Power Fist and Heavy bolt pistol: Power fist . Primaris Initiate w/Pyreblaster: Pyreblaster . 4x Primaris Neophytes: 4x Frag & Krak grenades . Primaris Sword Brother: Heavy Bolt Pistol, Power sword Primaris Crusader Squad [10 PL, 203pts]: Bolt Pistol and Astartes Chainsword . 3x Primaris Initiate w/Chainsword & Heavy Bolt Pistol: 3x Astartes Chainsword, 3x Frag & Krak grenades, 3x Heavy Bolt Pistol . Primaris Initiate w/Power Fist and Heavy bolt pistol: Power fist . Primaris Initiate w/Pyreblaster: Pyreblaster . 4x Primaris Neophytes: 4x Frag & Krak grenades . Primaris Sword Brother: Heavy Bolt Pistol, Power sword + Elites + Bladeguard Veteran Squad [10 PL, 175pts, -1CP] . 4x Bladeguard Veteran: 4x Frag & Krak grenades, 4x Heavy Bolt Pistol, 4x Master-crafted power sword, 4x Storm Shield . Bladeguard Veteran Sergeant: Heavy Bolt Pistol, Stratagem: Champion of the Feast Primaris Apothecary [4 PL, 80pts]: The Aurillian Shroud Redemptor Dreadnought [9 PL, 195pts]: 2x Fragstorm Grenade Launchers, Icarus Rocket Pod, Macro Plasma Incinerator, Onslaught Gatling Cannon Terminator Squad [9 PL, 215pts] . Terminator Sergeant . Terminator w/ Chainfist . Terminator w/ Heavy Weapon: Power fist . . Cyclone Missile Launcher and Storm Bolter: Cyclone missile launcher . 2x Terminator w/ Power fist: 2x Power fist, 2x Storm bolter Vanguard Veteran Squad [8 PL, 149pts]: Fist of Balthus, Jump Pack . Vanguard Veteran: Bolt pistol, Power fist . Vanguard Veteran: Bolt pistol, Power sword . Vanguard Veteran: Astartes Chainsword, Storm shield . Vanguard Veteran: Bolt pistol and Chainsword . Vanguard Veteran Sergeant: Power fist, Storm shield + Fast Attack + Outrider Squad [6 PL, 150pts]: Outrider Sgt . 2x Outrider: 2x Astartes Chainsword, 2x Frag & Krak grenades, 2x Heavy Bolt Pistol, 2x Twin Bolt rifle + Heavy Support + Eradicator Squad [7 PL, 135pts]: Melta rifle . 2x Eradicator: 2x Bolt pistol . Eradicator Sgt + Dedicated Transport + Impulsor [7 PL, 130pts]: 2x Fragstorm Grenade Launchers, Multi-melta ++ Total: [98 PL, 10CP, 2,000pts] ++ Created with BattleScribe Edited February 19, 2022 by jimbo1701 BLACK BLΠFLY 1 Back to top Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/373313-how-will-we-deal-with-new-tau/#findComment-5798031 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marshal Mittens Posted February 19, 2022 Share Posted February 19, 2022 (edited) Supressors and hellblasters are both good. Don't bring vehicles. Eliminators are good for shooting all the marker light stuff, and most everyone else too. Edited February 19, 2022 by Marshall Mittens BLACK BLΠFLY 1 Back to top Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/373313-how-will-we-deal-with-new-tau/#findComment-5798155 Share on other sites More sharing options...
BLACK BLŒ FLY Posted February 20, 2022 Share Posted February 20, 2022 Plasma Inceptors will drill them hard but you’ll need to be able to reroll ones or they’ll nuke themselves and you’ll definitely wanna supercharge. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/373313-how-will-we-deal-with-new-tau/#findComment-5798304 Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrystalSeer Posted February 23, 2022 Share Posted February 23, 2022 I was building a mech assault primaris list, but I'm now concerned that Tau will have too easy of a time popping armor to ever really make a game of it. How do we expect black tide to fair? Survivability is still suspect due to proliferation of d2-3 weapons, but at least you're not losing 200 point models every time the enemy takes a shot. Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/373313-how-will-we-deal-with-new-tau/#findComment-5799152 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Medjugorje Posted February 23, 2022 Share Posted February 23, 2022 on a competitve view we have to wait on the new book because Tau are perfect against us now. But honestly - SM are trash anyway. We are too slow to reach comabat easy except very expensive deepstrike and chaplain combos... Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/373313-how-will-we-deal-with-new-tau/#findComment-5799244 Share on other sites More sharing options...
9x19 Parabellum Posted February 23, 2022 Share Posted February 23, 2022 I have played 3 games against Tau now, and I have been tabled by turn 3 all 3 games. Their firepower is incredible. They have a answer to everything. They have multiple ways to shoot out of LOS, or *effectively* shoot from out of LoS (Fire and Fade, Breacher ability). They have speed, they have hitting power galore and they have just enough targetted defenses to blunt your offense such that the game is decided by turn 2. I look at Crisis suits and compare them to Terminators, and I simplly cannot understand how GW costs them at 30 ppm. I look at HH/SRGs and compare to any other main battle tanks and cannot understand how they come in at 155 ppm. A couple things I think I've learned is that you need speed and you need to probably look at putting something in Outflank reserves unless you are playing on a board that has a lot of LoS blocking terrain. Tiger9gamer, BLACK BLΠFLY and Khornestar 3 Back to top Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/373313-how-will-we-deal-with-new-tau/#findComment-5799322 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tiger9gamer Posted February 23, 2022 Share Posted February 23, 2022 I have played 3 games against Tau now, and I have been tabled by turn 3 all 3 games. Their firepower is incredible. They have a answer to everything. They have multiple ways to shoot out of LOS, or *effectively* shoot from out of LoS (Fire and Fade, Breacher ability). They have speed, they have hitting power galore and they have just enough targetted defenses to blunt your offense such that the game is decided by turn 2. I look at Crisis suits and compare them to Terminators, and I simplly cannot understand how GW costs them at 30 ppm. I look at HH/SRGs and compare to any other main battle tanks and cannot understand how they come in at 155 ppm. A couple things I think I've learned is that you need speed and you need to probably look at putting something in Outflank reserves unless you are playing on a board that has a lot of LoS blocking terrain. And this is the real crux of playing against tau. No matter what, marines and most other armies are going to be at a points handicap. Everything is stupidly cheap for what they do, and compared to our stuff it is laughable GW thought it was okay to release into the wild. so the answer is to play games, have fun, and paint your templars. Right now fate is going to favor tau more than anything else until the elder pop back up. If you want games that are more fun play against other codexes, but for now the entire warhammer community has to suffer the major imbalance this brings Khornestar and BLACK BLΠFLY 2 Back to top Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/373313-how-will-we-deal-with-new-tau/#findComment-5799340 Share on other sites More sharing options...
9x19 Parabellum Posted February 24, 2022 Share Posted February 24, 2022 (edited) It is 7th edition all over again, back when Tau were oppressive. I used to play against my buddy's Tau all the time with my blood angels and the result was always the same...get close to charging, suffer massive casualties in overwatch, and miss my charge by 1" (because casualties got removed from the front) OR make the charge but only have 1 death company make it which wasn't enough to wipe the whole squad. Oh by the way, I have and own and love a fully 3k pts Tau army. Edited February 24, 2022 by 9x19 Parabellum BLACK BLΠFLY 1 Back to top Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/373313-how-will-we-deal-with-new-tau/#findComment-5799440 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tiger9gamer Posted February 24, 2022 Share Posted February 24, 2022 It is 7th edition all over again, back when Tau were oppressive. I used to play against my buddy's Tau all the time with my blood angels and the result was always the same...get close to charging, suffer massive casualties in overwatch, and miss my charge by 1" (because casualties got removed from the front) OR make the charge but only have 1 death company make it which wasn't enough to wipe the whole squad. Oh by the way, I have and own and love a fully 3k pts Tau army. I think you mean you have a fully painted 2k army now yea, as soon as I saw a game where someone brought 3 rip tides, a storm surge and a bunch of crisis suits in a 2k game I knew it was going to be bad. With eldar and tau it seems we may be going full circle again to 7th. So much pain to go through before it gets better! Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/373313-how-will-we-deal-with-new-tau/#findComment-5799472 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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