New codex experiances

[Brother Nathan]

New dex is on the verge of release so rather than the rumour thread and experiances with the leaked dex thought a thread where we talk about batreps and codex tricks and tactics etc.

 

Not recieved mine yet but eagerly awaiting it. Last new nid dex i got was when the parasites rules originally came out with the doom...

[WarriorFish]

I won't get chance to play until next month, but my nids will be front of the queue for 40k - it'll be my first nid codex I'm wondering if I can get the Parasite done in time, might be a bit optimistic. I've done a bit more reading on things and it seems good overall, though it seems Genestealers might not be so good which would be disappointing. We'll find out, for my part I will be sticking to my army theme so this will be gribbles and fexes as the main dish so I will be reporting back on them

[Danosborne]

I’ve had two games with it against death guard. I used Leviathan and 2 units of 4 zoanthropes, tyrannofex exocrine, flyrant with shardgullet, neurotrophic, 2 screamer killers and one of each unit of troops.

Leviathan is very strong. Zoanthropes will probably get toned down I think. They would be good without the additional mortal wounds, just the higher chance of supersmite and the synaptic imperative make them worth their points.

All the monsters feel the way they should feel, all the troops feel the way they should, it’s a brilliant book. I know a lot of people are saying it’s OP but honestly, I think it’s ok, I won one and lost one. The one I won the opponent knew what to do for next time, the one I lost the guy made a few big mistakes so could have won by more.

[Brother Nathan]

mine arrived yesterday from darksphere(am surprised as in northern ireland such is normally delayed a few days)

i think it initially flt op but with the new update on power armour much is dialled in to be sensible but it did take that. i also do agree. everything in the book feels like its worth using so yo can make a variety of lists work though there's currently a strong advantage to phy heavy lists. personally im going to use some of that but not all. am playing a spacewolf likely dread heavy list this weekend which im taking a somewhat balanced list with a few more venom cannons and such. going to play as leviathan. having the dex ive realised something i didn't in the leaks. every phsy has their hive fleet power in addition o smite and whatever free choices they have on top. thought that may be interesting for those that didn't notice 

[WarriorFish]

I've had a nose through the codex, it is too early to say for sure of course especially with the dataslate mixing things up, but it seems like nids will be a good army with this. I think it'll be more of a question on the scale of this "good", but all things considered it's better that than looking at a scale of "bad"

 

It will be good to read of experiences and learnings in the coming weeks to get a better understanding of the codex, as I'll be aiming to get a game in with mine at the first opportunity

[Brother Nathan]

so playing with codex and battlescribe (mine as updated and discovered adapted canot go on character models unfortunately. not a big loss but some of hem would hae seen more use on a few of the hq options. just worth being aware of

[Plague _Lord]

One strat I want to try out is Deathleaper, with his warlord trait, in a leviathan detachment but starting on the board, not in deep strike. This guy has really, really good defensive buffs and with a move of 10'' he should get where you want, when you want. Start your charge phase with him getting stuck in to a unit - the use pheromone trail to buff the charge of a fellow monster and get stuck in. Deathleaper has obsec, denies actions, but most importantly turns off stratagem support for any unit he is in engagement range of - Transhuman? Nope. Turning off rerolls? Nope. This means that Deathleaper is the ultimate support unit for big, close combat oriented monsters.

[Xenith]

Good start to the discussion - once the Dex has been out for a couple of weeks and people have maybe had a chance to get a game or two in, I'll officially start cycling through the Datasheets in the unit of the week series - in the meantime, if you have any pressing questions or insights into how units in the 9th ed codex work, then by all means please jump into the discussion for that unit and post, the index can be found here.

[Brother Nathan]

so flicking back and forth in he dex and had a thought that's probably worth a try. wont work against fearless and atsknf types like but anyway. always put 1 lashwhip bonesword model in a warrior squad, always as allows the use of the strat psychotropic venom (-2 leadership and -1 combat attrition to a unit within engagement range) combine with the horror psy power. one enemy unit gets -2 leadership and -1 combat attrition.... by my understanding they stack right? with the amount of posy powers most lists will likely be running that could be quite a nice combo by my understanding of how moral currently works. plus rerolling 1s means its not a huge loss sacrificing the extra attack to have the 1 whip in a unit of warriors needed. i also think whip on tyrant is better than dual swords for same reason never mind the other whip equipped units..

[TheNewman]

One strat I want to try out is Deathleaper, with his warlord trait, in a leviathan detachment but starting on the board, not in deep strike. This guy has really, really good defensive buffs and with a move of 10'' he should get where you want, when you want. Start your charge phase with him getting stuck in to a unit - the use pheromone trail to buff the charge of a fellow monster and get stuck in. Deathleaper has obsec, denies actions, but most importantly turns off stratagem support for any unit he is in engagement range of - Transhuman? Nope. Turning off rerolls? Nope. This means that Deathleaper is the ultimate support unit for big, close combat oriented monsters.

Holy cow that's potentially clutch. Fight on death. Auto explode. Dark Angel's retreat after fighting. Salamander's "my character can just stand back up on a 4+" Heck even the basic reroll, interrupt, and Desperate Breakout strats. Yeah the leaper has to make melee but that's potentially really strong.

[WarriorFish]

I have a Deathleaper I was given waiting in my queue, looks like he needs to stay there He seems like a good pick generally but as ever unique abilities like disabling Stratagems are what makes the difference. Given how often Stratagems pop up to foil you (especially Transhuman) I'm wondering if he might make regular appearances for me. If he earns them that is - the shelf always has space for poorly performing units to sit and think about what they've done

[Brother Nathan]

Had my first game with the new dex against spacewolves yesterday. Pretty much everything did as expected and really over killed the spacewolves even with armour of contempt. Got to see a few units doing their best as well as little and average. Tyranofex knocking out veichle after veichle. Shardgulletthe same and tyranofex also. Biovores maynot have killed much but being able to land a few final mortal wounds helped finish off things. Gaunts either died or got ignored and took objectives. Took opponent a disproportionate ammount of firepower to do such thanks to trait and inv saves from zoans. As a result warriors didnt feel overly powerful. I dont even know what would be my unit of the match as everytjibg did what i expected

[MithrilForge]

This is good to see, I played Nids a loooong time ago and I'm happy to see players getting a good game with them now !, glad the dex lets you play different things , Very happy for you guys/gals with your new Nids !!  

 

Mithril

[Brother Nathan]

to be fair v seen a fair bit of complaining online about how powerful our dex is but to me internally it seems better balanced than the last. malceptor and mortal wound spam aside(its not nice having everything you have stats wise ignored..) and the big stuff may be too cheap and hard to kill even if our troops are overpriced(warriors aside) it dis in  way even with wat i used whih is probably sub optimal feel  somewhat like it did last time i proper played nids... droppoding in the doom into the center of my opponents army and just deleting everything... i dont like  a white wash of a game i like a good fight where it can come out either way. and last turn last minute moves ake a big difference rather than kills. may have to go for the more randomish fun stuff like lictors and the like.... will see how i get on against a few tougher opponents. 

 

i do think a fairlybig part of the problem is and may well remain that imperial tanks are just trashly statted... may a good correction be comming

Edited April 27, 2022 by Brother nathan

[Zoatibix]

As ever, my problem is remembering the rules. Which now we actually have stuff to do in the command round is a fresh hell for me.

[TheNewman]

Has anyone actually tried the Tervigon/Termagaunts combo?

 

My gut says it still isn't going to work; between better guns and Look Out Sir for the Tervigon there's more incentive to wipe out the 'gaunts than before and they're not any harder to kill. Every game I've played in 9th has feature my opponent killing 180 of the 90 gaunts that I originally put on the table, I don't see that changing.

Edited April 28, 2022 by TheNewman

[Zoatibix]

I haven’t yet. I think the ability to spawn gaunts and resupply them is more about keeping the enemy distracted or physically separated from us with a wall of bodies.

 

The Tervigon looks like a defensive piece to me.

 

The new start to restore gaunts to units feels quite wishy-washy.

[Brother Nathan]

thing is using the warlord trait i think you can use it twice a turn(if its not the once per battle one?)then use powers and stuf to boost them, zoanthropes once per battle to give them 5++(or leviatan power to give that every turn) catalist to give hem 5+ fnp, levithan maning 3+ to wound best. its not about making them invulnerable unkillable tanks, its bout making them absorb a disproportionate amount of firepower for stupid little gaunts. add in the spore boyos to make tem harder to hit too and something behind them al l shooting over that all... this is probably why they got the points increase. most armys struggle with horde never mind the bloated resumoming swarm that can hurt  but more worryingly just dont die. oh and the once per battle extra squad gong off to get objectives... and the untouchable tank in their midst. or rather 2 because this will likely be a 2 terviagon list idea and a pita for anyone to try to flatten it in a balanced list area as horde isnt much of a thing atm... 

Edited April 28, 2022 by Brother nathan

[Plague _Lord]

Don't forget that respspawning models can give a unit an amazing ammount of free movement. Use this movement to grab obejctives or charge units to stop them from shooting.

 

I have a Tervigon and I'm going to use it, having in mind that I get that 1 free gaunt unit - I'm going to spawn it turn 1 to hold the backfield objective. I'm also taking the relic that spawns rippers so that they spread out to deny space for nasty deepstrikers.

 

Even though the gants aren't free per se - their cost is baked in the Tervigon cost - psychologically we perceive them as free and can plan around it. For instance I don't have to buy a backfield unit since the Tervigon can just spawn it. Similiarily I'm guessing if you hold back from spawning them in the beginning, most opponents will forget about the ability and won't take it under account when planning their strategy. You can utilize this by spawning the gants in an offensive manner and grabbing an objective where your opponent thought he had numerical superiority. I think the Tervigon is a solid unit and probably won't be touched by the inevitable nerf bat.

[WarriorFish]

As you're paying for the squad I think it's better to consider it a reserve unit you must take alongside the Tervigon. One of the many tactical options I'm mulling over is a picket unit - send that off to annoy your opponent and hopefully keep some attention of the Tervigon's escorting gants?

[Brother Nathan]

May be the sort of place where infiltrators indirectly pay for themselves. Pesky broodlord hiding somewhere to annoy opponent and psy action some easy points whilst giving out coversaves. Maby even a lictor/deathleaper. Course if going horde of gaunts a pwarrior prime imperative would fairly help their output. Specially if leviathan. And zoans saves. Tbf itll be a hard call for players facing nids with the extremes we will be throwing out. Strong enough weapons to take out our monsters that can still put out enough shots to thin our hordes...

[Malakithe]

Reports are showing that Leviathan + Warrior spam is a thing. I was planning on running 6x5 back in the rumor days so im happy about that

[Brother Nathan]

Course it is. Great unit and well under priced with free wargear options. Whats not to like. Even the reroll to hit combined with a venomcannon per unit works. Itll definately get a points increase... 10 points? And would still be cheap and good compared to gaunts. The increased toughness alone was great but that leviathan perk pretty well neutralises most heavy weapons against them for the whole game... well signficantly weakens them anyway

[Plague _Lord]

Course it is. Great unit and well under priced with free wargear options. Whats not to like. Even the reroll to hit combined with a venomcannon per unit works. Itll definately get a points increase... 10 points? And would still be cheap and good compared to gaunts. The increased toughness alone was great but that leviathan perk pretty well neutralises most heavy weapons against them for the whole game... well signficantly weakens them anyway

 

I think there is now way in heaven that warrior options stay free and tbh I have no idea how this even got accepted to print... I do think the standard loadout of scything talons and deathspitters will stay the same cost so I'm ok as that's how mine are modelled :)

 

Not sure if Leviathan is worth it or maybe go into one of the more agressive traits like kraken or behemoth? Kraken seems like a strong contender - synaptic lure is an amazing power that can potentially save you some CP and extra ap on the charge is also great. Oh and 8'' advance strat? Amazing value.

[TheNewman]

Yeah, Bone Swords and Scything Talons being the same point cost is dumb. GW has a long history of doing things like that though.

 

That wasn't adding much of anything to the discussion, I should report that the one game I got in with a Tervigon and 60 gaunts on the table did go surprisingly well.

 

I don't know that I can credit the strength of the combo itself because I played into the Deathwatch Army of Renown and he didn't really have the anti-chaff shots to clear a whole squad in one go.

 

I probably still put 40 gaunts into play over the course of the game though.

Edited May 9, 2022 by TheNewman