Armor of Contempt effects for Iron Hands

[Iron Father Ferrum]

So, the new Balance Dataslate rule "Armor of Contempt" (AoC) reduces the AP of incoming attacks for Space Marines of all stripes and SoB by one.

 

Let's discuss.

 

As a durability faction, this definitely helps us. My idea of the faction is to lean into that durability, so I like this to make tough units like Gravis, Terminators, and T8 tanks (specifically the LR and Vindicator because they have 2+ saves) even tougher.

 

But I'm curious what everyone else is thiking.

[BLACK BLΠFLY]

Iron Hands are great for manipulating armor saves - like psysteel armor… terminators, cents and eliminators are all great choices now.

[zero88]

Psysteel plus the 5++ strat on a big old glob of Centurions is nice. 0+ save in the open means even -3 is a 3+ and -4 is a 4+. Put them in cover and it gets even sillier.

[BLACK BLΠFLY]

And strat for 5+++ shrugs. It’s crazy.

[Chaplain Augustus]

I've been playing 10 vanilla terminators and throwing down psysteel on them to great effect for a bit... Now they might be a little vulgar. It's not a bad thing though, IH should have a brutally tough unit no one else gets.

[9x19 Parabellum]

Played in a Tourney today using my Iron Hands.  Lost first game 42-54 against a SoB list just bristling with melta guns and won 2nd game against Deathwatch 88-58.  Had to miss final game because of dinner committment. My list was:

 

Jump Librarian (chief libby, neural shroud, psychic mastery, target protocols, force axe, bolt pistol, smite. psysteel, reforge)

Jump Chaplain (master of sanc, wise orator, littany hate, exhortation rage, canticle hate, tempered helm)

Primaris Techmarine

 

5 tacs, c-melta, melta, pfist

5 tacs, c-melta, melta, pfist

5 tacs, heavy bolter, chainsword

 

10 sternguard, power axe

10 terminators, 2 assault cannons, 8 chainswords, teleport homer

1 ironclad dread, 2 heavy flamers, 2 hkms, dreadnought weapon, chainfist, march of ancients, student of history

1 relic levi dread, grav flux, 3 hkm's, 2 twin volkite calivers, leviathan siegeclaw, melta gun, martial legacy

 

5 devastators, 3 lascannons, 1 missile, arm cher

 

1 drop pod

 

Armour of Contempt is amazing. makes a huge difference, but also for the 2 opponents I played against. 

However, it, along with RtFEtM did not prevent the SoB player from taking down my 10 man terminator unit on turn 1, even though he had to literally throw all his shooting at them AND the repentia squad.  (I didn't have the chance to get psysteel armor off on them).  Sadly that put me on the back foot on game 1 from which I never caught up.

Edited April 24, 2022 by 9x19 Parabellum

[Iron Father Ferrum]

I'm a simple man, I see a Firstborn list -- I leave a Like.

[BLACK BLΠFLY]

Played in a Tourney today using my Iron Hands.  Lost first game 42-54 against a SoB list just bristling with melta guns and won 2nd game against Deathwatch 88-58.  Had to miss final game because of dinner committment. My list was:

 

Jump Librarian (chief libby, neural shroud, psychic mastery, target protocols, force axe, bolt pistol, smite. psysteel, reforge)

Jump Chaplain (master of sanc, wise orator, littany hate, exhortation rage, canticle hate, tempered helm)

Primaris Techmarine

 

5 tacs, c-melta, melta, pfist

5 tacs, c-melta, melta, pfist

5 tacs, heavy bolter, chainsword

 

10 sternguard

10 terminators, 2 assault cannons, 8 chainswords, teleport homer

1 ironclad dread, 2 heavy flamers, 2 hkms, dreadnought weapon, chainfist, march of ancients, student of history

1 relic levi dread, grav flux, 3 hkm's, 2 twin volkite calivers, leviathan siegeclaw, melta gun, martial legacy

 

5 devastators, 3 lascannons, 1 missile, arm cher

 

1 drop pod

 

Armour of Contempt is amazing. makes a huge difference, but also for the 2 opponents I played against. 

However, it, along with RtFEtM did not prevent the SoB player from taking down my 10 man terminator unit on turn 1, even though he had to literally throw all his shooting at them AND the repentia squad.  (I didn't have the chance to get psysteel armor off on them).  Sadly that put me on the back foot on game 1 from which I never caught up.

-

I always deep strike my termies to prevent the alpha strike.

[9x19 Parabellum]

Black Bow....totally agree with you normally and see the case for it.  2 reasons I didn't yesterday:

 

1. I *wanted* my opponent(s) to shoot at my terminators, counting on the 1+ (in cover) armor saves, Reject the Flesh, Embrace the Machine stratagem, and Armour of Contempt special rules to keep me alive.  I just didn't count on THAT Much damage in the game against SoB.  My SoB opponent had....4 immolator, 2x2 bss, 10 ret squad, 6 paragon squad, = 24 melta gun shots that went into my termies, not to mention Vahl, and a crap ton of bolters, PLUS the repentia squad.  Too much beaucoup, as they say.

 

It worked good in the game against Deathwatch.  I lured him in with a couple units of shooting...then used RtFEtM when he put his Redemptor Dreads' shooting into them.  By that point it was too late for him to switch targets.  He killed 3 Terms turn 1, but they soaked most of his army's shooting, and i started reviving them each turn with Apothecary.  By the time the game ended, they were back to full strength and they had such board presence, there was nothing he could do to stop that huge mob.  

 

2. I didn't want to lose that first turn of shooting in devastator doctrine with 2 assault cannons (not to mention 32 bolter shots). 

I'm a simple man, I see a Firstborn list -- I leave a Like.

Thanks, IFF.  When I get my minis back from the game store (I left them there, I was running late to my own birthday party dinner :-) ) I'll get a photo of the final army and put it up here for you guys.

[Aothaine]

I’m a weirdo. I like the rule but damn it feels so powerful. It also ruins my second favorite weapon, the heavy bolter. But since scouts are no longer a troops choice it isn’t too big of a hit.

 

Others have covered the primary important bits. I wonder how this will affect iron hands alpha strike lists. Drop the infiltrate units mid field with those manned walkers and just stall the opponent. Then run like two squads of scouts in LSS to capture and contest back field objectives.. I get my book in a few weeks and I will then have a better idea of how this will affect us and how to use it.

[BLACK BLΠFLY]

The alpha strike is still strong ->

 

las AP4

plas AP4/5

melta AP5

[ADragonuFear]

I don't think the change completely saves things like centurions and land raiders but they're much more playable than before. The old stuff that was good is still good. Physic Fortress has become near obsolete, so our access to a save boosting power is excellent indeed. Keeping in mind other armies get this bonus too, I almost wonder if some assault gun hellblasters are in order, ap 4 volume might really help, and they can source rerolls from a dreadnought of ours in a pinch.

 

Otherwise, like other marines: terminators both regular, assault, and relic are going to be worth a look as a blunt force instrument.

[TheNewman]

On 5/22/2022 at 5:59 AM, ADragonuFear said:

I don't think the change completely saves things like centurions and land raiders but they're much more playable than before. The old stuff that was good is still good. Physic Fortress has become near obsolete, so our access to a save boosting power is excellent indeed. Keeping in mind other armies get this bonus too, I almost wonder if some assault gun hellblasters are in order, ap 4 volume might really help, and they can source rerolls from a dreadnought of ours in a pinch.

 

Otherwise, like other marines: terminators both regular, assault, and relic are going to be worth a look as a blunt force instrument.

I don't know about Psychic Fortress, I really think AoC breathes some life into Centurions for being able to spam 2+ on infantry that can benefit from cover but I've also consistently had a need for that 5++ to protect Redempters and the like from Ap4+ weapons.

 

Even a Tac squad in cover can wind up buried by Meltaguns.

Edited June 26, 2022 by TheNewman