***Cadian Horde Army (2000 pts)***

[Timelierentree8]

So I’m planning to buy up a full horde army for Astra Militarum and decided to make a list to work toward that. I have most of the models for this list but want to get some feedback before I buy more. I plan to take this to a local tournament at a con soon but I’ve really never played competitively, just to keep that in mind.

 

**Pregame stratagems**

Whiteshields (Detachment 1) (1CP)

Sanctioned Psykers (Detachment 1 and 2) (2CP)

Imperial Commander’s Armoury (Detatchment 2) (1CP)

 

**Detachments**

 

**Detatchment 1 (Battalion: Free)**

Regiment: Cadian

 

*HQ*

Creed (Warlord)

 

Company Commander with Kurov’s Aquila

 

Primaris Psyker with Mental Fortitude and Psychic Barrier

 

*Troops*

30 Whiteshield Conscripts

 

30 Whiteshield Conscripts

 

Infantry Squad with Vox, Lascannon, and Plasma Gun

 

Infantry Squad with Vox, Lascannon, and Plasma Gun

 

Infantry Squad with Vox, Lascannon, and Plasma Gun

 

Infantry Squad with Vox, Lascannon, and Plasma Gun

 

*Elites*

Command Squad with 4 meltaguns

 

Command Squad with 4 meltaguns

 

Special Weapon Squad with 3 meltaguns

 

*Heavy Support*

 

Heavy Weapon Squad with 3 Mortars

 

Heavy Weapon Squad with 3 Mortars

 

Heavy Weapon Squad with 3 Mortars

 

**Detatchment 2 (Battalion: -3CP)**

Regiment: Cadian

 

*HQ*

Company Commander with Laurel’s of Command

 

Company Commander

 

Primaris Psyker with Nightshroud and Psychic Barrier

 

*Troops*

 

Infantry Squad with Vox, Lascannon, and Plasma Gun

 

Infantry Squad with Vox, Lascannon, and Plasma Gun

 

Infantry Squad with Vox, Lascannon, and Plasma Gun

 

Infantry Squad with Vox, Lascannon, and Plasma Gun

 

Infantry Squad with Vox, Lascannon, and Plasma Gun

 

*Heavy Support*

Heavy Weapon Squad with 3 Mortars

 

**Detatchment 3 (Battalion: -3CP)**

Regiment: Lambdan Lions

 

*HQ*

 

Tempestor Prime with Command Rod

 

Tempestor Prime with Command Rod

 

*Troops*

 

Scion Squad with Plasma Pistol and 2 Plasma Guns

 

Scion Squad with Plasma Pistol and 2 Meltaguns

 

Scion Squad with Plasma Pistol and 2 Volley Guns

 

Scion Squad with Plasma Pistol and 2 Volley Guns

 

*Elites*

 

Scion Command Squad with 4 Plasma Guns

 

Scion Command Squad with 4 Meltaguns

 

**The Plan**

Basically, I divide my army into four parts

 

*The Advance*: Conscripts and Infantry with Psykers, Creed, and my melta squads behind them. Dedicated to taking ground. Use a combination of psychic powers (barrier, nightshroud and mental fortitude), cover and Take Cover! to make the first conscript squad difficult to reliably kill off, then when it’s dead, just march another one up and do it again (assuming it’s also not dead). Meanwhile the infantry and command squads just behind them pump FRFSRF/stationary Take Aim.

 

*My artillery*: My mortar teams with one officer placed as far back as possible to screen the back of my deployment zone and constantly dish out 12d6 indirect fire attacks with stationary Take Aim. Officer will be the one with Laurels so I can occasionally proc Bring It Down too.

 

*My Gun Line*: The rest of my infantry stands and two officers. Placed in in the centre of my deployment and in front of my artillery to hold my objective(s) and try to outgun my enemy. Also acts as reinforcement to for any of the other parts if needed.

 

*Deep Strikers*: Scions will drop over the course of the game specifically to achieve secondary objectives and kill key units, especially vehicles and monsters with Elimination Protocol Sanctioned.

 

**Weaknesses**

 

I’m running a horde army of T3 and mostly Av5+. I’m unlikely to have any staying power except for sheer numbers.

 

Speaking of sheer numbers, I am quite easy to take certain secondaries like assassinate against. Compounding this, I’m incredibly vulnerable to anything that can target my officers.

 

I die in melee like any guard gun line.

 

My mortars are incredibly fragile and thus vulnerable to other artillery even with the indirect fire nerf.

 

Depending on which orders I take on a specific turn, I can be slow or have less than ideal firepower, I don’t think I can do both.

[dchmp]

Do you really have that many models to field? I wish i did! I really like the idea of overwhelming body count and this fits that bill, and I think it could be effective.  Fielding commissars with this list I think would help, but they don't really help out our main problem of the enemy sneezing and 20 troops being blown away...

[Timelierentree8]

Nope, but I’ve paid for them and they should be arriving this month. I hope to bring this army to a local tournament later in the year. Hopefully guard will be the same or better by the time that happens!

 

I do have some Commissars. Any suggestions what I should drop to add them?

[dchmp]

I'd drop one of the HWTs giving you enough points for 3 f you decide they need to be included.   

[sairence]

Just a few quick points:

 

You can't take 4 HWTs in a tournament setting at 2k points due to the rule of 3.

 

150 mainline infantry isn't as hordy as you think at our statline. Expect to be out of most of them by turn 3.

 

Planning to have the Melta-Squads running up the board out in the open is pretty dangerous and leaves them exposed to getting picked off. If they don't have transports, you might consider putting them in strategic reserves. In which case rejigging the Plasma on them and the Melta on your IS might make sense.

 

I would retune the Scions. Take 2-3 barebones squads to do actions and upgrade the ones dedicated to damage to 10-man units so you can cram more special weapons on them. It makes them more focused and means some of the special weapons might survive to shoot more than once thanks to the extra ablative wounds.

 

I'm not sure the sanctioned psyker strat is worth it. Usually there's 1 or 2 key spells of your opponent you need to shut down to harm their gameplan, not everything they try to cast, unless you're against psychic-hravy armies that have better ways of boosting their stuff. So the extra denies are a bit of a luxury that probably won't pay off and reduces your CP even more.

Edited May 6, 2022 by sairence

[Timelierentree8]

I didn’t know about the Rule of Three, thanks for the heads up. I will probably drop the Psykers and one of the teams to take more platoon commanders and special weapons, stick them in reserve and outflank with them. Also commisars.

 

I’ll consider the Scion rejig but want to see how an entire detachment deep striking works before I buy more.

[sairence]

Honestly, I doubt Commissars will do much for you. They're pretty ineffective as units, the only real benefit you get is the Ld-ship bubble and that is going to come up maybe once or twice. And even then will not make a huge difference. If you have something else to spend the points on it's unfortunately going to be better 9 times ouf of 10.

[Timelierentree8]

Slightly breaking the “Horde” approach, I have it in my head to convert my excess heavy weapon sprues to Thudd Guns and circumnavigate my limit on mortar teams. They are really tough light vehicles I can stick with the rest of the back line. It would also allow me to use load fire reload with 12d6 st 5 attacks when I otherwise wouldn’t be able to in this army (as potentially the only vehicle unit in the army.

[Emperor Ming]

If you have them, then yeah the thudd guns is a good idea

 

Not sure I would be buying them from fw

 

Commissars are trash worse than trash probably poor guard atm

[Commisar Necros]

I have 2 thudds and am printing a third, they are amazing little damage engines. Couple notes for them, they are not infantry and wont get orders benefits except from the TC. So I've found their dpr can be slightly lower than mortars for the points, but they are a lightning rod for your opponents. As soon as you smack 24 dice down for a single model they will send someone to kill it. Its weak and cant move so be prepared for that. I would also point you towards veterans over command squads or SWS. The extra bodies will help the SW survive and can be a great pick for the dagger. Sairence is right, I play hordey(around 130 models) and by turn 3 it is thin. I haven't had a chance to play since the upgrade to shooting, but lethality wont help those 3t5+ guardsmen live much longer. If you haven't bought them yet i may ditch the scions and just add more footsloggers, maybe another conscript blob.

 

Also commissars will only hurt you. Assume you lose 10 guys in a conscript squad and them take the test, you will of course fail. All the commissar will do is kill a guy before you re-roll and fail again and are back to one with 11 guys missing now. If they need to definitely pass, spend the CP.

 

Also welcome to the Guard! A huge company of infantry is always appreciated. Have you started painting yet or is everything in transit?

[Timelierentree8]

Something I would add in favour of Cadian Thudd Guns: they will always get the re-roll 1s to hit and a squad of three is eligible for Load-Fire-Reload. Might circumvent that drop in damage a bit.

 

I have currently changed my list for my upcoming tournament to include three Tank Commanders (including Gatekeeper) in place of the Scions. Drop the extra heavy weapons for more raw damage, at least in my mind. Sadly I only have battle cannons and heavy bolters for these ones but I still like it.

 

Half is painted already, I have another 50 or so yet to paint this weekend

Edited May 17, 2022 by Timelierentree8

[Commisar Necros]

I never thought of FRF that could help quite a bit especially a full battery of them. Good luck and keep on painting. I just finished the bases for my whole army and am working my way through the bodies. So congrats on that many painted at all, its an achievement! I run all HB sponsons on my tank commanders. You'll lose bodies here (like your opponent will notice) but the three will ad a huge amount of lethality to your army.

 

Post some pictures in the guard sub-forum too if you haven't, if you paint 50 in a weekend I may be guilty enough to try the same.

[Timelierentree8]

Update on my tournament. Got utterly destroyed in both my games (got a by in the second round). Played against 2 Mont’ka Tau armies and got alpha striked into oblivion both times. Thankfully my mortars put the fear of god into both opponents so I think I will focus on indirect fire for my next list. Will put up pictures of my army and both game set ups in the Astra Militarum section later. Edited May 30, 2022 by Timelierentree8