Newly Inducted Battle Brother has questions about armaments

[brother_b]

I'm a loooong time player of 40K. Most of my reps were in Rogue Trader to 2nd/3rd until my return to 8th and 9th.

Horus Heresy 2.0 looked too awesome to miss, especially after I watched some battle reports.

I'm interested in getting a little guidance on some weaponry that's not familiar to me:

•   volkite calivers, volkite chargers,  and rotor cannons

Rotor cannons look underwhelming, but they have pinning. I'm guessing that's a good thing. Most of my opponents in the area look like they'll be rocking power armor so is there something else I could do with these? I'm going to run Blood Angels, and I know they can take special assault weapons. Can I use these as a stand in?

Volkite?! This feels like something my 40K Stygies Warlord would dream about!

What should I do with the volkite? Do they have preferred uses, targets, etc? Which one is better, or are they both best suited to different roles?

I'll likely return to this thread as new weapon options become available in the heavy weapon packs.

Take care, all and thank you!

[mooftak]

Volkite tends to have shorter range and slightly higher strength than a bolter they can replace, though their AP is 5, so marines will get a save. They also have the deflagrate rule. After hits, wounds, and saves are done, any unsaved wounds generate another hit to resolve (so wound and save steps, from my understanding). You're generally wounding marines on 3s before any bonuses. For my Night Lords, volkite chargers are also assault 2, so I can shoot an enemy before charging so hopefully I can outnumber them in melee. If the target has already lost some bodies, then I might get my legion bonus for shooting too, so wounding on 2s. My understanding / view is that the point of volkite is to drown the enemy in saves. Dice be dice, they'll usually lose some dudes.

 

To those with more experience, please correct anything I've gotten wrong or add additional insight as you have it.

[The Scorpion]

Blood Angel players have used rotor cannons to represent Assault Cannons since 1.0

I say you're kino if you proxy one gatling gun for another.

[Spagunk]

As a BA player, you NEED pinning. A bunch of traitor armies have specific ways to prevent you from getting your charge/charge bonus so you need to shut down reaction via pinning. Otherwise it's frag missiles and various frag based weapons (grenade discharger for Dawnbreakers).

 

[Varyn]

Bear in mind that rotor cannons cause pinning checks at -1LD due to the shellshock(1) rule, which makes them a cheap way of causing pinning checks, plus the weight of fire means you have a reasonable chance of causing a couple of wounds.

[MichaelCarmine]

In general - all of these Weapons are really good and no waste of points.

Volcite Caliver and Rotor Cannons got buffed since the last Edition and are a real competitor to all the other Special weapons.

Caliver has Str. 6 and 3 shots - Heavy though... My go to-weapon for Tactical Support Squad for my Raven Guard.

Rotor Cannon - Assault 4, pinning, Shellshock (1). Str. 3 is the downside, but by the weight of fire, you're gonna wound something. And since the Leadership of most Units in the Game dropped 1 notch, Shellshock (1) is a big deal! 

 But  - for Blood Angels / Imperial Fists, i'd rather go with Assaultcannons ^^

[Xenith]

First support squad I built for my Alphas was a Caliver unit - 30", S6 3 shots. You're wounding marines on 2+ so something will go through the armour, but it's more rule of cool than anything. I want to keep you at arms length though, chargers may be better Choom for Blood Angels, but as others have said, you can proxy the rotors as assault cannons, which are superior to most things! 

[brother_b]

Obviously I have no experience with HH but it feels like basic tactical squads and tactical support squads will be necessary for the assault elements to be fully effective.

I’ll likely make some rotor and caliber support squads first. 
 

what about volkite chargers, anybody have input on them?

[bushman101]

I want to like volkite chargers, but the points feel better on something like melta that will definitely punch through armor

[Arkhanist]

Volkite is an anti-infantry weapon. The caliver and culverin are basically cheap better bolters and heavy bolters respectively (though heavy), and should be used as such - deflagrate is nice, where you get an extra automatic hit for each unsaved wound, plus the greater range and strength. You're relying on weight of fire rather than AP. They're not super weapons, but for chipping down enemy Line troops more effectively. The charger is trickier, because of only 15" range. Think of them as better shotguns is probably the easiest, and if given to a tactical support squad is worth considering also giving them all chainswords given they're going to be quite close to the enemy. I'm quite tempted to take a cheap squad or two in rhinos with chargers and chainaxes for my WE to soften up targets (and potentially draw out a reaction) before the heavy hitters go in, or take on less threatening targets on their own with a choom and charge. Plus I think they'd be pretty tasty in the new zone mortalis. Pinning will also be needed to prep the ground for critical charges due to reactions from what I've seen, so I'll be taking some of that too. World Eaters with guns needing to fight tactically, whatever next...

Melta has armourbane against vehicles and dreads, now much more effective as widespread armoured ceramite is gone, so those should be its target of choice (though for a tactical support squad, range means you may not live long afterwards!). Plasma remain as the middle ground option - effective against marines with breaching, but also high enough strength to threaten light vehicles, but you pay extra for that compared to volkite.

Note, I'm new to heresy, so this is just theorycrafting so far - I'd welcome thoughts from more experienced frater!

Edited July 2, 2022 by Arkhanist

[Mandragola]

I don’t generally rate tactical support squads all that highly. The problem is that they’re a troop unit that isn’t Line, meaning they can’t score objectives. I don’t think they’re especially greets at their job (or jobs, as that depends on their equipment). I’d therefore prefer to take Line units as troops and have other stuff to do the jobs tactical support squads might have done. 
 

for pinning I think recon squads with nemesis bolters look good, particularly as they’ll also remove apothecaries and sergeants. They also score and infiltrate, which is great. And the basic ones with shotguns bring concussive, which has a chance to help enormously when you do assault. 
 

I quite like combi-weapons. The minor ones that’s rent one-shot are cool as they can effectively double a unit’s firepower, or more. These seem very good on things like terminators. 

[Dont-Be-Haten]

6 hours ago, brother_b said:

Obviously I have no experience with HH but it feels like basic tactical squads and tactical support squads will be necessary for the assault elements to be fully effective.

I’ll likely make some rotor and caliber support squads first. 
 

what about volkite chargers, anybody have input on them?

There is more balance in HH as your statistical probability is easier to calculate on the fly than in 40k.

Weight of dice wins the day against MEQ. Ergo whatever forces the most saves. 3 wounds usually equates to a dead marine, usually. So you don't have to stress as much about AP values.

Plus you have all these new secondary abilities on weapons that alter AP or another aspect of the game.