Are Assault Squads good now?

[Xenith]

With the release of the '22 field Manual, many models didnt drop in points, however their wargear did. One of these was the assault squad, with most options becoming free, which is ace.

 

Now you can get 5 assault marines, 2 plasma pistols, eviscerator, plasma pistol + combat shield and power sword on the sergeant for 95pts. Previously this would have been what, 125? You can also go 2x flamer for 90, or 2x melta for 100. It might not seem massive, but with the defensive buff from AoC, and now cheaper damage output, I think they deserve another look. Thoughts?

[Bonzi]

I think at their current points you can take them without feeling bad about it, but I don't think there is much special about them.  They don't have enough attacks to be a melee threat and Death Co or Sanguard are better at that.  Their shooting isn't good enough to threaten much of anything (2 melta shots isn't enough to reliably kill vehicles and it isn't enough shots to be good vs elite infantry). For the points Eliminators, Eradicators, or Inceptors will deliver way more bang for the buck.  The one special thing they have going for them is their access to the meltabomb strat for 2d3 mortals vs vehicles.

Every time I put them in a list, I end up feeling like I would rather have something else.  Honestly they need a little rule spice to help them out.  Something that makes them better when assaulting units holding objectives or preventing units from performing actions when they are near.

[Helias_Tancred]

2 hours ago, Xenith said:

With the release of the '22 field Manual, many models didnt drop in points, however their wargear did. One of these was the assault squad, with most options becoming free, which is ace.

 

Now you can get 5 assault marines, 2 plasma pistols, eviscerator, plasma pistol + combat shield and power sword on the sergeant for 95pts. Previously this would have been what, 125? You can also go 2x flamer for 90, or 2x melta for 100. It might not seem massive, but with the defensive buff from AoC, and now cheaper damage output, I think they deserve another look. Thoughts?

I think you're on to a good idea. Was that point total including jump pack or not? Regardless I like to run a 5 man squad or two for mobility, some high S weapon fire (melta) and the recent changes such as AoC makes them better.  They're not going to curb stomp enemy units but they are a useful tool in your list.

 

[keeblerartillery]

I think it depends on how you use them. With relentless assault plus some other kind of forward threat (DC or drop pod) that is one more unit the enemy has to screen out or risk giving up significant points. Plus they can come down and either perform an action or even threaten an objective. I think they have a lot of potential utility

[MasterOfAardvarks]

I think that Bonzi is right, some rule to disrupt an opponent would make them standout, maybe letting them use the stratagem 'Terror Troops' that prevents enemy units from ObSec and Actions?

The fact that they have the <Melta Bombs> keyword is useful for hurting tanks, I just wish it weren't expensive to keep popping it.

[Medjugorje]

3 plasma pistoles, one for the searge + 2 as normal option^^

[The Unseen]

They are in fact great for taking 6 of them, and using them to Retrieve Data or whatever Nephilim calls it.

6 so the action can't fail, and now that their jump packs are free they are I think the cheapest thing that can natively deep strike and do actions for marines.

And while their melee damage isn't anything much, it'll still chew up a lot of armies backfield objective holders if they aren't taken care of.

Throw a (free] power sword on the sarge and some super cheap melta for some cheeky character vaporizing and you have yourself a nice utility unit.

[Inquisitor_Lensoven]

13 hours ago, Bonzi said:

I think at their current points you can take them without feeling bad about it, but I don't think there is much special about them.  They don't have enough attacks to be a melee threat and Death Co or Sanguard are better at that.  Their shooting isn't good enough to threaten much of anything (2 melta shots isn't enough to reliably kill vehicles and it isn't enough shots to be good vs elite infantry). For the points Eliminators, Eradicators, or Inceptors will deliver way more bang for the buck.  The one special thing they have going for them is their access to the meltabomb strat for 2d3 mortals vs vehicles.

Every time I put them in a list, I end up feeling like I would rather have something else.  Honestly they need a little rule spice to help them out.  Something that makes them better when assaulting units holding objectives or preventing units from performing actions when they are near.

This seems like a weirdly narrow point of view.

they can take more gun options than melta guns…2 plasma guns and a plasma pistol will do work against most targets when in pistol range…

[Karhedron]

For 100 points, you can get a 5-man squad with 2 melta guns, inferno pistol and power sword on the Sergeant, high movement and arrival from Reserves. I prefer melta over plasma simply because I have plenty of Plasma Inceptors to fill that role.

That seems like a pretty good deal to me. Sure you can go plasma and/or bump them up to 6 for RND but the basic point still stands. They are great for secondaries and flexibility and they pack an OK punch for their points. Eradicators will deliver more melta and Inceptors more plasma (although at a higher price) but you don't want those units wasting time scoring if you can help it. They are also mono-tasked. For 100 points, an Assault Squad can do a lot of scoring and still contribute to the battle at a pinch.

[Inquisitor_Lensoven]

And this is why I don’t worry about the current meta.

a year ago no one had a nice thing to say about assault squads, now most everyone is agreeing that they’re pretty good, not great, but pretty good.

[Karhedron]

I normally run a squad of Plasma Inceptors and a trio of MM attack bikes meaning I do have a spare FA slot, I can certainly think of worse things to put in it. My Whirlwind is looking a bit sad with the changes to Indirect fire so perhaps it is time to return it to the forge and dust off my 7th edition RAS.

[Tokugawa]

With new free wargears they can make pretty good trades. But with only basic A1 , few special melee wargears and no shield, they are not the type of unit which could do heavy-lifting jobs. Expect to see minimum cost units as mission enablers.

[Inquisitor_Lensoven]

13 hours ago, Tokugawa said:

With new free wargears they can make pretty good trades. But with only basic A1 , few special melee wargears and no shield, they are not the type of unit which could do heavy-lifting jobs. Expect to see minimum cost units as mission enablers.

I see them as units that either soften up an enemy unit, or cleans up an enemy unit…unless we’re talking about like a guard infantry squad or something.

[Dont-Be-Haten]

I would take 2 assault squads in my classic lists either way. Being able to take them for less points is more fun. 

A blood company sounds like a blast as does going back to 7th style formations like a BSF or DCSF with axillary fly boys.

Definitely been wanting to break out the first born lately. And 20 ASM sounds amazing.

[Xenith]

108pt unit for 6 models that can reliably claim table quarters and perform actions seems good to me, even if you discount the melee ability. Assault squads havent been ok since like 4th ed anyway, and for BA they've always been better at mobile gun platforms as opposed to assault units, for which we have much better options. A tri-plasma squad dropping in somewhere will always be a threat to things also, and melta cannot be ignored. 

The last assault squad I built, inferno, power fist, 2x eviscarators, 2x melta, is now 205pts. Not incredible, but much  much better than it was. Combat squadding, the 2x Evi+Fist unit could put a dent in something.