Craftworld Civilian Armies

[Verbal Underbelly]

I'm currently doing a small side project based on Saim Hann. I like aspect warriors but was wondering if leaning heavily on the civilians is viable? I'm wanting to use guardians (defenders and storm), jet bikes, vypers and a selection of hover tanks. Am I asking for trouble or can I have fun with these units? 

I don't play in tournaments so I'm not looking for bleeding edge competitiveness but neither do I want to lose every game. 

[Karhedron]

Ah, my favourite hobby horse!

Bikes and hover tanks are the Aeldari's bread and butter. Sadly the same cannot be said of Guardians. Guardian Defenders are relatively fragile for Troops and pretty poor to boot. Tau Fire Warriors have nearly double the range on their guns so can sit back and shoot from safety. Imperial Guard are even lower quality but are much cheaper and so can be spammed. Taking 10 Guardians with a heavy weapon to use as Objective campers is not a great return on investment.

Storm guardians are slightly cheaper but have all the melee hitting power of a wet noodle. You can take the Serpent Scale shield to give them a 5++ but it still does not make them great.

Rangers are probably the best Troop option in the codex but they are quite fragile. At least they are also cheap, long ranged and have some deployment options.

I was bitterly disappointed when they moved Avengers to Elites as they were my go-to Troop unit. Previously it was possible to run an all-Aspect Swordwind army in a Battalion detachment but now that option is gone.

One unit that is worth looking at are Support Batteries. These actually make great Objective campers as they are quite durable and 2 of the options have decently long range.

In summary, the Troops section of our codex is pretty disappointing which makes running a Battalion hard unless you go 3 x 5 Rangers (which is the usual competitive option). The other choice is take the hit on CPs and run something like an Outrider or Spearhead Detachment. It will cost you 3CPs but save you points on Troops that can be spent on more effective units. You can always add a Patrol detachment of an extra Rangers and HQ which will give you some added flexibility while not costing any further CPs.

[Verbal Underbelly]

Thanks for the insight. I had a feeling the storm guardians were going to be poor. It's such a shame because the newly sculpted elements (sword arms, heads etc.) look fantastic. Tempted to collect a bunch of them to convert into other types of units. I have a feeling I could create some decent fire dragons from this kit with a little extra sculpting. 

I was considering the artillery pieces, which actual gun is best? I was leaning towards the shadow weaver but the nerf to indirect fire makes it a lot less interesting. 

Really want a falcon, a vyper and a few wind riders. Thinking of taking the wind riders unupgraded - heavy weapons feel like a waste of their abilities.

Edited September 25, 2022 by Verbal Underbelly

[Verbal Underbelly]

This is what my first 500 points is going to look like. 

Farseer Skyrunner: Doom, Crushing Orb, Singing Spear

10 Guardian Defenders: Bright Lance

Wraithlord: 2 x Shuriken Catapult, Bright Lance, Ghostglaive

Vyper: Bright Lance

3 Windrider:  Twin Shuriken Catapults

Edited September 25, 2022 by Verbal Underbelly

[Iron Father Ferrum]

While I won't argue against @Karhedron 's points from a tournament perspective -- because they're absolutely correct -- I will add that there are ways to run a Guardian-heavy army that gives you options and still having some punch.  Both types of Guardians have innate abilities that trigger RR1s to hit, which allows them to be somewhat independent from supporting HQs.  Add to those abilities the stratagem that gives one Guardian squad RR1s to hit, and if you're playing Ulthwé you also have the +1 to hit for Guardians stratagems.  They all benefit greatly from Doom, Guide, Fortune, Will of Asuryan, Conceal, and Protect.  Storm Guardians are not especially strong, but Enhance and Empower both strengthen them a little.  My point being that if you really want to go heavy on Guardian units, an Ulthwé-style list (even if you don't take Ulthwé) that takes a LOT of Guardians and a LOT of psykers is going to be the best way to run them.

 

If leaning into this theme, bear in mind that while the Heavy Platforms and Windriders do have the Guardian keyword, Vypers and War Walkers do not.

[Verbal Underbelly]

Amazing thank you. 

So they can't work well in a vacuum and require psychic support. Totally makes sense in an eldar army. I've never played eldar before and am approaching this project from a love of the models perspective. I'll have a few aspect warriors but I want to use them as seasoning - not the main ingredient.

Building on the above, what weapons are worthwhile on war walkers and support platforms please? I'm taking bright lances elsewhere...

[Karhedron]

14 minutes ago, Verbal Underbelly said:

Building on the above, what weapons are worthwhile on war walkers and support platforms please? I'm taking bright lances elsewhere...

I like to sprinkle some Starcannons through my lists simply because a weapon that can kill Marines fairly efficiently is never going to be a bad idea. They can also threaten lighter vehicles at a pinch.

[Karhedron]

3 hours ago, Verbal Underbelly said:

I was considering the artillery pieces, which actual gun is best? I was leaning towards the shadow weaver but the nerf to indirect fire makes it a lot less interesting. 

Priori to the indirect fire nerf, I would have said Shadow Weavers since they are both cheap and long-ranged. Even now the Ap-2 means they are not a total loss, even when firing indirect. 135 points for a unit that can get an average of 10 S6 shots at any target within 48", even without LOS is not too shabby. Targetting Marines out of LOS is going to be hard work but you should still get a kill or two,

Vibro cannons don't really do it for me since they rely on LOS. However 3D6 Autocannon shots is not too shabby.

The D-Cannon is an iconic weapon but has much shorter range. Best thing to do it position it within 24" of an Objective (preerffably 2) but without LOS. Any enemy units trying to take either Objective will face horrendous weight of fire. However this option is less valuable for camping on your own Objective simply because you want to put where it can hose enmy off other Objectives, It is more of a denial weapon than the other 2.