Guard reveals

[Focslain]

So liking what I'm seeing so far. If correct I could just take Iron Hand Straken in a general guard force and his still good, same for all the special characters. 

Also a unit of 'counts as' DKoK for mid-field objective holding seems neat.

 

I watched the AT video and there was no mention of conscripts outside of the note they are now white shields, but no review of the unit. I have a friend that put a lot of time and effort into a conscript penal legion and like to assure him that his army hasn't just be made completely unusable. 

 

Anyone have info on the white shields?

[Galron]

I like the new codex so far. Tempestus sound awesome since we essentially get all the good traits baked in but lack the special weapon specialization we had. The only other disappointing part is they didnt make an exception for guard/tempestus for the number of aircraft. This means my air cav tempestus still cant take part in non-friendly games like leagues. :(  I really hate taurox winnebagos. 

 

My mech infantry seem pretty good. My all infantry will be interesting and it looks like it will be pretty easy to make the cut over.

 

Shadowswords.... holy crap

[Emperor Ming]

3 hours ago, Focslain said:

Anyone have info on the white shields?

 

Gone, no mentions, no proxy datasheets, or anything like that, just gone

 

I never liked conscripts anyway, guard in themselves are conscripts

[Inquisitor_Lensoven]

3 hours ago, Focslain said:

So liking what I'm seeing so far. If correct I could just take Iron Hand Straken in a general guard force and his still good, same for all the special characters. 

Also a unit of 'counts as' DKoK for mid-field objective holding seems neat.

 

I watched the AT video and there was no mention of conscripts outside of the note they are now white shields, but no review of the unit. I have a friend that put a lot of time and effort into a conscript penal legion and like to assure him that his army hasn't just be made completely unusable. 

 

Anyone have info on the white shields?

It’s not unusable. He just needs to break up the blocks of infantry and put a sgt in the squads. 

the squads are then conscripts or whatever else you want them to be.

 

tbh the conscript unit never made sense to me. I haven’t seen anything that has stated most if not almost all guardsmen are draftees of some sort with very few volunteers.

[Focslain]

1 hour ago, Inquisitor_Lensoven said:

It’s not unusable. He just needs to break up the blocks of infantry and put a sgt in the squads. 

the squads are then conscripts or whatever else you want them to be.

 

tbh the conscript unit never made sense to me. I haven’t seen anything that has stated most if not almost all guardsmen are draftees of some sort with very few volunteers.

Think it had to do with training, but even then some training was very light for some regiments. Going to have to figure out how he can field a Brigade then, man ran three full blocks of convicts in 1K games.

[Inquisitor_Lensoven]

20 minutes ago, Focslain said:

Think it had to do with training, but even then some training was very light for some regiments. Going to have to figure out how he can field a Brigade then, man ran three full blocks of convicts in 1K games.

Break them down into 9 man squads, add a ‘warden’ to each. 

[jarms48]

5 hours ago, Galron said:

I like the new codex so far. Tempestus sound awesome since we essentially get all the good traits baked in but lack the special weapon specialization we had. 

 

The problem is, Kasrkins get all this too and 3 regiment traits. Scions are still okay in a regular Guard force as action monkeys. Pure scions are bad though. There's just no flexibility now.

[Emperor Ming]

23 minutes ago, jarms48 said:

 

The problem is, Kasrkins get all this too and 3 regiment traits. Scions are still okay in a regular Guard force as action monkeys. Pure scions are bad though. There's just no flexibility now.

Yep and the taurox prime didn't need nerfs

[Inquisitor_Lensoven]

1 hour ago, Emperor Ming said:

Yep and the taurox prime didn't need nerfs

The base taurox needs some sort of buffs to make it competitive no too.

 

i just don’t see a reason to take it now that the ML has gotten buffed.

[jarms48]

16 minutes ago, Inquisitor_Lensoven said:

The base taurox needs some sort of buffs to make it competitive no too.

 

i just don’t see a reason to take it now that the ML has gotten buffed.

 

Regular Taurox is actually really good now. It's a faster, budget transport, with armoured tracks for free. 

  

1 hour ago, Emperor Ming said:

Yep and the taurox prime didn't need nerfs

 

Taurox Prime on the other hand, yeah, it's definitely got the raw end of the deal. Taurox Battle Cannon is still trash, they didn't even give it D3+3 shots. The only real options is between the Gatling and Missile Launcher. Gatling Prime did drop 10 points and got AP-1 base, but if you were using Primes with Lambdan Lions it's just a flat nerf. Missile Launcher got better simply for dropping 20 points but it's still a missile launcher. It would have been nice if they got the turret weapon rule at least. 

Edited November 16, 2022 by jarms48

[Inquisitor_Lensoven]

3 hours ago, jarms48 said:

 

Regular Taurox is actually really good now. It's a faster, budget transport, with armoured tracks for free. 

It’s faster but more likely to die, and I feel like less likely to do any meaningful damage.

lethality is still an issue, so a very lightly transport doesn’t seem to make much sense especially since it’s unlikely to do much to something at its own level of durability.

 

it they’re like 3/4 of the points of a chimera maybe.

Edited November 16, 2022 by Inquisitor_Lensoven

[jarms48]

7 hours ago, Inquisitor_Lensoven said:

It’s faster but more likely to die, and I feel like less likely to do any meaningful damage.

lethality is still an issue, so a very lightly transport doesn’t seem to make much sense especially since it’s unlikely to do much to something at its own level of durability.

 

You've just pointed out 2 things it doesn't need to do. It's a cheap vehicle to use the mechanised doctrine on and it's a cheap vehicle to use the count as 5 models on. 

[Emperor Ming]

I'm conflicted on transports, like chimeras for example, 15pts and you get another squad of kasarkin, well I'd rather have extra kasarkin

[Shamansky]

1 hour ago, Emperor Ming said:

I'm conflicted on transports, like chimeras for example, 15pts and you get another squad of kasarkin, well I'd rather have extra kasarkin

That has become the inner conflict for many since geedubs welded the firepoints on transports

Edited November 16, 2022 by Shamansky

[TCC]

1 hour ago, Emperor Ming said:

I'm conflicted on transports, like chimeras for example, 15pts and you get another squad of kasarkin, well I'd rather have extra kasarkin

I use them for the movement and protection, the new rules allow you to dismount after movement which is also very tempting. But I agree, is it better to have more infantry… I guess that’s why I generally only run the one chimera in my recent lists. 

[Inquisitor_Lensoven]

5 hours ago, jarms48 said:

 

You've just pointed out 2 things it doesn't need to do. It's a cheap vehicle to use the mechanised doctrine on and it's a cheap vehicle to use the count as 5 models on. 

I guess I just like being able to use a transport as a gun truck after disembarking (if it has the fire power potential.)

[jarms48]

On 11/16/2022 at 9:51 PM, Emperor Ming said:

I'm conflicted on transports, like chimeras for example, 15pts and you get another squad of kasarkin, well I'd rather have extra kasarkin

 

But you see, with mechanised you can move the chimera 12 inches or taurox 14 inches, deploy out 3 inches, get orders from an officer if they have a transport, blow something apart, then use the mount up stratagem to get back in.  

Edited November 21, 2022 by jarms48

[sairence]

I think Tauroxes might have some play now for mechanised forces. Faster, smaller...the loss of 2 crew slots isn't so relevant with decent Vox, neither is the lack of firepower. And looks like a cheaper option to the venerable pill box that is the Chimera. It's less durable but should hold up long enough to get troops to where they need to get. Which is the main purpose here. Might finally have to build mine...

[Inquisitor_Lensoven]

4 hours ago, sairence said:

I think Tauroxes might have some play now for mechanised forces. Faster, smaller...the loss of 2 crew slots isn't so relevant with decent Vox, neither is the lack of firepower. And looks like a cheaper option to the venerable pill box that is the Chimera. It's less durable but should hold up long enough to get troops to where they need to get. Which is the main purpose here. Might finally have to build mine...

At only 15pts less i just don’t think the taurox is cheap enough to justify less durability and less firepower.

[sairence]

4 hours ago, Inquisitor_Lensoven said:

At only 15pts less i just don’t think the taurox is cheap enough to justify less durability and less firepower.

 

Maybe...but I've never taken a Chimera for its guns. I've taken them to get squads to objectives. If there's a cheaper, faster option it's worth considering. I'll be testing them out at least. :)

[Inquisitor_Lensoven]

34 minutes ago, sairence said:

 

Maybe...but I've never taken a Chimera for its guns. I've taken them to get squads to objectives. If there's a cheaper, faster option it's worth considering. I'll be testing them out at least. :)

You may not have been taking it for it’s guns but you’re paying the points for the guns on both all the same.

if the transport manages to survive doing its main job, I’d like it to be as useful as possible because it likely won’t survive much longer than that. I’ll want it to count.

[jarms48]

10 hours ago, Inquisitor_Lensoven said:

At only 15pts less i just don’t think the taurox is cheap enough to justify less durability and less firepower.

Free armoured tracks and faster speed too remember.

[INKS]

I think if my goal is to move troops then I would consider a Taurox. If I need to command from it as well then a Chimera. 15 pts doesn't seem like much but it buys sponsons for my Russ's in my armored company 2k list.

[Inquisitor_Lensoven]

On 11/16/2022 at 3:31 AM, jarms48 said:

 

You've just pointed out 2 things it doesn't need to do. It's a cheap vehicle to use the mechanised doctrine on and it's a cheap vehicle to use the count as 5 models on. 

Doesn’t really matter if it counts as 5 models on an objective if it’s destroyed before that model count can matter. 
 

 

20 hours ago, jarms48 said:

Free armoured tracks and faster speed too remember.

Armored tracks only effects AP-1 weapons, doesn’t help much against most weapons that would be shooting at it.

faster is nice, but on these smaller tables that extra speed isn’t that great of a boost. It’ll be roughly 14” to the midfield objectives. That means a 10” move and disembarking 3” ahead  the infantry will be within range to control the objective. If it’s not, advancing the chimera guarantees it’ll be in range for that objective. 

[Karhedron]

19 hours ago, Inquisitor_Lensoven said:

Doesn’t really matter if it counts as 5 models on an objective if it’s destroyed before that model count can matter. 

 

Park it on an Objective and it is 10 T3 3+ wounds that your opponents have to chew through. They can't simply flip that Objective by charging in some Troops to tie up the Chimera.

 

Of course it is not that hard to kill a Chimera but it takes some anti-tank firepower which is then not firing at your better tanks. Force your opponents to choose between shooting the stuff that is killing them or the stuff that is scoring you points. The more difficult choices you force an opponent to make, the more likely they are to make a mistake.