Alpharius-Omegon & The Alpha legion - just curious thoughs

[Commander Nicky]

Hello Fellows

 

So I have some thoughts about Alpharius Omegon and the Alpha Legion that I would like to share. Some of it is pure speculations and I need to stress out how HUGH a fan of the Alpha Legion I am (or was) before Pratorian of Dorn, althrough in retrospectrum, I should have seen it coming.

Some of the questions I always have been thinking about when considering the Alpha Legion and their Primarch(s) are:

• How was the Legion structured/organized?
• How was their command structure?
• Who were the senior officers?
• What was the individual ambitions of it members?
• What was the sacrifies the Legion and it members made?
• Was there any friction or rivalry between officers?
• Was there any fractions within the Legion?
• What was the difference between the Legion before/during GC, during the Heresy and after the Heresy?
• What was the difference between the Legion once Alpharius Omegon vanished?
• What was the impact the rivialry between Alpharius and Omegon had on The Legion?

I think these are quit relevant questions to ask as, once you dig into them, it kind of gives an interesting picuture of the Legion and their Primarch(s). To make it simpler, I will adress the Primarch who landed on Terra as "The First" and the one who was found at Bar'Savor as "The Later"

So here are my thoughts and please be mindfull that some of its are questional.

• How was the Legion structured/organized?

To answer this question, you will have to ask yourself: How in an organization (of any kind) structured? When dealing and organizing people, you need to allocate responsibility to determines which individuals get to participate in which decision-making processes, and thus to what extent their views shape the organization's actions. Each member needs to know who has what responsibility and to what extend. In simpler terms, you need to know who is who, from the humble line soldier to the leader in command of a Legion. At least in plain terms. You cannot allocate responsibility if there is no structure and no one knows who has what responsibility. This includes the Alpha Legion. Without knowing their leader, there would be no structure.

It is therefore clear, that the Alpha Legion was structured in some way, unknown to the outsiders of the Legion itself. However the Alpha Legion's organize structure was radical different from other military structures. In an ordinary military structure you would have pyramid or three shaped structure; different levels, each with their own representative and leaders, area of responsibility who knows who to defere to. At the apex of the three/pyramid, we would have the Legion Master. At the next level, we would have his deputies, the next level their vice and so on until we have a manager responsible for a team (a sergeant and a squad).

In my guess, in the case of the Alpha Legion, we instead have a flat organiational structure with, in the center, the Legion Master of the Alpha Legion (Alpharius). He would be the force of gravity for the legion to center around. This "codename" for the Legion Master of the Alpha Legion, Alpharius, was always the center of their structure. His idendity was something he or any of his legionaries would take up and play according to their goals. Most notible The First Primarch found and then the Later Primarch found were the primary holders of that codename. But in realistic view, any officer could have played and did play Alpharius, at one time or another. This several practical purposes; ensures that it satisfies many of the needsof its members in terms of autonomy and self-realization, it elevates the level of responsibility of baseline legionaries and eliminating layers of middle leaders by reaching all personnel involved in decisions more quickly, andit enables officers-in-training to take terms and be play an acting or senior officer - thereby molding them into one.

 

Spoiler

A prominement example would be in the book Legion where Lord Commander Namatjira is hosting a dinner for Alpharius, Ingo Pech, Mathias Herzog ,and Omegon. Fair to say, none of these legionaries are who they appear. Omegon, as is told in the book, is in fact Sheed Ranko, a senior officer in the legion. The "Alpharius" Namatjira meets, who is stated to be Omegon, is not the real Omegon either. This individual is/would propely have been a middle ranked officer, either a sergeant (prime) or centurion, while the two members playing Pech and Herzog were rank and file members, most likely Headhunters. Ranko, the seniormost member of the delegation, played the role of a bodyguard as a cover to observed what was unfolding behind the sceen and would be able to observe (from a distance) how things unfoulded, only interacting if he deemed it necessary to do so. "Omegon" would act and improvises as good he could, playing the role of Legion Master (he had properly rehearsed beforehand) and would only signal support from Ranko if his sence his"mask" was faltering. A final note, the two legionaires  John Grammaticus and Peto Soneka meets when Soneka turns Grammaticus in to the Alpha Legion are the same as at the dinner... Their real names are just not Herzog and Pech... we never meet the real Herzog and Pech in Legion).
 

That is why the Alpha Legion was so effective when it was still a small legion; numbering only a few thousand legionaries and why they reveal themself later, why they HAD to reveal themself later on - They become too big to maintain their flat organization (I will get back to that later on).

Two things must have had a hugh impact on the Legion's structure: i) As the Legion grew in size, its started to delayering, and ii) the discovery and reunion with The Later.

We see in Alpharius - Head of the Hydra, that before meeting The Later, The First have a close collaboration with several members of a headhunter team; (Autilion Skorr - the headhunter Prime, Eltan, Dercius, Hymor and Jha-Tena) who, in addition to Ingo Pech, Thias Herzog, Silonius Kel and Sheed Ranko all appear to be at some level of ranking in their way of acting and adressing the First.... Perhaps they are actual or potential officers, perhaps this is the way The First judged the performance of officers-in-training which the team leader or the entire squad could have been; Being evaluated whether any of them should be considered for further promotion while under the personal supervision of The First. This was perhaps also the way The First could scout out any potential candidate for officer training (we know, that Silonius Kel was once a headhunter and Sheed Ranko illustrate that he too has been trained in the art of infiltrations during the Tenebrae mission. Both could have been serving once under The First as headhunters (through perhaps not at the same time).

As they Legion grew and the scope and complexity of its missions became more wider The First would more and more have to relay on his officers to make decisions independetly of the Primarch(s), and, more importantly slide away from the original thinking. It becomes more clear, that neither of the Legion's two Primarchs do not get to know their underlings very well or visa-verse. The underlings do not know what The First wish for the Imperium and the Emperor. We see in Deliverance Lost where the Alpha Legion infiltrater seems unaware of how Alpharius Omegon is/are in personality. In The Serpeant Beneath we also hear "Omegon" (who in my opinion is the First) ask for recomendations from his close subordinate. Why, if I may ask, can he himself not single out a squad who can perform this important mission? It seems to me that, at this stage, the Legion has grown too large and "Alpharius", The First, the real one, has become so obscure that he does not know junior- and newcoming officers and their command. They might have been supervised under other officers (Arvas Janic, the commanding officer of the Tenebrae installation, was for example supervised by Thias Herzog and a Ving Neriton) gained experience and advanced in ranks through different campaigns or where the Primarch(s) could have a closer look (he cannot be everywhere at once).

This would lead to group thinking; a tendency among a groups' members to agree to everything at all costs. - What is the Alpha Legion's virtues, who do they fight for? It might be, that the junior/newcoming officers simple do not know what The First envisioned The Alpha Legion to be, or what its virtues are... Both for themself, for the Imperium and the Emperor. As the Legion has a tendency for lying, each legionare could actually say one thing (or anything), and think something entirely different, their interpretations of the Legion's virtues being left open for interpretations (this is also seen Deliverance Lost where the Alpha Legion infiltrater cannot state what the Alpha Legion's virtues/values are... He decribe the Legion's methodes but does not comprehend the virtues/values).

This would normally not mean that it is a problem. The other legions have the same problem, however they solve it, by having the leader of their legion/organization, their Primarch, willing and capable of specifying/clarify what their virtues/values of their respective Legion are. This is here where the Alpha Legion faces their greatest challenge. They have TWO Primarchs.  They have two in command, two to interpretate its vauge idears.

Since the Legion was first singlehandedly ruled by The First, The Later may have told another interpretation of the legions philosophy to the new subordiantes; those that came into the Legion after Bar'Savor, thereby setting the Legion up for a split. Why would the Later set the Legion up for a split? Because no one wants to share power. The First is in full command of the entire Legion, what should the other do then? Become a footsoldier for his twin's wars and schemes? No... No one want to be that to one who you have so much in common with the one with all the glory. And The First has glory... He has after all, made a name for himself within his own Legion... So The Later start scheming...
In the later HH books, it becomes clear, that the two Primarchs do not see eye to eye, possibly due to The First discovering what The Later is up to. That is where the power struggle for the Legion's command for real comes out, although it properly began soon after Bar'Savor. After the two Primarchs starten to measure each other and compare. The struggle between the two Primarchs would start, by having the Later telling different interpretations of the Legion's philosophy to the new subordinates, those who did not join the legion until after Bar'Savor. The senior officers, most of the Old Guard if you will (The First's protogeés during his single rule of the Legion) would know the original values and idears of the Legion, but then again, they would not know how to tell the two apart and would not know about their struggle until perhaps the HH. We see the power struggle in Legion during the Nurth campagin where they share a long look at each other before "Alpharius" (who in reality is The Later) gives in and goes with John Grammaticus' wish.

In general, the two Primarchs, for the sake of apperings, did not openly fight against each other, as they  both valuer unity about all. Teamwork if you will. However, when the Primarchs meet the Cabal in Legion and realize what might will happen, they also, both, realize that the HH can be used their own individual advance against the other twin. 

With this I will come back tomorrow to write more. Hope you enjoy.

 

Edited October 11, 2022 by Commander Nicky

[Cactus]

Interesting. Have you read their section from Massacre in the Forge World series?

[Gamiel]

The original post is a lie.

[Xenith]

• What was the difference between the Legion before/during GC, during the Heresy and after the Heresy?

Like most other legions I think they got more entrenched in their ways post heresy. You can see at the start they were more a pragmatic special forces type deal, maybe, however when 'discovered' they began to feel a rivalry and compete with other legions. Their censure by Guilliman about waging war too slowly, while not as blatant as the Word Bearer's problems with progress, would have rankled them and made them wan to show that their way was actually better - I think this is where the increasingly insane and labyrinthine plots begin to occur. As the legion evolved through the crusade, then devolves after the heresy, the strongest and the sneakiest survive and thrive to tutor the next generation, who then become increasingly more cunning in their way of warfare, and so on. 

[Xenith]

11 hours ago, Commander Nicky said:

A final note, the two legionaires  John Grammaticus and Peto Soneka meets when Soneka turns Grammaticus in to the Alpha Legion are the same as at the dinner... Their real names are just not Herzog and Pech... we never meet the real Herzog and Pech in Legion)

Not bothering with spoilers as the book is like, 16 years old now? Can you break that down for me? I was under the impresion that Herzog/Pech impersonated Alpharius at various points, so we do meet them, but not under their own names. 

[SkimaskMohawk]

4 hours ago, Xenith said:

Not bothering with spoilers as the book is like, 16 years old now? Can you break that down for me? I was under the impresion that Herzog/Pech impersonated Alpharius at various points, so we do meet them, but not under their own names. 

Maybe because Ingo Pech and Mathias Herzog are the 1st and 2nd company captains respectively, and OP finds it implausible that they're all hanging around in Legion? It's been a while since I read it, but iirc the Lucifer Black claims all the AL were lying at their meeting with the commander (though I don't remember if those two were introduced there).

I don't think it super matters though. Names and authority are both very fluid in the Alpha Legion; they can all act as alpharius, alpharius thought he was Kel Silonius, the real Silonius had operational authority over Pech and Herzog, etc...

[Xenith]

1 hour ago, SkimaskMohawk said:

It's been a while since I read it, but iirc the Lucifer Black claims all the AL were lying at their meeting with the commander (though I don't remember if those two were introduced there)

I read it last month trying to get into the AL mindset - the lie was not just their names, but Alpharius giving partial information to the commander (Namitjara?) as to why they had to get off the planet ASAP, and then to mobilise all their forces to some backwater world to purge some Xenos. The reasons Alphy gave were half truths/lies. A quick scan I think I might be wrong in my timing there. 

As for Pech/Herzog, there's a scene where Grammaticus meets Alpharius for the first time with Soneka, there's no deception there, Grammaticus recognises both Herzog and Pech, backed up by the "I never forget a vocal pattern" to give some sense of reliability, then remarks on the differences between alpharius and pech/herzog, then the similarity with Omegon. 

[Commander Nicky]

3 hours ago, Xenith said:

I read it last month trying to get into the AL mindset - the lie was not just their names, but Alpharius giving partial information to the commander (Namitjara?) as to why they had to get off the planet ASAP, and then to mobilise all their forces to some backwater world to purge some Xenos. The reasons Alphy gave were half truths/lies. A quick scan I think I might be wrong in my timing there. 

As for Pech/Herzog, there's a scene where Grammaticus meets Alpharius for the first time with Soneka, there's no deception there, Grammaticus recognises both Herzog and Pech, backed up by the "I never forget a vocal pattern" to give some sense of reliability, then remarks on the differences between alpharius and pech/herzog, then the similarity with Omegon. 

 

It says John Grammaticus recognize Pech/Herzog from the dinner, but... these two individuals are just assuming the names Pech/Herzog and assuming ranks which are easy to understand (after all the other legions uses them)  but they are still not the real Ingo Pech and Thias Herzog... We never, ever meet them in the HH Legion. The real  individuals who are known Pech/Herzog are properly not even with Alpharius and Omegon on Nurth...
Yesm those at the dinner are the same as at Soneka and Grammaticus meets a few days later, BUT they are still not the same individuals we meet in Pratorian of Dorn or in Alpharius - Head of the Hydra. The two individuals at the dinner, are just assuming their idendity of these two officers and acting during the dinner as them.

 

To put it more simple:

Individual nr. 1.: Name: Ingo Pech - Senior officer

Individual nr. 2.: Name: Mathias Herzog - Senior officer

Individual nr. 3.: Name: Unknown (Lets call him mr. X) - Headhunter

Individual nr. 4.: Name Also unknown (Lets call him mr. Y) - Headhunter

 

During the dinner, individual nr. 3 (Mr. X) is present. He says his name Ingo Pech, 1st captain (thereby impersonating the senior officer). Also during the dinner is individual nr. 4 (mr. Y) his says name is Mathias Herzog 2nd captain (he also impersonate a senior officer). Later John Grammaticus and Peto Soneka meets two legionares who, in fact, are individual 3 (Mr. X) and individual 4 (Mr. Y), both still inpersonating individual nr. 1 and individual nr. 2 a.k.a. two senior officers.

Edited October 11, 2022 by Commander Nicky

[Xenith]

I think that's tenuous at best - the book is internally consistent at least with just people solo-switcheroos between Alpharius, Pech and Herzog. John meets Pech and Herzog prior to the meeting towards the end of part 2, and recognises both and can differentiate them from other Alphas, including Alpharius and Omegon - so the same marines are calling themselves Pech and Herzog as their real identities consistently through the book. That's all we can assume. To say that neither are the real Pech or Herzog, while possible, is a stretch not supported by the text. I could just as well say that neither the marines identifying themselves as Alpharius and Omegon were the true Alpharius and Omegon, and it was a psychic screen by Shere. 

 

1 hour ago, Commander Nicky said:

Yes those at the dinner are the same as at Soneka and Grammaticus meets a few days later, BUT they are still not the same individuals we meet in Pratorian of Dorn or in Alpharius - Head of the Hydra

 

What's your evidence for that? Head of the Hydra specifically calls out Pech and Herzog as being of similar build to Primarchs/larger than other marines and confirms them undergoing modification to look more like Alpharius, which was initially suggested in Legion - there is nothing, from what I can see, that suggests they are different marines - unless you want to assume that the 1st/2nd company captains are promoted based on size and appearance, not skill, and take on honorific titles of Pech and Herzog - however that is speculative at best and unpragmatic - so un-alpha legion. 

[Brother Sutek]

16 hours ago, Xenith said:

• What was the difference between the Legion before/during GC, during the Heresy and after the Heresy?

Like most other legions I think they got more entrenched in their ways post heresy. You can see at the start they were more a pragmatic special forces type deal, maybe, however when 'discovered' they began to feel a rivalry and compete with other legions. Their censure by Guilliman about waging war too slowly, while not as blatant as the Word Bearer's problems with progress, would have rankled them and made them wan to show that their way was actually better - I think this is where the increasingly insane and labyrinthine plots begin to occur. As the legion evolved through the crusade, then devolves after the heresy, the strongest and the sneakiest survive and thrive to tutor the next generation, who then become increasingly more cunning in their way of warfare, and so on. 

Once again Guilliman starts problems by wanting to be the top dog. Mind you it's mostly well written stuff so I've enjoyed Guilliman in 30k for the most part. 

[Commander Nicky]

On 10/11/2022 at 9:02 PM, Xenith said:

I think that's tenuous at best - the book is internally consistent at least with just people solo-switcheroos between Alpharius, Pech and Herzog. John meets Pech and Herzog prior to the meeting towards the end of part 2, and recognises both and can differentiate them from other Alphas, including Alpharius and Omegon - so the same marines are calling themselves Pech and Herzog as their real identities consistently through the book. That's all we can assume. To say that neither are the real Pech or Herzog, while possible, is a stretch not supported by the text. I could just as well say that neither the marines identifying themselves as Alpharius and Omegon were the true Alpharius and Omegon, and it was a psychic screen by Shere. 

 

 

What's your evidence for that? Head of the Hydra specifically calls out Pech and Herzog as being of similar build to Primarchs/larger than other marines and confirms them undergoing modification to look more like Alpharius, which was initially suggested in Legion - there is nothing, from what I can see, that suggests they are different marines - unless you want to assume that the 1st/2nd company captains are promoted based on size and appearance, not skill, and take on honorific titles of Pech and Herzog - however that is speculative at best and unpragmatic - so un-alpha legion.

 

Sorry, I did not know the Alpha Legion did not use double-bodies... I mean you can hardly see any conection between them and Alpharius...

What do you mean by size?

What I meant was, that the two marines accomplianed Omegon and Sheed Ranko are double-bodies for the two captains... Just like Omegon is acting as a double-body for Alpharius at the dinner. These two double-bodies are later the two to intercept Soneka and Grammaticus. The reason why I believe these are double-bodies/proxy/impersonating for the two captains is: Why would you have two high-ranked captains guard the entres to a hidden base? Can't you delegate this to others so that they may focus on their guard duties and not somthing you could assign anybody to? Also when on the battleship; The Alpha, I is heavely implyed that Ingo Pech instruct some operatives in some sort of combat techniques. Okay, Allright. Question: Why would you have the 1st Captain of an Astartes Legion (who properly have to make highly important duties short amount of time to go into micromanagement) instruct operatives and not another warrior to do this?

 

This is just some questions I raise...

Edited October 18, 2022 by Commander Nicky

[Commander Nicky]

 Maybe I should cut some things clear:

 

My real questions concern how the Alpha Legion fractered and why it did not stay united? There are a clear differences between the legion during the Great Crusade, The HH and up to the Siege, and after the Scouring in their unity and way of viewing themself... and yet why did they keep operating the way they did? how did they evolved?

Why was there not a senior officer who could take up the leadership and keep the Legion together?

 

What I want to get out (and I know, it is pure speculations) is that I think that the First had everyone of his own legionaries who could identify him killed... So that I was not possible to indentify him.

This was because he wanted to discard the Alpha Legion... Not destroy it, but discard it - Cancel its ability to function as a unifed force which could be a threat... The Alpha Legion has worked its way, but not was the time to discard it. I think the loyalty for all the Alpha Legionaries lay with the First, but the internal scheming between the twin had created confussion for all who did not know the First (personaly and could identify him) as to what was the end goals fo the Alpha Legion was, and how the Alpha Legion and its Primarchs got to those endgoals... What was the strategy?

As the Twins each had their own endgoals (one being that only one of the twin being in charge of the Alpha Legion), they tried to stop the Legion from being a functional unit... I mean: It is known, that the Alpha Legion were masters of infiltration and lies, but was there any doubt for its members as to where they themselves had placed their loyalty? Were they pretending to lie when they where honest? Or where they honest when they pretended to lie?

Did they see themselves as someone who had infiltrated the enemies camps? Or had they gone over to the enemy? Did they know this themselves? Did the Alpha legionary at their side agree to which side they were on? Had the other gone over to the enemy? Was he, in fact, an infiltrater who, on his own, had infiltrated his own unit to lurk out any hidden enemy? Who could you be honest with in the Alpha Legion? Who if any could you be honest with? Could they be honest with themselves? Did they lie to themselves as to who their loyalty were directed to? I mean, who was the individual legionary, Had he any sense of his own idendity and values, Could he argue for them?

 

I think this was what the Twins had done to the Legion... They messed it up intensionally... Making every legionary say they were on the same team... without saying which team they were actually fighting for (remember: it could be a lie to fool the enemy (who is the enemy?)).

It is to be paranoid of... And that is how you neutralize the hydra... make it distrut inself and fight anything around it (even its own heads).

 

 

[Cactus]

The idea that one of the twins deliberately sabotaged the legion by making it consume itself is appealing.

 

My understanding is that the legion operated a cell structure (at least in part) and some of those cells had very broad orders that amounted to "Go forth and be Alpha Legion". Inevitably this leads to lots of smaller groups operating (and recruiting) without much coordination with the wider legion. Once Alpharius is gone there is no hope of reuniting these parts and fragmentation is the only possible outcome.

 

Both of these things could be true at the same time, or either, or neither. The ambiguity and the scope for head-canon that can't entirely be disproved or contradicted are what make the XXth fun to me.

 

I can't recall the details of Legion but is it plausible that the senior officers were using 'simple guard on watch' as a cover story?

[Xenith]

Also, very few Legion members are identified by name in the book. Maybe Abnett wanted to keep things tight and keep with characters we knew. We also know that the AL had a more flat hierarchy than other Legions in terms of duty, responsibility, win or lose etc, so maybe door duty is just on a rota? Maybe the Alphas knew Gramaticus was comig so posted someone that would recognise him - Like how Shere always seemed to be exactly where Grammaticus was. 

 

It's a good point about the fragmentation. Thinking about it, whatever the reason for the splintering of the Alpha Legion, in the 40k universe, as far as I know, they are seen as no greater threat to the Imperium than other fractured warband-based former legions like the EC (Shattered at Canticle city), WE (broken at Skalathrax), NL (scattered by Curze/Sevatar?), which would strongly imply that the whole "sever one head and two grow in it's place" schtick was more misdirection at best, and that without defined sole leadership the Legion has essentially faded into non-existence. 

 

That might be the final Hubris of Alpharius - he is so confident that his legion is the best, the best trained, the most adaptable that he dies to Guilliman to prove a point, that his legion will live on, however we see that it doesn't. 

Edited October 19, 2022 by Xenith

[General Zodd]

14 hours ago, Xenith said:

That might be the final Hubris of Alpharius - he is so confident that his legion is the best, the best trained, the most adaptable that he dies to Guilliman to prove a point, that his legion will live on, however we see that it doesn't. 

Ahem, Imperial Fist Truth Police here, his most noble and high exaltedness, Praetorian of Terra, Rogal Dorn killed Alpharius. Guilliman may have killed someone *claiming* to be Alpharius, and maybe even Omegon, but not *the* Alpharius.

 

You may continue about your business, traitorous curs.

[Gamiel]

9 hours ago, General Zodd said:

Ahem, Imperial Fist Truth Police here, his most noble and high exaltedness, Praetorian of Terra, Rogal Dorn killed Alpharius. Guilliman may have killed someone *claiming* to be Alpharius, and maybe even Omegon, but not *the* Alpharius.

 

You may continue about your business, traitorous curs.

Agents of Andromeda-∞ here. We do not talk about that, report yourself and your misstep to your Chaplaincy and you may not use the Pain Glove until you have returned from whatever penal quest they send you on.

[Xenith]

11 hours ago, General Zodd said:

Rogal Dorn killed the person who identified himself to Rogal as Alpharius

 

While I agree, After RD killed Alfy, Omegon took the name Alpharius, so it's not incorrect to say RG killed Alpharius also. 

[Karhedron]

14 minutes ago, Xenith said:

 

While I agree, After RD killed Alfy, Omegon took the name Alpharius, so it's not incorrect to say RG killed Alpharius also. 

 

And if you believe the novel, the original Alpharius took the identity of Omegon after he met his twin. So it is possible that the being currently claiming to be Alpharius, really is Alpharius, even though he called himself Omegon for much of the time.

[General Zodd]

8 hours ago, Xenith said:

 

 I agree,  RD killed Alfy. 

Two can play at that game! 

[Gorechilde]

On 10/10/2022 at 4:37 PM, Commander Nicky said:

A final note, the two legionaires  John Grammaticus and Peto Soneka meets when Soneka turns Grammaticus in to the Alpha Legion are the same as at the dinner... Their real names are just not Herzog and Pech... we never meet the real Herzog and Pech in Legion).

 

This is not entirely accurate according to The End and the Death Part 1. Grammaticus is able to identify Pech based off of their interactions in Legion.

[Gorechilde]

On 10/20/2022 at 5:07 AM, Karhedron said:

And if you believe the novel, the original Alpharius took the identity of Omegon after he met his twin. So it is possible that the being currently claiming to be Alpharius, really is Alpharius, even though he called himself Omegon for much of the time.

 

You are my hero for recognizing this. I would venture to say this figure is still Alpharius to this day and Kel Silonus was the one present on Eskridor. The shattered knife presented to Horus was an indication that the Legion has fractured and retired from the conflict. The remaining Primarch has quite possibly retired along the same lines as Vulkan in a 40k setting.

[Dagoth Ur]

On 10/20/2022 at 12:07 PM, Karhedron said:

 

And if you believe the novel, the original Alpharius took the identity of Omegon after he met his twin. So it is possible that the being currently claiming to be Alpharius, really is Alpharius, even though he called himself Omegon for much of the time.

 

They only swapped identities for the purposes of meeting Horus in the context of the novel. They didn't swap permanently.

 

 

 

 

Edited November 16, 2023 by Dagoth Ur

[Cactus]

That's so Alpha Legion. Making us believe one thing before pulling the rug.