StratoKhan Posted November 3, 2022 Share Posted November 3, 2022 As far as I can remember from the scant few references in the background, Hypnomats are big bulky machines of some sort that are used by Space Marine Chapters to allow a Marine to absorb a lot of information quickly. Which is pretty useful, as who wants to attend actual classes on Rhino bulkhead schematics, or the hardpoints on a Fire Raptor, or improvised explosives when you could be completing practical training exercises or refining strategic skills? The boring stuff you can just download into your brain on your time off. To bring some pop culture references into the mix, I imagine that a Hypnomat is a bit like a less advanced and clunkier version of how Neo absorbs information in The Matrix. The epic "I know kung-fu." line from the first movie springs to mind. As there are several mentions in the background of Space Marines having eidetic memories, it could be inferred that Hypnomats are tools developed specifically to harness this ability. Here's the thing - I find this aspect of the background really interesting, especially the potential angles for brainwashing and so on, but as far as I can tell, it hasn't really been explored that much by GW or BL. Hypnomats could be used for: Training Indoctrination/Propaganda Briefing All of these have their place in the running of a Space Marine Chapter. Do we have any idea when this concept was introduced into the background? I seem to remember some mentions in Rogue Trader, but I'm not sure where anymore. Is there anyone more knowledgeable having anything to add about references in the background? In novels or other sources? Sothalor 1 Back to top Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/376435-hypnomats-underexplored-concept/ Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sothalor Posted November 3, 2022 Share Posted November 3, 2022 I don't know exactly when the concept was introduced in the game background. In the catalogue of Black Library novels, I believe the idea goes back at least as far as the first Ragnar Blackmane novel, Space Wolf, by William King. In that book, it's one of the minor plot points about how the Space Wolves uplift their inductees; it's a hell of an educational shortcut to just upload concepts like interstellar empires, astrophysics, mechanical engineering, basic literacy, etc. into the brains of a bunch of essentially iron age tribal raiders. The novel does bring up a potential shortcoming in the process: the knowledge imprints may not "take" to the same extent that repeated, experiential training (a la muscle memory and ingrained responses) instills. One of Ragnar's fellow inductees actually kills himself with a negligent bolt pistol discharge because all of their fire arms safety education was done through hypno-indoctrination, and there's still this sort of detached abstractness to their understanding. Another novel that highlights extensive usage of hypno-indoctrination is Steve Parker's Deathwatch (2012, I believe). The eponymous organization uses the tech for training (literally experiencing past operations) and discipline (misbehave and you get to experience hours of futile last stands and agonizing deaths). Gamiel, N1SB, Inquisitor Eisenhorn and 2 others 5 Back to top Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/376435-hypnomats-underexplored-concept/#findComment-5881056 Share on other sites More sharing options...
WARMASTER_ Posted November 3, 2022 Share Posted November 3, 2022 I don’t know where the concept was introduced but it’s definitely something BL are adding too recently they’re mentioned in Guy Haley’s books Plague War and Avenging Son if I remember correctly In the books they’re used in the later stages of the ascension process, Unsurprisingly during the hypo indoctrination phase and also for an astartes to retrieve memories Definitely an interesting part of the lore StratoKhan, Felix Antipodes and N1SB 3 Back to top Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/376435-hypnomats-underexplored-concept/#findComment-5881064 Share on other sites More sharing options...
N1SB Posted November 3, 2022 Share Posted November 3, 2022 In recent books, Guy Haley uses hypnomats a lot: Primaris Marines were "trained" by Belisarius Cawl with them One Marine was replaying a battle on Terra while sleeping, at 1st it seemed like a flashback As for what it may look like... 50 minutes ago, StratoKhan said: To bring some pop culture references into the mix, I imagine that a Hypnomat is a bit like a less advanced and clunkier version of how Neo absorbs information in The Matrix. The epic "I know kung-fu." line from the first movie springs to mind. You're probably spot-on. In the case where a Marine was replaying a battle (not just to relive, but to see if he could've done something differently), he was inferred to be sleeping because he literally gets a wake-up call during it. As he "wakes up", it describes wires connected to the input jacks on his neck and arms, I assumed it's the same ports used for power armour. Like they're up/downloading data/muscle memory straight into his body for a more complete simulation. Putting these elements together, I do imagine those Matrix beds for when Neo or the others had to jack in, but instead of just that one cable that goes into his neck, there are multiple cables connecting to at least the arms of a Marine. And the effect is like a VR program directly connected to the nervous system. Guy Haley also described some shortcomings about using these hypnomats. It wasn't in the technology in and of itself, but how Belisarius Cawl had designed the training programs, he had a lot of experimental weapons and armour, and the early Primaris (a.k.a. the Unnumbered Sons/Greyshields) found the lessons incomplete, leading to a lot of casualties early on. It's a case of a tool being useful as long as you don't rely on it too much, so it's not a replacement for real training. Sothalor, WARMASTER_, Gamiel and 2 others 5 Back to top Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/376435-hypnomats-underexplored-concept/#findComment-5881065 Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaxom Posted November 3, 2022 Share Posted November 3, 2022 Hypno-indoctrination has also been mentioned in relation to the sus-an membrane. I don't have any of the resources in front of me, but it's something along the lines of, "the organ's function requires priming it with hypno-indoctrination" StratoKhan 1 Back to top Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/376435-hypnomats-underexplored-concept/#findComment-5881072 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lexington Posted November 3, 2022 Share Posted November 3, 2022 If Hypnomats are ever used in a movie or video game cutscene or whatever, I desperately hope they use the only appropriate sound effect. MasterDeath and StratoKhan 2 Back to top Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/376435-hypnomats-underexplored-concept/#findComment-5881075 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bryan Blaire Posted November 3, 2022 Share Posted November 3, 2022 As far as I can recall, hypnotherapy and psycho-indoctrination have been a staple of Space Marine creation as far back as 2nd/3rd Edition - I’ll have to get access to my old Codexes later to pull a quote about it. I believe that calling something a hypnomat is a recent thing. StratoKhan 1 Back to top Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/376435-hypnomats-underexplored-concept/#findComment-5881107 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Karhedron Posted November 3, 2022 Share Posted November 3, 2022 Hypno-indocrination goes all the way back to 1st edition. The venerable "Compendium" (1989) is reproduced here. https://wh40k.lexicanum.com/wiki/Creation_of_a_Space_Marine Felix Antipodes, N1SB, Bryan Blaire and 2 others 5 Back to top Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/376435-hypnomats-underexplored-concept/#findComment-5881109 Share on other sites More sharing options...
WARMASTER_ Posted November 3, 2022 Share Posted November 3, 2022 Im guessing it’s just an expansion of an existing concept? We’ve seen Psycho + Hypno Indoctrination since 1st as said above but I’ve never actually read how it’s done or the machine used until recently The Iron hands also use a Simulus device/chamber for training and memory recollection/accounts in their newer book series which seems to have very similar uses + effects StratoKhan 1 Back to top Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/376435-hypnomats-underexplored-concept/#findComment-5881123 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cactus Posted November 4, 2022 Share Posted November 4, 2022 The Dark Angels' Interrogator-Chaplains use hypno-implanted trigger phrases to assert drastic and immediate control over their brethren. There's an example in Gav Thorpe's Legacy of Caliban trilogy. I think it was also described in a 6th/7th edition codex but I'm not certain. The process of priming the subject isn't described in detail but a secret addition to the scheduled hypno-indoctrination seems very plausible. StratoKhan and N1SB 2 Back to top Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/376435-hypnomats-underexplored-concept/#findComment-5881384 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Noserenda Posted November 4, 2022 Share Posted November 4, 2022 Definitely as old as 1st ed, I think briefly mentioned in rogue trader itself and exited in depth in the original Space marine novel from before Black library was even a twinkle in gws eye :D StratoKhan 1 Back to top Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/376435-hypnomats-underexplored-concept/#findComment-5881394 Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gamiel Posted November 5, 2022 Share Posted November 5, 2022 In one of the Inquisition short stories we have a Tempestus who believes that this is her first mission for the =][= but we find out have been serving them for many years, after each mission mindscrubbed and having new false memories implanted. StratoKhan, N1SB and Noserenda 3 Back to top Link to comment https://bolterandchainsword.com/topic/376435-hypnomats-underexplored-concept/#findComment-5881441 Share on other sites More sharing options...
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