Why???

[Forgefather68]

I'm a Salamanders player and I'm sorta needing some answers to some questions. First of all with the Salamanders being all about flame weapons,why is it that troop or elite choices cannot take heavy flamer or hand flamer but Blood Angels and their successors can?  And my second question is; how do you run Pyroclast  units what type of unit are they? 

[CCE1981]

Lol, I have asked this question a lot!  I think Salamanders should be able to take a heavy flamer on any unit that can take a heavy bolter. 
 

Sallies are also one of the esteemed factions that have lost a special Character, RIP Chaplain Xavier.

Edited December 21, 2022 by CCE1981

[Inquisitor_Lensoven]

if i had to hazard a guess it's simply because they're not popular enough to warrant too much special treatment from GW.

[Xenith]

Because a model designer didn't realise that tactical squads couldn't take heavy flamers, and it was much cheaper just to add them to the BA book than recut moulds. 

[LameBeard]

The BA tactical squad did have that heavy flamer option on the sprue. I know it’s now OOP but they might have wanted the rules to reflect it. I think it also had a hand flamer for the sergeant. So it’s more a “special treatment for BA” than a snub to Salamanders.

 

Now why don’t you play Heresy instead and you can have heavy flamers in your veteran squads or whole units of heavy flamers and those pyroclasts that are tempting you too?

[Jolemai]

Sternguard Veterans can take two heavy flamers still and they are an Elites choice.

The other aspect is arguably down to the lore side. Whilst Salamanders do have an affinity with flamer and melta weapons (and do have hand flamers and inferno pistols in their armour), they don't use them often as it doesn't fit with their style of warfare. Blood Angels aren't primarily about combat; they excel in close quarters and short ranged firefights. That's why they take these pistols often (and why we have rules for them). For a while BA didn't have access to Centurions because it wasn't in their ethos despite having them in their armoury, but this all changed when we were rolled into C:SM at the start of 9th edition.

[Beta galactosidase]

so for one they were the first chapter to have exclusive access to multi-meltas in their tactical squads.  Since then every other chapter has gotten them, but it used to be they were Salamanders-only.  This is from when Salamanders were hard mode space marines, you needed to have some extra backbone and brains to play them. 
 

Im happy to see Jolemai say that.  It comes down to how much you respect the Salamanders as characters.  In-universe, the tactical squad needs to have overlapping fields of fire with its neighboring squads.  If you switched out their support weapon for a heavy flamer, it pretty much stops being a tactical squad, and it wouldn’t do the job they need it to.

 

i know all about blood angels, we aren’t talking about what they need, we are talking about what in-universe salamanders need.

[sal of manders]

On 12/18/2022 at 12:03 AM, Forgefather68 said:

And my second question is; how do you run Pyroclast  units what type of unit are they? 

Assuming you mean the unit, and not the company, Pyroclasts are a horus heresy only unit. 

[Doghouse]

It's extremely possible that it could have been an option that originated in the Armageddon campaign book back in 3rd edition for them that has stuck and carried over into the lore. I think that is where the high gravity worlders thing came from because it was also represented in the rules with a minus one to Initiative because they were slower.

If I were to guess they may have been allowed to use them in tacticals had the Blood Angels codex that included heavy flamers and the like for the first time come out before the main marine codex at that time.

[Minsc]

Well, with the new changes including the new detatchment, there's no need to bring Troops - and Sternguard no longer paying for combi-flamers/meltas and Heavy Flamers/Multi Meltas is borderline bonkers.

I'm literally considering about dusting of my 3 Drop Pods and bring 3 squads of Sternguard, filled to the brim with flame and melta, all while laughing in 3000°C.