Who has benefite of a cover according to the 10th edition

[Exardus]

I had a discusion with my 40k group and we cant decide who has a benefit of cover according to the new rules.

 

Thank you in the advance

 

Edited June 6, 2023 by Exardus

[Xenith]

None of them, from what I'm reading.

 

Models have to be "wholly within" or partially obscured by the terrain feature, which applies to none of A, B or C.

 

"firing models can see into this terrain feature normally". So the white circle can see and hit A+B+C, however none hain the benefit of cover as they are not wholly within, or obscured by it.

 

Weirdly, to see out of terrain, you have to be wholly within, so only A and B could shoot back, as C has to draw LOS through a piece of terrain it's not wholly within. 

p48 of the free pdf on Ruins. 

[BluejayJunior]

Assuming Ruins, I mostly agree with Xenith. The only exception I see is that C may not be visible to the firing unit. It's kind of weirdly worded and how "fully within" and "outside of terrain" are defined. I would say that something that isn't fully within terrain counts as not being in it at all, but I'm not sure the rules are conclusive on that. Otherwise it's a weird scenario where shooting unit can see C, but C can't see shooting unit. 

In Woods however, C would have the benefit of cover because the shots are going through Woods. 

Edited June 6, 2023 by BluejayJunior

[Xenith]

Yea, tricky - send that image and question to 40KFAQ@gwplc.com 

[Exardus]

Will do. Thanks for your help

[TrawlingCleaner]

A few people have picked up on the quite odd interaction terrain has with line of sight, this video was very informative and gives examples. The video also gives details on the "Benefits of Cover" and how quirky it is too:

Spoiler

 

 

There's two parts to this that are the important bits:

 

In this case, A, B and C are all partially on the Footprint of the Ruins, which means:

 

 

If you're not wholly within the terrain feature and it's Footprint or having Towering/Aircraft, the Footprint and Terrain Obscure entirely. If you're wholly within the Footprint, you can shoot out of and be shot at as it reverts to True LoS.

 

A and B can draw total line of sight to the target with none of the Footprint in view, they're totally fine. C however would have to draw line of sight through the Footprint and cannot see the target.

 

In the video, Mikey gives an example of a Dreadnought with most of the base in the footprint but a tiny bit left out which means it cannot see any targets on the other side of the ruins.

Spoiler

 

TLDR:

C cannot see the target at all because they are not wholly within and the Footprint of the building blocks line of sight

 

[Xenith]

14 minutes ago, TrawlingCleaner said:

A and B can draw total line of sight to the target with none of the Footprint in view, they're totally fine. C however would have to draw line of sight through the Footprint and cannot see the target.

 

I'd come to the same conclusion - I thinkthe OP is looking at it from the other angle, though - the white circle is shooting, and which of A, B or C count as "gaining the benefits of cover".

 

I'd assume we have the same answer. 

[TrawlingCleaner]

2 minutes ago, Xenith said:

 

I'd come to the same conclusion - I thinkthe OP is looking at it from the other angle, though - the white circle is shooting, and which of A, B or C count as "gaining the benefits of cover".

 

I'd assume we have the same answer. 

 

It would help if I got my arrows around the right way, Whoops! Although the answer is still the same as you say. None get the benefits, C is fully obscured.

It seems like a change made to stop "toeing" in a unit to see through ruins and getting a cover save, however it probably shouldn't be a stipulation for LoS and Obscuring