GW, YouTubers/Influencers, and Marketing Thoughts

[ZeroWolf]

Hopefully we will stock improvements now that we're reaching release day, and the test will be when the Kill Team season picks up again and/or if the rumours about Legion Imperialis launching end of summer are true. If everyone gets a copy of them that want one, then we'll be in a better position.

[sarabando]

12 hours ago, Kastor Krieg said:

Another source of sour taste in this case is that the influencers are handed the boxes way ahead of time, so much so that they can build, masterclass paint and record and edit a video about them. This is months in advance and absolutely spoils the enjoyment of building and painting your own, because by the time you get your boxes the internet is already completely flooded with examples of non-fans, instead professionals, doing it months ago and better.

When I paint something as a hobbyist, not a commission painter, I want to share it with people. The last thing I want to see in reply is lack of engagement and the equivalent of "yawn, we've seen those for months, you're way behind".

theres another angle to this too. 

 

As a smaller creator myself you always want to be early on the hype train for anything. if you are you can get a massive boost in subs get in too late and youre lucky to get a hand full. Theres zero point in me making a video about leviathan now because 250 influencers have already filled IG and YT with every single possible take out there. The only thing left to me is rage clicks and internet drama two things im not a fan off....(despite my recent MWM video XD ) 

[Kastor Krieg]

1 hour ago, sarabando said:

theres another angle to this too. 

 

As a smaller creator myself you always want to be early on the hype train for anything. if you are you can get a massive boost in subs get in too late and youre lucky to get a hand full. Theres zero point in me making a video about leviathan now because 250 influencers have already filled IG and YT with every single possible take out there. The only thing left to me is rage clicks and internet drama two things im not a fan off....(despite my recent MWM video XD ) 

Yep, same thing with my IG / FB profiles - when I build and paint up the models, the topic will be weeks old, the public disinterested and the social medial algorithm will bury my posts beneath the ton of preexisting influencer stuff.

What GW are doing is completely disincentivizing smaller creators. 

And on the "not putting a dent in the availability of models" angle? Sure. not Leviathan boxes. But Lion and the retinue? Heck yeah, I missed out on the kit and it's been weeks and still I can't even buy the damned thing.

Edited June 19, 2023 by Kastor Krieg

[Guest]

I personally don't like them but its not just for GW products. I am not a fan of Social Media/Youtube Influencers in general.

 

Out of all the 40K Youtubers I think I watch 3. Worse ones for me are the clickbait ones.

[DemonGSides]

17 hours ago, Kastor Krieg said:

Yep, same thing with my IG / FB profiles - when I build and paint up the models, the topic will be weeks old, the public disinterested and the social medial algorithm will bury my posts beneath the ton of preexisting influencer stuff.

What GW are doing is completely disincentivizing smaller creators. 

And on the "not putting a dent in the availability of models" angle? Sure. not Leviathan boxes. But Lion and the retinue? Heck yeah, I missed out on the kit and it's been weeks and still I can't even buy the damned thing.

 

You didn't miss out on Lion because of the Marketing Budget, you missed out on Lion cuz GW is bad at prioritizing things; they could've had the numbers Leviathan has done and also gotten more Lion el Johnson out, but they opted to focus on creating as many Leviathan preorders as possible.  It had nothing to do with who got a pre-release copy of The Lion; if they never sent out a model to the community and still sold them, you'd be in the exact same spot because there wasn't that many of the Lion shipped out.

Maybe focus on building/painting for yourself, instead of it being a clout thing?  I don't know anyone who has a real issue with the "Well my social medias won't be as cutting edge!"  This feels like a fake concern that's only a byproduct of trying to sell your commissions, which at least there is an argument that GW's actually affecting your bottom line.

The most interesting painters I see out there are making interesting models/paintjobs, not just painting whatever the newest thing is.  If you think people are only looking at Warhammer models online to see what the newest hotness is, I guess I understand the anger.  But I don't think that's how most people interact with the communities of painting/modelling.

Edited June 20, 2023 by DemonGSides

[Joe]

To be fair, 500,000 copies of the Lion as opposed to 500,000 copies of Leviathan might have been a smidge optimistic for Games Workshop. 

[darkhorse0607]

I think there are a few different discussions to be had around this, and they're all kind of getting blurred together, at least in my brain. TLDR at the bottom of my TED talk

 

I don't necessarily think that influencers (whether that be IG, those that post on Reddit, Youtube, etc) getting preview copies is an issue in itself. As others have said, it happens almost everywhere. That being said, I do think there are growing pains. This only started, what a year or so ago? At least in full force like it is now. Even as someone who uses social media almost exclusively to keep up with my hobbies it is getting to be a lot and I've stepped back a bit, not particularly because something is not well painted or something like that, but because it all feels like just marketing at this point. Around launch weekends, you can't really step into any of the Warhammer circles without seeing numerous "Here's a product I got for free, early, and this is why it's great and you should buy it." Then when you don't see that, you see all the GW staff members with "I am proud to be part of the team that produced this best model ever." Am I mad at these folks for sharing, no. Is it getting to be a lot? Yes.

 

Likewise, I don't think their getting copies significantly hampers everyone else. A few hundred Lions going out isn't going to undo GW's bad production numbers. At the same time though, it doesn't help. Again, not because they got one, but because when someone goes online to buy something they've been looking forwards to and can't get it, the last thing folks are going to want to see is all of the influencers who got one (again, for free) telling them how great it is to have, and that they should buy one. Merging back into the previous paragraph, the fact that if you go on social media on launch weekend and maybe will struggle to get away from all of the marketing (which I am lumping in the influencers with at this point), it can create some ill feelings. With that, for folks who care about numbers, growing their pages, etc, I think that it can create some bitterness. You know how quickly your page will grow if you're getting pre-release miniatures consistently and can post about them when relatively few people can? Or having your post of something you may have worked hard on barely get any traction because it's buried under a wave of "I got this mini/box for free, lets spread the hype for GW" posts. Again, can create bitterness

 

Lastly, at least from the discourse I've seen here and elsewhere, I think the line between GW and those that have signed the NDAs is getting more blurred. GW doesn't really have a face at this point anymore. Yes, you have folks like Adam or Eddy who do preview streams (not targeting them, just the only ones whose names come to mind anymore) but between OnlyHands, the leaving of Louise, Duncan, Peach, etc, and the stepping back of GW in terms of crediting, letting their staff members have more of a voice in the community, etc, the influencers are getting to be the only visible people that folks can associate with GW. Yes you still have folks like Darren Latham with a large following and work for the company, but the amount that actual staff members are allowed to do and be a part of (see Warhammer Fest and the lack of development teams for an example) is far less than it used to be. Added to all of this is that GW is hardly the most friendly when it comes to comments or feedback on their channels. There are no comments on the Youtube channel allowed (with the exception of the 9th edition launch trailer from what I've seen). IG and FB comments are heavily moderated. Twitch streams are heavily moderated. They don't have things like comment sections on WHC or discussion boards, etc. All of this is meaning that there isn't a lot of two-way discussion going on with the company. Shoot, to compare it to video games for a second, when a game launches horribly, or something goes wrong with production or something like that, you at least get a "we're sorry" jpeg to the point where it's a meme now. GW, with all the things that have gone "wrong" in the last few years, whether that is broken armies, production delays (like when they said the Lion would be out before 9th), production issues in general (they could've easily said stock is down due to Leviathan's production at any point and soothed things over but haven't), etc, we have gotten one tongue-in-cheek video about the Votaan being broken and that's about it.

 

So where is all this rant going?

 

I'm just trying to voice that, at least in my eyes, there have been more than a few oopsies over the last few years from the company and disgruntled feelings from the community at those decisions. At the same time, they've withdrawn on a communication (not marketing) side from where they were at around the start of 8th. They now saturate the market with marketing both from them and the influencers, and since they won't talk to anyone, and the influencers do, I think a lot of the frustrations are taken out on them.

 

To be very clear, I don't think the influencers should take the blame for any of this, nor am I endorsing angry comments to them or anything like that. Im sure that 95% of the folks on here would take the free brand building and free miniatures if GW offered them the same deal. I just think that if you give people the option of typing a comment to a GW social media page about frustrations (constructive, I couldn't care less if someone goes off on the social media team disrespectfully and gets their comments deleted) and has their comment deleted, or writing an email to get the same copy/paste response, or taking that same comment to someone who's more active, communicative, etc, and is essentially part of the extended GW marketing team at this point, folks are going to do the latter.

 

All of this being said, if GW would lift more of a finger to help quell community concerns and communicate (again, actually communicate, not marketing-based WHC posts) I don't think there would be nearly the hostility towards the influencers as there actually is.

 

TLDR:
GW doesn't talk to anyone but those in the NDA program, so the influencers are catching heat over GWs poor decision-making. It's not the influencer's fault, but until GW changes it's probably going to remain this way

[alfred_the_great]

I have empathy for GW throttling comments on their socials. 
 

the 0.5% of toxic comments are simply not worth their team’s time or mental health, but the (understandable) fratricide is the 99.5% of average comments don’t get made. 

[sarabando]

On 6/20/2023 at 5:15 PM, DemonGSides said:

 

You didn't miss out on Lion because of the Marketing Budget, you missed out on Lion cuz GW is bad at prioritizing things; they could've had the numbers Leviathan has done and also gotten more Lion el Johnson out, but they opted to focus on creating as many Leviathan preorders as possible.  It had nothing to do with who got a pre-release copy of The Lion; if they never sent out a model to the community and still sold them, you'd be in the exact same spot because there wasn't that many of the Lion shipped out.

Maybe focus on building/painting for yourself, instead of it being a clout thing?  I don't know anyone who has a real issue with the "Well my social medias won't be as cutting edge!"  This feels like a fake concern that's only a byproduct of trying to sell your commissions, which at least there is an argument that GW's actually affecting your bottom line.

The most interesting painters I see out there are making interesting models/paintjobs, not just painting whatever the newest thing is.  If you think people are only looking at Warhammer models online to see what the newest hotness is, I guess I understand the anger.  But I don't think that's how most people interact with the communities of painting/modelling.

 

 

Yeah just screw anyone who wants to start out as a creator in any way right?

 

the audience that cares if you have a painting video of this retro 1988 boblin the goblin from citidel minatures is tiny, no the vast majority of people who watch youtube/tiktok/IG/Twitch are younger people who are more interested in new releases. 

 

Its nothing to do with clout, its simply giving the market what it wants from a creator pov. Just to put in prospective youtube has overtaken viewership numbers from most TV shows by quite a huge number. and i dont think anyone really thinks that the 250 or so Lions that were sent out to influencers would have solved the production issue HOWEVER its pretty bad optics to keep having large vocal portion of your population not happy with you due to not getting product while there are "marketing" copies flying out for free. 

[Redcomet]

I strongly dislike the influencer plague in general, so GW’s attempts at using them is an uphill battle for me. 

[DemonGSides]

1 hour ago, sarabando said:

 

Yeah just screw anyone who wants to start out as a creator in any way right?

 

the audience that cares if you have a painting video of this retro 1988 boblin the goblin from citidel minatures is tiny, no the vast majority of people who watch youtube/tiktok/IG/Twitch are younger people who are more interested in new releases. 

 

Its nothing to do with clout, its simply giving the market what it wants from a creator pov. Just to put in prospective youtube has overtaken viewership numbers from most TV shows by quite a huge number. and i dont think anyone really thinks that the 250 or so Lions that were sent out to influencers would have solved the production issue HOWEVER its pretty bad optics to keep having large vocal portion of your population not happy with you due to not getting product while there are "marketing" copies flying out for free. 

 

Your hyperbole is fun to read but isn't really compelling.  No one said anything about screwing over new content creators; having access to the newest model is not going to get you special views unless you are literally the only person with that model, which isn't what's happening.  And no one's expecting a video of a single goblin to be a smash hit.  You don't have any data to back up that the newest releases are the largest videos; in fact, algorithmically, the way most of these sites work is not based on the content itself, but based on meta data of the video, such as when it was posted, what audience is built in, what kind of engagement metrics. (The highest view miniature associated video on youtube is a tiktok-esque reel of the slapchop method, using a random miniature).

Being one of a thousand who paints the Lion isn't going to meaningfully increase your metrics unless you are a great painter, at which point, a well painted Gulliman could do the same.  Access to models is not a serious consideration when it comes to expression of artistic skill.  The biggest miniature videos on youtube are not "Here's a painting of this week's new release.", it is massive projects that involve a lot of skill (Such as Zorpazorp's LOTR battleboards, or Squidmar's multiple dioramas, or the actual real heavy hitter for view generation; tutorial videos), or hyper detailed tutorial videos to help people get started, neither of which hinge on utilizing the newest hotness.

 

It's not bad optics, it's literally the optics EVERY company wants; our product is so desirable because of our marketing push that we can't keep product on the shelves.

That's literal end goal for any capitalistic company.  You can not like it, but don't expect it to change any time soon, because it works.

[Borbarad]

Some of the apologism is really hard to watch, but there have been quite a few influencers pointig out the dumpster fire of balance that we got right now. 
 

Imho the consumers shouldn’t be beta testers for a product and anyone who is telling you otherwise is probably not worth your time an attention. 

Edited June 22, 2023 by Borbarad

[sarabando]

2 hours ago, Borbarad said:

Some of the apologism is really hard to watch, but there have been quite a few influencers pointig out the dumpster fire of balance that we got right now. 
 

Imho the consumers shouldn’t be beta testers for a product and anyone who is telling you otherwise is probably not worth your time an attention. 

absolutely this. 

if we were 10 editions in and the game had been better with each release i doubt we would have any problems here however, its the same story every single edition. They break everything, try to fix it, break it again and just keep breaking it with the constant codex creep. 

 

They cant even release their books without simple spelling and editing issues. This is supposed to be one of the most successful companies in the UK, its a joke. And people defending them are the clowns in this circus. 

[Chapter Master Valrak]

Wait…GW send influencers free stuff?! 

[phandaal]

36 minutes ago, Chapter Master Valrak said:

Wait…GW send influencers free stuff?! 

 

Only the ones who don't have their face on the wall at GW HQ with a sign reading "do not speak to this man!"

[Silas7]

On 6/19/2023 at 1:20 AM, Kastor Krieg said:

Another source of sour taste in this case is that the influencers are handed the boxes way ahead of time, so much so that they can build, masterclass paint and record and edit a video about them. This is months in advance

 

A recent Trapped Under Plastic episode touches on this and from them it sounds like it's really not that far in advance and having to actually push GW to 'do the thing' so that they can make the videos.

 

On 6/19/2023 at 11:18 AM, Beaky Brigade said:

It makes sense for GW to send out stuff to small fry creators too. They may have a small following but it's likely their regular audience will be very engaged with them, and once they have you hooked into their cult following anything they might say about GW products is a very powerful marketing tool. "I'm just a regular guy/girl like you from a place you're from, and here's what I have to say about this new GW product".

My employer sometimes advertises in a trade magazine where full page ads costs £1000s and they are always quite disappointed with the limited impact they have. For the cost price of a box set and postage GW can reach 1000s in their target audience, and the saturation means anyone perusing warhammer video and social media channels will be aware of the release they want to promote.

 

Small creators just need to take care they don't lose credibility by becoming over enthusiastic mouthpieces for GW.

 

(My emphasis)

I feel it needs to be underscored that fundamentally the issue is perception.

 

Marketing is the manipulation of perception

 

Also it's easy for a viewer to watch an influencer and simply write them off as being a shill, even if said influencer is being forthright about their thoughts and impressions, simply for having an opposing opinion to what that viewer thinks is the correct outlook. Critical thinking is important to determine if the influencer is being true to themselves and sometimes people are unwilling to give them the time of day to discern that.

[Craig]

Wow. I didn't realise I was opening a can of worms on this topic. I just like to watch people share their hobby and paint cool stuff. Most of the videos I watch are of things I wouldn't buy myself but enjoy seeing other people do what they do with them. 

I see a lot of people have an issue with GW giving (or selling?) some content creators early access to some releases and can see why they would be salty if they in turn couldn't get that product but that's an issue with GW and really not the fault of the person making the video.

[Domhnall]

Influencers are a necessary evil nowadays I find. I also follow and watch several of them on instagram, so I accept that I'm complicit in keeping that a thing! 

On youtube though, I'm a bit more selective. I've found the best ones are smaller creators, as they are more likely to do what they want/like which I feel is a more enjoyable watch as well as not burning themselves out trying to appease "the algorithm".

 

Of course, the nauseating gushing that some influencers give out sometimes balances out the oppressive negativity in other areas of the internet 

[Wraithwing]

How does one actually sign up to the influencer program? 
 

In the run up to Leviathan, I’ve seen loads of Instagramers have advanced copies. Some have less followers on Instagram than I do. 
 

How do you get started with the program? 

[TrawlingCleaner]

38 minutes ago, Wraithwing said:

How does one actually sign up to the influencer program? 
 

In the run up to Leviathan, I’ve seen loads of Instagramers have advanced copies. Some have less followers on Instagram than I do. 
 

How do you get started with the program? 

 

If you're on their radar they'll contact you, there's not really a thing to sign up for 

[Halandaar]

I wondered why people kept reacting to my post, I hadn't realised a reply I made in another thread had been spun off into its own discussion!

 

To be clear I don't hold any particular bad feelings for the content creators themselves just for receiving free stuff, that's obviously great for them - and I've certainly watched my fair share of preview videos - my issue is how GW handle things.

 

Between the Lion and Leviathan we've seen both sides of the coin and how it's just as possible to create frustration as it is to create enthusiasm, and that's all down to product availability. If we can buy the product they're hyping then it doesn't matter how many they sent out for free, and if we can't, it does because that creates an us/them dynamic between the "influencers" and the rest of us, which isn't good for anybody. 

 

Regarding objectivity, I don't think receiving free stuff necessarily undermines the credibility of creators in general, and I've seen enough "big" creators/channels be openly critical of stuff without that affecting their likelihood of receiving more things in the future to be reassured that GW doesn't push people to be positive to maintain access.

[ThePenitentOne]

I always wanted to put up youtube vids of Crusade campaigns. With all the free rules, I would have liked to do it in 10th too- I could actually field painted Drukhari, GSC and Classic metal Sisters in really small numbers. The lack of ongoing Crusade stories in 9th really felt like an untapped niche, and I was crazy surprised that no one gave it a serious go.

 

Problem is the hard reset invalidated all the faction specific content that would have made such stories entertaining and meaningful beyond the monotony of generic veneer that keeps the system on life support until dexes arrive. Watching as five different armies grow and evolve isn't very interesting if there all picking from the same list of six generic battle honours every time they cross a an XP breakpoint. 

 

I mean, realistically? I'd be a terrible content creator anyway- I am a dinosaur slow painter, and in order to film, I basically have to rearrange my apartment so even given armies of painted models, I still wouldn't produce fast enough to accumulate an audience of any size.

[Domhnall]

On 6/24/2023 at 9:00 AM, Wraithwing said:

How does one actually sign up to the influencer program? 
 

In the run up to Leviathan, I’ve seen loads of Instagramers have advanced copies. Some have less followers on Instagram than I do. 
 

How do you get started with the program? 

 

Warning! Peronal opinion time:

Partly a solid push of personal promotion on the respective platforms, partly having the "right" people see you, not being considered a 'negative' to the brand as such*, and probably a good dollup of luck.

 

I think it's one of those things that, unless you're really lucky, you need to 'want' to become an influencer and aim your channel down that road. 

 

* - to clarify, I'm not just meaning negative in that all your content is bashing GW at every opportunity or that you're part of a socially frowned upon group who have particular views that would not be in GW's interest to have direct ties to, these creators obviously will not be what GW want and are a net negative to have around for the business.

Negative can also used in the 'not positive' way, for example you may post well painted models, but you're not pushing the boundaries of painting mastery, technique, or are maybe just a bit dull in your delivery (or are just too small a following to be on their radar). This is of no real net benefit to GW (or other company). 

Or you're a wind up merchant for them, causing them all sorts of bother with lea.... I mean 'rumours'  *cough* @Chapter Master Valrak *cough*  Again, not a net benefit, and obviously can't admit to having on their payroll 

 

[Wraithwing]

3 hours ago, Domhnall said:

 

Warning! Peronal opinion time:

Partly a solid push of personal promotion on the respective platforms, partly having the "right" people see you, not being considered a 'negative' to the brand as such*, and probably a good dollup of luck.

 

I think it's one of those things that, unless you're really lucky, you need to 'want' to become an influencer and aim your channel down that road. 

 

* - to clarify, I'm not just meaning negative in that all your content is bashing GW at every opportunity or that you're part of a socially frowned upon group who have particular views that would not be in GW's interest to have direct ties to, these creators obviously will not be what GW want and are a net negative to have around for the business.

Negative can also used in the 'not positive' way, for example you may post well painted models, but you're not pushing the boundaries of painting mastery, technique, or are maybe just a bit dull in your delivery (or are just too small a following to be on their radar). This is of no real net benefit to GW (or other company). 

Or you're a wind up merchant for them, causing them all sorts of bother with lea.... I mean 'rumours'  *cough* @Chapter Master Valrak *cough*  Again, not a net benefit, and obviously can't admit to having on their payroll 

 

 

That's fair enough. 

 

To be honest, I just post the stuff I paint, so I am not a content creator. I just share my work as and when it's done. That can be days, weeks or even months apart. 

 

That's probably why! :D 

[Bung]

On 6/20/2023 at 7:51 PM, darkhorse0607 said:

I think there are a few different discussions to be had around this, and they're all kind of getting blurred together, at least in my brain. TLDR at the bottom of my TED talk

 

I don't necessarily think that influencers (whether that be IG, those that post on Reddit, Youtube, etc) getting preview copies is an issue in itself. As others have said, it happens almost everywhere. That being said, I do think there are growing pains. This only started, what a year or so ago? At least in full force like it is now. Even as someone who uses social media almost exclusively to keep up with my hobbies it is getting to be a lot and I've stepped back a bit, not particularly because something is not well painted or something like that, but because it all feels like just marketing at this point. Around launch weekends, you can't really step into any of the Warhammer circles without seeing numerous "Here's a product I got for free, early, and this is why it's great and you should buy it." Then when you don't see that, you see all the GW staff members with "I am proud to be part of the team that produced this best model ever." Am I mad at these folks for sharing, no. Is it getting to be a lot? Yes.

 

Likewise, I don't think their getting copies significantly hampers everyone else. A few hundred Lions going out isn't going to undo GW's bad production numbers. At the same time though, it doesn't help. Again, not because they got one, but because when someone goes online to buy something they've been looking forwards to and can't get it, the last thing folks are going to want to see is all of the influencers who got one (again, for free) telling them how great it is to have, and that they should buy one. Merging back into the previous paragraph, the fact that if you go on social media on launch weekend and maybe will struggle to get away from all of the marketing (which I am lumping in the influencers with at this point), it can create some ill feelings. With that, for folks who care about numbers, growing their pages, etc, I think that it can create some bitterness. You know how quickly your page will grow if you're getting pre-release miniatures consistently and can post about them when relatively few people can? Or having your post of something you may have worked hard on barely get any traction because it's buried under a wave of "I got this mini/box for free, lets spread the hype for GW" posts. Again, can create bitterness

 

Lastly, at least from the discourse I've seen here and elsewhere, I think the line between GW and those that have signed the NDAs is getting more blurred. GW doesn't really have a face at this point anymore. Yes, you have folks like Adam or Eddy who do preview streams (not targeting them, just the only ones whose names come to mind anymore) but between OnlyHands, the leaving of Louise, Duncan, Peach, etc, and the stepping back of GW in terms of crediting, letting their staff members have more of a voice in the community, etc, the influencers are getting to be the only visible people that folks can associate with GW. Yes you still have folks like Darren Latham with a large following and work for the company, but the amount that actual staff members are allowed to do and be a part of (see Warhammer Fest and the lack of development teams for an example) is far less than it used to be. Added to all of this is that GW is hardly the most friendly when it comes to comments or feedback on their channels. There are no comments on the Youtube channel allowed (with the exception of the 9th edition launch trailer from what I've seen). IG and FB comments are heavily moderated. Twitch streams are heavily moderated. They don't have things like comment sections on WHC or discussion boards, etc. All of this is meaning that there isn't a lot of two-way discussion going on with the company. Shoot, to compare it to video games for a second, when a game launches horribly, or something goes wrong with production or something like that, you at least get a "we're sorry" jpeg to the point where it's a meme now. GW, with all the things that have gone "wrong" in the last few years, whether that is broken armies, production delays (like when they said the Lion would be out before 9th), production issues in general (they could've easily said stock is down due to Leviathan's production at any point and soothed things over but haven't), etc, we have gotten one tongue-in-cheek video about the Votaan being broken and that's about it.

 

So where is all this rant going?

 

I'm just trying to voice that, at least in my eyes, there have been more than a few oopsies over the last few years from the company and disgruntled feelings from the community at those decisions. At the same time, they've withdrawn on a communication (not marketing) side from where they were at around the start of 8th. They now saturate the market with marketing both from them and the influencers, and since they won't talk to anyone, and the influencers do, I think a lot of the frustrations are taken out on them.

 

To be very clear, I don't think the influencers should take the blame for any of this, nor am I endorsing angry comments to them or anything like that. Im sure that 95% of the folks on here would take the free brand building and free miniatures if GW offered them the same deal. I just think that if you give people the option of typing a comment to a GW social media page about frustrations (constructive, I couldn't care less if someone goes off on the social media team disrespectfully and gets their comments deleted) and has their comment deleted, or writing an email to get the same copy/paste response, or taking that same comment to someone who's more active, communicative, etc, and is essentially part of the extended GW marketing team at this point, folks are going to do the latter.

 

All of this being said, if GW would lift more of a finger to help quell community concerns and communicate (again, actually communicate, not marketing-based WHC posts) I don't think there would be nearly the hostility towards the influencers as there actually is.

 

TLDR:
GW doesn't talk to anyone but those in the NDA program, so the influencers are catching heat over GWs poor decision-making. It's not the influencer's fault, but until GW changes it's probably going to remain this way

 

Getting the heat from the fans is the price for getting free GW miniatures in advance.