Clarifying Precision Shots

[Valkyrion]

I have a completely fabricated unit of 10 models all of which have Precision Shots (6+).

5 have bolters, 3 have plasma guns, 2 have lascannons. 

 

My opponent has 7 marines with bolters, a sergeant, an apothecary and a melta gunner.

 

I pick the Lascannons to shoot first, both hit and one rolls a 6. I pick the Apothecary to take the 6.  (I put a green dice next to him to signify he must take a lascannon save, black dice next to the unit - this is just for my own way of visualising it)

Now that I think I'm likely to kill the Apothecary, I fire my Plasma Guns and get one 6, a hit and a miss. I put the 6 on the Sergeant and put a red dice next to him and black dice next to the unit.  

Finally, the bolters. I roll 3 6's and 2 misses, so I choose the Melta Gunner to take all 3 hits. 

 

I then go on to the wound rolls, yes?

 

I want to make sure I'm right here before I ask the follow up question.

[Slips]

if you dont fast roll, the method is:

1. Select A (1) model
2. Fire their gun / roll to-hit
3. If you hit, roll to-wound
4. If they have a save to take, your opponent rolls the save
5. If the model is ID'd or reduced to 0 wounds, remove

And you do this individually for everything in the unit.

But that would take forever so you roll all like weapons at the same time.

 

So in your example, youd separate the Lascannons, roll to hit, wound, saves if possible, if they die, remove model

Then move onto Plasma Guns

Then move onto Bolters

[Valkyrion]

Okay, maybe this is where I'm batch rolling incorrectly; I want to roll to hit with lascannons, then roll to hit with plasmas, then roll to hit with bolters, then allocate wounds, then save

 

@Slips are you saying I do the to hit, to wound, to save process per weapon before moving on to the next?

 

 

[Slips]

5 minutes ago, Valkyrion said:

Okay, maybe this is where I'm batch rolling incorrectly; I want to roll to hit with lascannons, then roll to hit with plasmas, then roll to hit with bolters, then allocate wounds, then save

 

@Slips are you saying I do the to hit, to wound, to save process per weapon before moving on to the next?

 

 

yup, pretty much

[Xenith]

 

@SlipsIt works a bit differently, no? You missed the wound pools out I think, from what I read the order of operations, even when slow rolling is:

 

On 6/21/2023 at 8:57 PM, Slips said:

if you dont fast roll, the method is:

1. Select A (1) model
2. Fire their gun / roll to-hit
3. If you hit, roll to-wound
4. Repeat for every firing model in the unit and group wounds caused by similar weapons/special rules together into wound pools.
5. Opponent picks a wound pool to start saving from , and picks a model to start saving on.
6. If they have a save to take, your opponent rolls the save
7. If the model is ID'd or reduced to 0 wounds, remove

 

On 6/21/2023 at 5:47 PM, Valkyrion said:

I have a completely fabricated unit of 10 models all of which have Precision Shots (6+).

5 have bolters, 3 have plasma guns, 2 have lascannons. 

 

My opponent has 7 marines with bolters, a sergeant, an apothecary and a melta gunner.

 

I pick the Lascannons to shoot first, both hit and one rolls a 6. I pick the Apothecary to take the 6.  (I put a green dice next to him to signify he must take a lascannon save, black dice next to the unit - this is just for my own way of visualising it)

Now that I think I'm likely to kill the Apothecary, I fire my Plasma Guns and get one 6, a hit and a miss. I put the 6 on the Sergeant and put a red dice next to him and black dice next to the unit.  

Finally, the bolters. I roll 3 6's and 2 misses, so I choose the Melta Gunner to take all 3 hits. 

 

I then go on to the wound rolls, yes?

 

I want to make sure I'm right here before I ask the follow up question.

 

This is not correct - wounds are allocated at the wound allocation stage, which is after the wound roll. 

 

In the above example, you roll to hit with the 2 lascannons, one gets a 6 and the other hits on a 4. Both wound. You now create 2 separate wound pools, one for 'precision lascannon wounds' and the other for 'non precision lascannon wounds'.

 

You then roll to hit with the bolters and separate out the precision hits from non precision, and roll to wound separately, resulting in 2 wound pools, precise and imprecise bolters. 

Do the same with the plasma guns - except now you have to split them into precise non breaching, precise breaching, imprecise non breaching and imprecise breaching (complex) 

 

You now have 8 wound pools, precise and imprecise for each of 3 weapons, plus the breaching and non breaching for the plasma. 

 

In all instances, the rules say that now your opponent picks one of these wound pools to start allocating wounds from. At this point if they pick the precise lacannon wound pool, this is allocated by the attacker, so then you get to allocate the wound and the apoc dies. In reality, they will pick imprecise bolter wounds, which are allocated by the defender, and take saves on 3 mooks, getting FNP from the priest who is still alive. Then they take the imprcise plasma, lose some models, then the imprecise lascannon. 

 

Now, they get to the precise wounds. They pick the bolters. You allocate the first wound to the apothecary, they roll to save. If it passes, then you can allocate the second wound, just in the same way as you roll saves one at a time when defending. You can keep allocating wounds to a model until the target dies. If the apoc then survives the bolter wounds, then you can allocate a plasma wound to them, and if they somehow survive that, then you can allocate the lascannon wound to them. 

 

You do not allocate precision wounds at the point of a successful precise hit. This is a common misconception that most youtubers seem to play, and is not supported by the rules. 

 

You cannot lose out on precision shots by overallocating them to one model, as they are allocated, then rolled to save on a one by one basis. This is why precision is so strong in 2.0! 

 

I hope that explains it! 

Edited June 23, 2023 by Xenith

[General Zodd]

While we’re on the topic, I have a further question for you all. As all attacks are done against majority WS (in combat) and toughness (in combat and shooting), if I shoot at a unit with a Primarch presumably I’m rolling my precision strikes against the majority Toughness then it’s only at the point of making saving rolls that I then choose to allocate to a Primarch? In effect getting cheeky lower to-wound rolls into the bargain. Is that correct?

[Gorgoff]

9 hours ago, General Zodd said:

While we’re on the topic, I have a further question for you all. As all attacks are done against majority WS (in combat) and toughness (in combat and shooting), if I shoot at a unit with a Primarch presumably I’m rolling my precision strikes against the majority Toughness then it’s only at the point of making saving rolls that I then choose to allocate to a Primarch? In effect getting cheeky lower to-wound rolls into the bargain. Is that correct?

Yes