More Firstborn retired

[Casual Heresy]

GW have just announced that a load of firstborn vehicle and unit kits are being retired. The firstborn contingent of the new deck will be much reduced (though they've stated Tacticals, Devestators and Rhinos will remain.)

 

Some are obvious like both flavours of scout. But a fe surprises including the Hunter/Stalker and Assault Squad.

 

Space Marine Range Update – Bikes, Land Speeders, and More Are Soon Zooming off into the Sunset - Warhammer Community (warhammer-community.com)

 

 

Edited July 24, 2023 by Casual Heresy
More info

[Vassakov]

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2023/07/24/space-marine-range-update-bikes-land-speeders-and-more-are-soon-zooming-off-into-the-sunset

 

There's quite a bit there. Will be interesting to see if the new Codex differentiates Librarians by armour type rather than Primaris/Firstborn moving forward.

[CL_Mission]

Goodbye Hunter/Stalker I won't miss you.

[Matrindur]

The only ones who don't have a Primaris equivalent (or will very likely get one in the near future) are the Stalker/Hunter and Scout Bikes right? 

Edited July 24, 2023 by Matrindur

[Crimson Longinus]

Everything else makes sense, but why on Earth Stalker/Hunter? It is pretty new kit.

[Vassakov]

 

Just now, Crimson Longinus said:

Everything else makes sense, but why on Earth Stalker/Hunter? It is pretty new kit.

 

Only thing I can think is that nobody buys it and it's basically a waste of production capacity.

[Karhedron]

I think the Assault Squads and Scouts tie in with rumours of the new Primaris kits incoming for these units. Not sure what Marines will do for anti-air.

[Crimson Longinus]

2 minutes ago, Vassakov said:

 

 

Only thing I can think is that nobody buys it and it's basically a waste of production capacity.

I guess this is easier than writing it rules that do not suck...

[Kallas]

Oh yay, more Firstborn gone. That wasn't going to happen was it? Here I thought we could totally trust GW when they said Primaris were 'reinforcements not replacements' 

 

Now we'll get more repackaged units with a less interesting look. Cool...

[grailkeeper]

Some of these have been in the hobby longer than I have. Land Speeders and Bikes were iconic. Makes me a bit sad to see them go for nostalgia reasons.

[CL_Mission]

Maybe there will be a replacement in the upcoming wave we just haven't heard about in rumours yet. A missile tank variant of the Gladiator perhaps. 

[Petitioner's City]

Just now, Crimson Longinus said:

I guess this is easier than writing it rules that do not suck...

 

That doesn't matter, it then takes up space of something else.

 

It can also just be that some people at GW view it as a failure, be it in terms of design or something else, or may be wanting the game to move away from the headache of adding flyers into the main game a decade ago.  It's ten years old, and was unnecessary really - a whirlwind could be anti-air, be it a Helios or a normal one. 

[TrawlingCleaner]

=][= Threads merged. As ever folks, remember to keep it civil and kind. This will be concerning for many =][=

[Stitch5000]

I would wager that a bunch of these units are pre-CAD kits and use analogue processes to maintain the tools, which makes them way more expensive and harder to keep in production. 

[Joe]

Sad to see so many classic units disappearing; particularly those sculpts that aren't that old, such as the Assault Squad.

[Lord Marshal]

I'm surprised to see Scouts going, considering they're still used (and even had a rebranded webstore page) for 30k... well, Scouts.

 

The Librarian is also a relatively new sculpt iirc, and makes for great conversion fodder.

 

Assault Marines vanishing I think makes it apparent Tacticals and Devastators probably won't survive into the next Space Marine codex after this upcoming one - whether that's a second one in 10th or in 11th.

 

Edited July 24, 2023 by Lord Marshal

[WrathOfTheLion]

1 minute ago, Lord Marshal said:

I'm surprised to see Scouts going, considering they're still used (and even had a rebranded webstore page) for 30k... well, Scouts.

 

The Librarian is also a relatively new sculpt iirc, and makes for great conversion fodder.

 

I suspect scouts are about to have a new kit come out via Kill Team, that's been rumored for a while (and was teased by GW a while back).

Edited July 24, 2023 by WrathOfTheLion

[Deafbok]

I just started a topic over in the Adeptus Astartes forum, but I'm particularly sad over the loss of Company Veterans, even if they weren't a specific kit (Effectively the Command Squad, but I had a 5 man kitbashed squad with Storm Shields and combi-plasmas as a centerpiece unit for my DiY chapter that are no longer tabletop legal...) 

Most units I can see why - there are Primaris analogues or they are redundant (How many flavours of Dread do we really need?) but I'm perplexed by the loss of Assault Squads and the Thunderfire Cannon. I suppose you can build the former out of the VanVet kit anyway, but the latter has been a staple of competitive lists for a few editions, hasn't it? 

[MechaMan]

2 minutes ago, WrathOfTheLion said:

I suspect scouts are about to have a new kit come out via Kill Team, that's been rumored for a while (and was teased by GW a while back).

Yeah no way they create a new transfer sheet with a scout decal then retire scouts entirely. Further credence to the new scout kit rumour. 

[WrathOfTheLion]

5 minutes ago, Deafbok said:

Most units I can see why - there are Primaris analogues or they are redundant (How many flavours of Dread do we really need?) but I'm perplexed by the loss of Assault Squads and the Thunderfire Cannon. I suppose you can build the former out of the VanVet kit anyway, but the latter has been a staple of competitive lists for a few editions, hasn't it? 

The assault squad likely has two nails in its coffin, one from any upcoming Primaris Jump pack unit, and a second from the MK VI Assault Squad for Horus Heresy. It's a victim of its own pricing at this point, any HH box will obviously need to have ten to make a full squad, but the Assault Squad has only five for $60 USD.

 

That said, I really do like the kit, and I may try to get a couple more boxes to fill out some squads.

Edited July 24, 2023 by WrathOfTheLion

[Karhedron]

16 minutes ago, Stitch5000 said:

I would wager that a bunch of these units are pre-CAD kits and use analogue processes to maintain the tools, which makes them way more expensive and harder to keep in production. 

 

Injection molding tools don't require maintenance. Once the die is cut, the molds are good for up to a million presses (from a hard steel die). There are far older kits still in production like the Eldar Falcon and Vyper (both dating back to the last century) and they are fine. Kits made using CAD makes it easier to reuse design elements in other CADs but has no effect on the longevity of the molds.

 

This is a logistics decision, nothing to do with the molds.

[Brother Christopher]

I'm not happy with how GW communicated this. It's clear that the TFC and Land Speeders get the Legends treatment, while Rhinos, Tacticals and Devastators are safe (for now).

 

Do we know what will happen to Ironclad Dreadnoughts Stalkers/Hunters or Scouts?

[lansalt]

Now, this is the actual end of the classic SM range that has endured for 35 years or so. Despite newer primaris versions, you could still buy and build traditional SM armies just like those since RT if you were so inclined, but no more. End of an era.

 

 

 

[Wormwoods]

So it goes. We'll see how many of those upcoming new marine units are combined Primaris/Firstborn in the lore, like the new Sternguard. Toss a few MK7 helmets in with the kit. 

[Kallas]

Just now, Brother Christopher said:

Rhinos, Tacticals and Devastators are safe (for now).

Give it a month, then they'll announce the next wave of retirements. Give people enough time to buy a few boxes of Devastators, then they can pull them out after they've emptied the warehouse of their existing stock. Or people buy less of the remaining Firstborn kits because they're unstable, which gives them more reason to pull them because 'they're not selling'.