Pronoun question

[Roomsky]

EverythingIsGreat - I do think you asked this in good faith, I totally get the experience of encountering this stuff and being unfamiliar and a bit perplexed by it. The first time I encountered they/them default pronouns, I spent the duration of the story wondering "what, does he have like servants that follow him around or something?"

 

Which is especially funny, because I've identified as non-binary for years.

 

But, in terms of set dressing for a story - I do think the unfamiliarity might be unconsciously biasing you a bit. Is it not common to describe a character's gender? The colour of their skin? How they style their hair? How thin or fat they are? It's just a quirk to make them stick out a little more, and inform who they COULD be, as a person. And when people have this knee-jerk reaction to your question, it's not really because of you specifically - it's probably because they're used to having online conversations about this that AREN'T in good faith. We don't exactly see threads around these parts about "oy, why does everyone keep describing Sanguinius' blonde hair? What are they suggesting?"

 

What I must firmly disagree with regarding the posts I see here is that non-binary pronouns are a specific quirk of our tiny sliver of history and everything else somehow isn't. Guardsmen infantry stories can have 50/50 split of the sexes nowadays and no sane person bats an eye. Black Library's had gay couples in its writing for years. Our ideas of what is masculine/feminine in general is quite specific to our time and geographical place, its not some inherent, ingrained pattern throughout humanity itself.To suggest that other contemporary societal elements in 40k writing are "normal," but they/them pronouns are not is, forgive me, a bit naive.

 

As I said, 40k is IMPOSSIBLY egalitarian for an authoritarian regime. The "we don't care who you are just shoot the xenos" cannot happen in a society like the Imperium's. And yet, it is written that this is the case! Unrealistic self expression in the face of such horrible living conditions has been a tenant of 40k since day 1. Have you all SEEN the original Necromunda art? That hair needs a lot of upkeep for whatever personal statement the gangers are trying to make. 40k is MADE of counterculture at its roots, embrace the punk energy dear Fraters.

Edited November 12, 2023 by Roomsky

[grailkeeper]

It would be cool if there was a Mechanicus character who had no pronouns at all. Gamma9 must always be referred to as Gamma9 as there is only one Gamma9 who has ascended beyond pronouns.

 

Gamma9self might be getting a bit into the weeds though.

[EverythingIsGreat]

2 hours ago, Roomsky said:

But, in terms of set dressing for a story - I do think the unfamiliarity might be unconsciously biasing you a bit.

 

Not “might”, unfamiliarity definitely engenders bias. In my defense, this is universal. We are all biased according our knowledge and experience, which are always limited. Inevitably all opinions, theories or beliefs resulting from them are also limited and therefore inherently biased. That goes for the most celebrated artist and most inventive scientist, as well as a completely unschooled hermit.

 

But I asked the questions in the OP thinking that everybody recognizes that, and made clear that the personal novelty of the situation was a factor. The reactions are telling. It seems some people went directly into combat mode. Sure, there are reasons why people have knee-jerk reactions to real or perceived “issues”. But this is not that discussion. It is a new, unrelated one, by somebody who had no prior involvement. Can we discuss on this level? Because I certainly don’t want to bring anyone’s baggage into this.

 

Apart from that, your comment was enlightening, and thank you. I do have a few strays to pick:

 

* As somebody who lived for a few years in the past under a repressive regime, I can tell you that in my experience the regime was otherwise extremely liberal. If you did as you were told and bent the knee, you could do (at least in private, often in public) whatever the hell you wanted. The red line was doubting the regime’s right to absolute power, and not lip-synching their “truths” when asked (which was rare). Away from that, the regime had provided plenty of "liberal" options, as safety valves open to keep people dull.

 

* Don’t believe the hype regarding the counterculture. It needs the mainstream culture to react to as much as the mainstream culture needs the reaction to it. This also goes for the so-called “punk energy”. The energy itself is as real as young people. But the channeling of it is something entirely different and controlled from the outside.

 

2 hours ago, Roomsky said:

Which is especially funny, because I've identified as non-binary for years.

 

You are candid with the personal note so I feel I should reciprocate. I have spent the largest part of my life up to now by trying to be rid of any “identity” whether this is national, cultural, sexual, social, philosophical, religious etc. In my view they are all limits imposed by the outside or by my own need to “belong” (ie the demand for security which is also bestirred by the outside). I wouldn’t call myself anything, except “partially successful” in this.

 

Anyway, I think I am done with the topic, I consider it answered.

[Brother Tyler]