2k Competitive Russes and Super-Heavy

[MrKoolPants]

Hello friends. Long time, no see. I'll have some time to hobby in 3-6 months, so I'm getting back up to speed on the state of Astra Militarum in 10th. I wanted the group's feedback on a list idea, "Russ Spam + Superheavy."

 

The idea is to take many tough models in order to limit the usefulness of the opponent's anti-infantry weapons and to play aggressively for board control. 11 Lascannons, 9 Hunter-Killer Missiles, and the Volcano Cannon provide long range/Alpha Strike to destroy key vehicle/monster/tough character units. Scouts, Scions, and Gaunt's Ghosts provide objective play (the former two being brought back with Reinforcements! when possible). Below I have the list and some questions for discussion.

 

List

HQ

Gaunt's Ghosts

Enginseer

 

OTHER

3x (1) Scout Sentinel w/ Lascannon and Hunter-Killer Missile

3x Leman Russ Demolisher w/ Lascannon, 2x Multi-Melta, Hunter-Killer Missile

Leman Russ Exterminator w/ Lascannon, 2x Multi-Melta, Hunter-Killer Missile

Leman Russ Punisher w/ 3x Heavy Bolter, Hunter-Killer Missile

Hellhound w/ Inferno Cannon, Heavy Bolter, Hunter-Killer Missile

Shadowsword w/ Volcano Cannon, 4x Lascannon, 5x Twin Heavy Bolter

3x Tempestus Scions (5-man) w/ Plasmagun, Meltagun, Plasma Pistol

 

1995 Points

 

Questions

Is Lord Solar Necessary? Notably missing from this list is Lord Solar Leontus. What I have found in trying to design a tank-heavy list is that the Lord Solar becomes an obvious squishy target for the opponent when the main body of the list is high-T. By the time you add a command squad and a 10 or 20 -man blob, you are looking at 250-310 points for a buffing unit which will be targeted early. Leontus is good, but I'm wondering if he is a crutch that encourages conservative, "castle-style" play based on the 24" range of his orders (with a Master Vox). I like CadianShock's analysis here.

 

Is a super-heavy viable competitively? By taking both a super-heavy tank and many other high-T hulls, I am hoping to put my opponent into a target priority dilemma. I want to make them say: "should I shoot the Shadowsword in the backfield, or the Leman Russ/Hellhound/Sentinels controlling the mid-board?" Lukas Duchaine took #1 at The Hogtowner 2023 tournament with a super-heavy list, which got me thinking.

 

Are there enough scoring units in this list? Between three units of 5-Man Scions, three solo scout sentinels, and Gaunt's Ghosts, I wonder if there is enough to score here? I think that Reinforcements! is a unique stratagem in our index right now. I am trying to leverage it by playing ablative scoring units throughout the game as CP permit. That being said, I intend to play the vehicles aggressively, so it may be as likely that Russes or the Hellhound might be able to contest objectives. 

Edited November 22, 2023 by MrKoolPants

[sairence]

Just one thing to say at this point, as it's late for me:

 

How viable tank spam and especially superheavies are depends to a large degree on terrain density. WTC terrain makes moving and even deploying a Baneblade-sized thing very difficult.

[domsto]

Lord Solar is absolutly nessecary for any Gaurd List. He is the only Valid Option to get Orders for Tanks, he can even Order a Super Heavy. So i would try to include him, perhaps you can hide him behind the Super Heavy.

 

Regarding Super Heavy, what i found out during my last few Games, when it comes to Tanks "it's go big or go home" normally the Leman Russ or Dorn are underperforming and the Super heavy pulls his weight.

[Emperor Ming]

Yeah, that's the major issue with tank spam

 

lord solar can cover 3 with orders, having the rest as bs4, is just not worth it

[sairence]

I'd echo that Lord Solar is pretty necessary if you're looking at superheavies, or even multiple tanks. A 10 man infantry squad with a platoon squad is only 120p. Plus Lord Solar and you're looking at only 40p more than a TC to keep your motors buffed and flexible on a significant portion of the field, while also not needing to keep any tanks back to hold your home objective and out of sight. It's not really a tax, because it fulfills a pretty important function that you don't want any of your other units to be stuck with and is 3 times as effective at buffing your vehicles as your one other option, the TC. 

 

Plus, the extra CP is always good. You guarantee you have enough CP to keep popping Reinforcements for your scorers or Armoured Might for your tanks.

 

If you're looking at a competitive list, he simply ticks too many boxes not to take. That's my take, anyway.

 

As for the list, I don't see the point in Punishers. Eradicators get less shots, but are still very good into infantry and can't get tied up in CC. Which will happen. Alternatively I'd add in more Hellhounds.

 

From personal experience, I'd also cut the Sentinel units down to 2 models each. You can't get battleshocked from losses and their firepower is kinda neglible anyway. The loss of power I found was outweighed by the extra maneuverability from being a smaller unit. And anything that can cut down 2 with ease won't struggle much more with 3 either. 

[MrKoolPants]

Solid advice across the board, thanks y’all.

 

It seems like super-heavies are viable, depending on terrain setups. From your and other reports, it seems their damage output is giving opponents the business. 
 

It also seems like Leontus is a must-take across the board. He does offer a pretty amazing set of buffs and abilities. 
 

My scout sentinels are three solos already, I adjusted my list above to reflect that more clearly.
 

Below is a refined version of the list based on feedback. I lost Gaunt’s Ghosts and the Leman Russ Punisher. I added Leontus, Cadian Command Squad, and some Shock Troops. 

 

Spoiler

HQ 

Lord Solar Leontus

Cadian Command Squad w/ Grand Strategist 

Enginseer

 

BATTLELINE

Cadian Shock Troops (10-man) w/ Meltagun

 

OTHER

3x (1) Scout Sentinel w/ Lascannon and Hunter-Killer Missile

3x Leman Russ Demolisher w/ Lascannon, 2x Multi-Melta, Hunter-Killer Missile

Leman Russ Exterminator w/ Lascannon, 2x Multi-Melta, Hunter-Killer Missile

Hellhound w/ Inferno Cannon, Heavy Bolter, Hunter-Killer Missile

Shadowsword w/ Volcano Cannon, 4x Lascannon, 5x Twin Heavy Bolter

3x Tempestus Scions (5-man) w/ Plasmagun, Meltagun, Plasma Pistol

 

2000 points

Edited November 22, 2023 by MrKoolPants