Seeking enlightenment

[Marshall Bretton]

Greetings brothers and happy new year.

 

I am looking for a bit of guidance. The recent changes (last few years of stuff) have me really interested in the dark angels and I am looking for help on what novels to look at to find more background info.

 

I am specifically looking for more info on:

The chapter after the great rift, specifically regarding the fallen and the risen as well as Luther.

The legion at the close of the heresy, specifically Corswain and what he was doing. I know he has something to do with the death guard but I don't know where the story for that is.

 

I appreciate any help, I am definitely going to be starting a new force based around the risen as I like the idea of ancient knights from the dawn of the imperium alongside the returned lion finding their place in the 41st(2nd) millennium.

[aura_enchanted]

okay here's the books i recommend they cover your stuff but i will note with a star if they aren't but still worth getting. be warned though dark angels lore is dreadful, it never seems to make any sense and im convinced games workshop has been winging it and hoping it works out and thats because we are redheaded step children, games workshop hates that we exist and would much rather enjoy writing dude bro space wolf lore.

post fall of cadia (and including):

fall of cadia (the campaign book)
psychic awakening: ritual of the damned
a brothers keeper (short story)
war of secrets
lion: son of the forest
the test of faith
lazarus: first of the fallen
cypher lord of the fallen
the buried beast

horus heresy:
descent of angels
fallen angels

lion el johnson: lord of the first*
dreadwing*
angels of caliban

by the lions command
holder of the keys (audio drama)
The End and the Death Volume II

other: vox tenebris
 

Edited January 1 by aura_enchanted

[WrathOfTheLion]

If you know someone who has a copy or can find online the information from Crusade, the Horus Heresy black book, that contains a great amount of information about the early Legion and its general and eventual organization. It also contains a lot of the heraldry and what it means.

[N1SB]

On 1/1/2024 at 11:31 PM, Gaius Maximus said:

The legion at the close of the heresy, specifically Corswain and what he was doing. I know he has something to do with the death guard but I don't know where the story for that is.

 

I appreciate any help, I am definitely going to be starting a new force based around the risen as I like the idea of ancient knights from the dawn of the imperium alongside the returned lion finding their place in the 41st(2nd) millennium.

 

I might well join you, Brother, after reading Luther: First of the Fallen awhile back for a friend.  I do not necessarily recommend it, Brother Aura_Enchanted did not make a mistake by leaving it out on his list of recommended reading.  However, 1 nugget at the beginning is very relevant to our interests in the Risen.

 

The framework is Luther was kept in a stasis jail cell for 10,000 years, but every millennia or so, some Supreme Grand Master would interrogate him for some big mission they're on that ties back to the Horus Heresy.  Luther gets beaten up, then blurts out some memory just to make it stop, like...

 

 

"Two dozen, perhaps"

 

It seems like the vast, vast majority of the Fallen weren't even really Traitors at all, at least not initially.

 

Luther: First of the Fallen was written before the Risen were a thing.  It starts soon after the the Destruction of Caliban.  The 1st Supreme Grandmaster, Farith Redloss (he was the commander of the now defunct Dreadwing in 30k), was asking Luther if he killed the Lion, if he caused the warpstorm that sundered Caliban.

 

Luther insists he did neither of those things, but he sounds like he's concussed, like trying to interview a boxer or MMA fighter after he lost a fight.  He could also be genuinely confused (maybe it'll turn out in future lore he was possessed by Chaos) or lying, but he kinda confesses something: a simple meeting.

 

Luther was meeting with his conspirators, and they were like him and 4 other people, that's all.  One of them was the Lord Cypher; I'm still not sure if that's the same Cypher as in the current era.  What they wanted wasn't to worship Chaos, or to join Horus; they wanted Caliban independence from the Imperium.

 

So this tiny group was discussing how many Dark Angels could they they trust do treacherously turn blades against their own Brothers, if needed.

 

"Two dozen, perhaps," was the exact quote from the Lord Cypher.  Two dozen!

 

It was almost like a comedy skit, like someone misheard two dozen as 2,000.  The First Legion was one of the bigger ones iirc and, if we put those 2,000 across Caliban in positions of power over tens of thousands, then maybe you have a chance.   Then someone corrects them, 2 dozen, not thousand.

 

Then as a punchline Lord Cypher actually helpfully volunteers, "I'm actually counting myself in that two dozen."

 

So Luther, his conspirators (they actually name them), then another two dozen perhaps...like around 30 guys.  That's barely enough for a legal 30k army list unless you're doing an All-Dreadnought list or something.  Those two dozen, btw, were all promoted to Lieutenants in preparation for the Lion's return to Caliban.

 

The rest of the Caliban Dark Angels got dragged along, you could say they were "just following orders."  In fact, that meeting was about asking Luther what his plan was.  A lot of the story and the book as a whole was everyone trying to figure out what Luther really wanted.  The comedy of the tragedy was, he himself didn't know.

 

This novel, like a lot of stuff for Dark Angels, did the whole "asks more questions than it answered" thing.  What it did reveal was the Caliban conspiracy was not widespread, there were very few that were involved, and even among them, they didn't know what they wanted.  The Fallen didn't so much fall as hang out with losers.

 

So for the purposes of the Risen.  In their tens of thousands, they repent for the sins of...two dozen, perhaps.

[WrathOfTheLion]

I quite liked Luther: First of the Fallen, so I think that depends on taste. That style of in-mind stuff is something Gav Thorpe can actually thrive doing, so I think it was a hit from him. It's certainly not a good book to start with, however, regardless of taste. Tying in with the Risen part again though, it really emphasizes that the final decision to betray the Lion happened basically minutes before they got there, cementing that Luther and all wouldn't be considered traitorous in the sense of the Horus Heresy, as well that the vast majority of Dark Angels on Caliban had absolutely no clue what was going on.

 

As for a Risen force, I'm also planning on expanding my DA with a fourth 'wing', so to say. I'll do some Companions of course, but I think there's a lot of fun adding some Bladeguard Veterans, Sternguard Veterans, Deathwing Knights and maybe some Deathwing Terminators in that color scheme. Would make for a nice little force to pal around with the Lion.

Edited January 4 by WrathOfTheLion

[crimsondave]

On 1/1/2024 at 8:52 PM, WrathOfTheLion said:

If you know someone who has a copy or can find online the information from Crusade, the Horus Heresy black book, that contains a great amount of information about the early Legion and its general and eventual organization. It also contains a lot of the heraldry and what it means.

You peaked my interest in this book so I looked on eBay.  $500.  

[WrathOfTheLion]

1 hour ago, crimsondave said:

You peaked my interest in this book so I looked on eBay.  $500.  

Yeah, if you don't have one, then I don't think it's worth getting at ebay prices. I got my copy when they were on general sale. So if you find a friend that has one or can find the pages elsewhere, then that's the way to go, as it's out of print.

 

It'd be a great service if they added them up on the WH vault, if they're not going to keep them around.

Edited January 6 by WrathOfTheLion

[Interrogator Stobz]

Wouldn't it be great if GW kept enough books on hand to sell to us.

I'd love a dead tree version of both Luther and the limited Lion books.

Not gonna do eBay either. Used books for over $100? Nope.

[WrathOfTheLion]

1 hour ago, Interrogator Stobz said:

Wouldn't it be great if GW kept enough books on hand to sell to us.

I'd love a dead tree version of both Luther and the limited Lion books.

Not gonna do eBay either. Used books for over $100? Nope.

I did end up picking up the limited of the Lion primarch one and the Luther one on their release, but not the newer Lion one for 40k, the site crashed for that and I wasn't going to do ebay for it afterwards.

 

In the case of Crusade though, to be fair, it's for a previous edition of 30k. So they're not going to keep producing it.

Edited January 6 by WrathOfTheLion

[Interrogator Stobz]

Same here on the crash thing, scalpers got my copy of Luther and Lion.

I did get the Primarch book too, and Crusade as that wasn't a Click for luck purchase fiasco. 

[Marshall Bretton]

I do have luther from a while back, annoyed I didn't pick up either of the lion books when I had the chance. I'll just have to settle for kindle versions.

 

Yeah the black HH books are just silly prices on eBay these days. I'll try find a digital copy.

[WrathOfTheLion]

On 1/6/2024 at 4:56 AM, Marshall Bretton said:

I do have luther from a while back, annoyed I didn't pick up either of the lion books when I had the chance. I'll just have to settle for kindle versions.

 

Yeah the black HH books are just silly prices on eBay these days. I'll try find a digital copy.

I'm only missing books 4-6 in hardback for the black books, and I did not think those were worth it for ebay prices 3-4 years ago. Now, I think they're definitely not worth it, which is why I recommended trying to find it online or reading a friend's copy.