Hypercrypt wins LVO 2023. Discussion:

[Prot]

So for those who don't follow the scene, I just finished watching a lot of the final games at LVO this year, and Hypercrypt won it all.

 

I'll be honest I play Hypercrypt a lot, and I'm surprised it won. Not because it's bad but for these 2 reasons:

 

1. It scores well, but has a VERY narrow margin for error. 

 

2. Match up dependent.

 

So in my view there are some match ups that just can give Hypercrypt a really hard time. For example, Marines with multi Infiltrators (very common) or something that blocks out a lot of stuff but can hit hard. 

 

I think he managed to get through the tournament without a very bad match up (which I think we all can agree this is something you pretty much have to have going for you to win something this competitive.) 

 

That being said the army was extremely well played. I almost can't remember seeing what I would personally call an error. Many of the games (I think 4 )were extremely close (Like.... under 10 points difference. Don't quote me on that but that was my memory of the games.)

 

Also I did think he was going to potentially lose a game against some equally excellent players... Votann for instance. I still can't figure out why his Votann opponent managed to tag a Nightbringer, almost kill it, and then leave it alone while it regenerated wounds for the following turns..... stuff like that.

 

A lot of viewers though the Monolith was huge, but I felt the opponents just really underestimated the movement of the army as a whole more than any one thing or unit contribution.

 

Also it's worth nothing that in the Final Game, the Necron player proceeded to roll a double 6 save!!! Which he had to do or the Monolith was guaranteed dead. The difference this made in the game can't be understated.

 

I think the lack of understanding by many opponents had a big part in this as well. It's new, and I think up until the strat nerf, the 'competitive' detachment was strongly viewed as the Canoptek Court. 

 

if anyone's curious, I'd recommend searching for Wargames Live on Youtube where many of the games were covered. 

 

I'm curious if anyone saw it and what you thought of the games/detachment/etc?

 

 

 

Edited January 22 by Prot

[N1SB]

Thanks for starting this thread, boy am I glad I made a Necrons army for this edition.  Also, really good analysis there, Brother Prot.

 

I kinda got the info via osmosis, just YouTube recommendations and hearing our Warhammer Store crowd talk about it.  But what I was hearing was Hypercrypt Necrons, Eldar, Hypercrypt Necrons, CSM, Hypercrypt Necrons, etc., in the final stages of LVO.  I'm thick as 2 bricks, but even I was noticing a pattern.

 

And now that you mentioned it, I noticed these other points, too:

 

6 hours ago, Prot said:

2. Match up dependent.

 

So in my view there are some match ups that just can give Hypercrypt a really hard time. For example, Marines with multi Infiltrators (very common) or something that blocks out a lot of stuff but can hit hard. 

 

 

Now that you said it, iirc not many Loyalist Marines near the end, the only MEQ was CSM with the typical Chosen/Forgefiends/etc.

 

I think you're very right, and on that note...

 

 

The Mirror Matches and Missions were telling

 

There WAS a Hypercrypt vs. Hypercrypt match in the final stages.  The eventual champion had more Characters and C'tan...which are also Characters.

It just happened to be one of those missions where you needed Characters to score the Objectives.  Immediately, that guy's list had the advantage.

 

It's just one of those things I've been noticing, most recently in the 4th Tyranid War Crusade campaign.  Lots of missions prohibited Vehicles from scoring Objectives, but Monsters could (maybe for Tyranid players).  C'tan were Monsters, not Vehicles.  The Redemptor Dreadnoughts were all .

 

Even then, it was a very, very close game!  I heard rumours they're not letting C'tan Hypercreep around the board anymore in the coming Dataslate.

 

With the C'tan being, not necessarily the best choice especially with a Balance Dataslate around the corner, but it's worth looking at what the guy used.

 

 

Nightbringer and Void Dragon

 

Nightbringer and Void Dragon should exactly, obviously, be the 1st and 2nd choices.  If I had to rank order the C'tan, it'd be like:

 

• Nightbringer
• Void Dragon
• Transcendant C'tan
• Transcendant C'tan
• Transcendant C'tan
• ...
• Deceiver at the bottom

(I saw a list that was a lot like this, and it made me lol, because it was like a more extreme version of my C'tan C'triple C'threat.)

 

BUT!  If normal C'tan can't Hypercreep Deep Strike Precision Teleport around anymore, Trans C'tan can still teleport themselves with their Assault move.

 

 

Chronomancer (over Technomancer)

 

So I've used a Chronomancer, not by accident but by circumstance (conversion base size reasons), instead of the more popular Technomancer.

 

My experience with the Chronomancer after a few games was, if a unit of Necron Warriors or Immortals were gonna die, they were gonna die anyway.  Instead of maxing the unit size with a Technomancer to "bankroll" their Reanimation Protocols, I felt just take another unit instead.  More movement was more useful.

 

So I found myself nodding in agreement over this:

 

6 hours ago, Prot said:

...I felt the opponents just really underestimated the movement of the army as a whole more than any one thing or unit contribution.

 

Seems like this is the go-to with Hypercrypt, found that interesting.  It's the Move-After-Shooting move they can do, play like Tau.

 

I used to play Nurgle, they were kings of Slow But FNPful, then when I looked at 10th I was like "C'tan are better Nurgle Daemon Princes than Nurgle Daemon Princes."  Back then it was just the Trans C'tan with the 4+ FNP Enhancement, now they all get FNP.  Slowness was like how they balanced against that survivability.

 

When you take away that slow speed and hand out more FNP survivability...I reckon it really does cause a disturbance in the balance of the Force.

 

The prominence of the Chronomancer is like supporting evidence of your point.  They buff movement mainly, like this is the Hypercrypt angle.

 

Gonna wait for the Balance Dataslate to drop.  I think they'll nerf C'tan's Hypercreep options, but the Trans C'tan gets something like it built-in.

Edited January 23 by N1SB

[Prot]

Some really good points... I forgot about the Hypercrypt mirror match. I didn't actually see that game on stream. But you're probably right on the C'tan nerf. It's probably around the corner.