Newer models less easily convertable?

[Bryan Blaire]

I still contend that you could get a lot more out of the models using an even more modular approach, and GW could sell the push-fit/ETB as their “intro to the hobby”, then “basic” modeling kits like we have now, and a more advanced kit that doesn’t necessarily require any additional tools, but has more modular parts (a more “Lego-fied” type, if you wish) where you get various components of the armor that would require the bend/flex bits and then the sets of more specific “hard bits”, and you can customize in a much more flexible fashion.  Yes, the more customizable kits would be more fiddly and probably more expensive, but I would very likely stupidly spend that much more to be able to have more choice over how my models go together/appear.

 

Other model companies do this, and GW is a model company first, aren’t they?

Edited February 27 by Bryan Blaire

[Xenith]

I think it's very much like their argument against selling air brushes. Why make expert level modular stuff when the hardcore converters will chop up models anyway? 

 

Accessibility to make good looking models quickly is the key driver.

[TrawlingCleaner]

Arguably; more fiddly, advance or expert kits are Forgeworld resin products and that's how they advertise them these days.

As others have pointed out there is a trade off of modularity of models and overall look.

 

Not all new kits are ETB or monopose either, it really depends on the units "classification" I think. If they're units you're likely to take loads of/Hordes like Ork Boyz, any of the Guants/Gants, Cultists or most character sculpts, they tend to be ETB/Monopose. Whereas most Marine units, Eldar, Votann, Tau, GSC, even Guardsmen are fluid movement bodies and legs with interchangeable everything else.

Personally, I much prefer nicer looking minis overall, that I'm still able to easily convert, over the ball socket waist. They were good decades ago but I'm not likely to want to go back any time soon

[Guest]

Here is how my Primaris go together now.

 

I have over 400 poses based on what I have. 

[sarabando]

modern minis are more like classic metal minis in how you can kitbash them. 

[Bryan Blaire]

4 hours ago, Xenith said:

I think it's very much like their argument against selling air brushes. Why make expert level modular stuff when the hardcore converters will chop up models anyway? 

 

Accessibility to make good looking models quickly is the key driver.

Oh, definitely - their “hobby trumpet” set up is definitely how I figured out that I had “aged out” of GW products… since their game quality has also gone down, it’s why my hobby is mostly not GW/40K based at all any more.  GW literally has decided that my money and time isn’t worth it to them - and that’s okay for me.  I’m definitely not a “hard-core converter”, but I’m also virtually uninterested in their current product offerings - so they just don’t make a product for me as a customer any more.

 

Unfortunately “good looking models” is entirely subjective - to me, that’s not really what GW proper is making much of for 40K any more.

 

To the OP’s original point - yes, the newer models are less kit-bashable than they used to be, entirely around the torso and legs though - virtually all of the arm, head, shoulder, and hanging bits are still the same as they used to be with very little work.

Edited February 27 by Bryan Blaire

[Xenith]

16 hours ago, Bryan Blaire said:

GW literally has decided that my money and time isn’t worth it to them

 

I wouldn't say that, maybe more that they know that you wont be swayed by marketing and will spend your hobby budget in your own way? They still produce things that vets can enjoy, ToW, necromunda, heresy etc., but, as a wise business decision, as you say they're maybe not throwing money away by marketing at people that know their own minds and have a set way of enjoying the modelling hobby. 

[Bryan Blaire]

1 hour ago, Xenith said:

I wouldn't say that, maybe more that they know that you wont be swayed by marketing and will spend your hobby budget in your own way? They still produce things that vets can enjoy, ToW, necromunda, heresy etc., but, as a wise business decision, as you say they're maybe not throwing money away by marketing at people that know their own minds and have a set way of enjoying the modelling hobby. 

If you don’t produce a product that your long-time purchasers want to buy, then yes, you have decided that you don’t want their money and time.  I don’t think any of us here need to try and make excuses for the company for that.

 

It’s not marketing, it’s product.  They could have the greatest marketing on the planet, it could be insidious and make the long-time purchaser think about it every day (I’d say they have done a good job of that, I have loads of plastic sitting on my shelves painted and unpainted), but if the product doesn’t fit the purchaser’s desires, then the marketing doesn’t matter.  I have no interest in having to do tons of conversions, and the body part switching isn’t as satisfying as it used to be given the more and more limited opportunities that GW is producing and limiting by their rules.  More modular “expert level” type models likely would get me to buy more on the basis of what I could do with it.

 

I have no interest in TOW, Heresy, etc.  I played 40K - now I don’t play it at all, and rarely model for it.  The game quality isn’t worth it and doesn’t reflect the aspects of gaming that I enjoyed previously, and the models aren’t worth it and are becoming more fixed “gaming pieces” as opposed to models.

 

If they are simply gaming pieces, then they can be lower quality and cheaper - another game I enjoy a lot more has these and I still get my painting kick from it, while acknowledging that they aren’t really customizable models.

 

I have bought an odd model here and there still, but like I said, it’s situations like the one the OP asked about that have made me realize I’ve effectively “aged out” of GW’s customer base.

Edited February 28 by Bryan Blaire

[Ryno]

I'm not sure if this is related or not, but since returning one thing I've noticed is the overall tone of the hobby itself. The shift had started while I was interested in it in high school, but it seems like it's really in place at this point.

When 40K started, from my understanding, it was intentionally over the top; ridiculous to the point of satire. It didn't take itself seriously. Part of the over the top-ness of it was individual customization and input. "Here's a stupid sandbox, have fun with it!" Now it all seems very straight faced. The ridiculousness is delivered sternly, it doesn't seem to have the wink and a nudge that it used to.

 

The apparent removal of easy modification, including in the current rules set's lack of longitude for characterful adaptation in addition to the physical models, seems like it could be a natural result of that. Like there has been an effort to limit real creativity to keep the IP from being altered too far. Maybe as GW has continued to grow and become increasingly 'premium,' they've had to start taking the business itself so much more seriously, and that drips into every other facet. Their IP is insanely valuable, and making it more difficult to do something more ridiculous comes across as a bit of a sterilization of the hobby in the interests of protecting that IP.

Might be pulling that out of the nether regions, but it's a thought that's occurred to me.

Edited February 28 by Ryno

[Grotsmasha]

I actually think the reduction is a result of the "vocal minority", in this case tournament players, and the need for WYSIWYG. More options means more rules, more play testing and more balancing. These all take time, which is expensive (in labour costs). I think GW has reduced options to save money , rather than anything IP related.

 

 

BUT, having typed all that, we're heading off topic and should get back to the modelling aspect of the topic.

[Brother Hellion]

I'll admit its be challenging to kit bash these new models. Some have too integrate bits to separate or replace. I find the best models to kit bash typically are base models found in the intercessor or assault intercessors, cut bits to match closely to the body type and then bluestuff and mold to better improve apperance.  I was able to make a more unique looking lieutant using assault intercessor base with some of the Lieutant bits. 

 

[Jukkiz]

i would say most of the base models are legs and torso. Then you add everything else. Some HQ/heroes are more comlex with tosro and arm, or torso and leg molded unto them that needs chopping.

[Muskie]

I converted two plague marines to have blight launchers today. They were not designed to have blight launchers. I do think some of the new models are bit harder to fit together as they only go together one way. The torso front has to go on the torso back, but that said I've converted metal models, forgeworld models, if you want to convert something you still can. We'll see have the models look once painted, right now they are just primered black.

 

Generally I convert most every model I assemble, but I do a few stock because I don't have the stock pose in my army yet. In the olden days there were a lot of one pose plastic models, so not even modular, those were the days of less interesting armies coming from Rogue Trader to early 2nd Edition for instance.