Super heavy chat

[Inquisitor_Lensoven]

Several of them have heavily overlapping roles, meanwhile we don’t have one that particularly stands out as extra tanky or durable.

Most of them have rather underwhelming profiles on their main weapons, and only about half of those are saved by their abilities.

Imo the vulcan mega bolter is the only one that can justify being less than 4 damage.

Does anyone else feel similarly?

 

I think the hellhammer should be a more tanky variant. I’d replace the current ability with something along the lines of worsen the AP and damage characteristics of weapons attacking this unit by 1.

Just bring the main gun up to S10 and I think it would be a great super heavy, but as is it’s EXTREMELY underwhelming imho.

Edited February 29 by Inquisitor_Lensoven

[Inquisitor_Lensoven]

Baneblade cannon is super swingy.

 

3 S12 AP-2 3D shots is pretty bad for a gun that big.

but 18 of those shots is decent.

 

so I propose 

2d6+2  S14 AP-2 4D

[terminator ultra]

petition for 40k guns to have a tiny spring in them and fire a tiny bullet. if you hit you hit. bigger guns, bigger bullet. melee is a gear function.

Edited March 1 by terminator ultra

[Galron]

I stick the Macarius varieties aside from the vanquisher, which is still crap. They are somewhat more decently priced and fairly tanky.

[TheArtilleryman]

I like the shadowsword. Main gun is immensely powerful. Although the number of attacks is low, S24, AP -5 and 12 damage is gonna do some serious melting even if you only hit once. As it has the heavy keyword you’re hitting on 3s if you remain stationary and you’ve got devastating wounds against vehicles and monsters.
 

Remember that whatever the variant you also get 5 twin heavy bolters (15 shots with sustained hits and re-roll wounds) and 4 lascannons as well. That’s not to be sniffed at.

Edited March 3 by TheArtilleryman

[Inquisitor_Lensoven]

22 minutes ago, TheArtilleryman said:

I like the shadowsword. Main gun is immensely powerful. Although the number of attacks is low, S24, AP -5 and 12 damage is gonna do some serious melting even if you only hit once. As it has the heavy keyword you’re hitting on 3s if you remain stationary and you’ve got devastating wounds against vehicles and monsters.
 

Remember that whatever the variant you also get 5 twin heavy bolters (15 shots with sustained hits and re-roll wounds) and 4 lascannons as well. That’s not to be sniffed at.

5 TL’d HBs isn’t much against the sort of targets the vehicles’ main guns are supposed to be targeting.

 

the shadowsword is one of the variants that has a main gun that is stand alone good.

theres about 2 of them that have guns that are just good and 2 that are good when you count the abilities 

[Inquisitor_Lensoven]

How do you guys feel about the sponsons going from two guns to a single twin linked gun?

 

I feel like they fill their niche better as two independent guns rather than as  twin linked mounts.

[TheArtilleryman]

Same as every vehicle with a twin-linked gun. Land raider, razorback, etc. I think they’ve always been twin-linked; it’s just that the rules changed back to re-rolls like they used to be. I much preferred it when twin-linked meant two guns strapped together, instead of one slightly better gun. Imagine having 30 heavy bolter shots instead of the 15 … that would be awesome.

Edited March 5 by TheArtilleryman

[sairence]

BB-HB sponsons are surprisingly nasty. 

 

15 shots, with Lethal + Sustained and S5 Twinlinked amounts to a serious amount of wounds on most targets. That they're only AP1 is a bit meh, but the volume tends to make up for it.

 

The Hellhammers ability is also actually pretty nice, I ran one a few months ago. Those models are so big that they will get tagged, so ignoring the penalty is decent. I'd just wish it'd get the second part from the Demolisher as well, so it's main and Demo gun can shoot into combat too. I also found the main gun suprisingly useful. Statline is okay, but the volume you get is pretty nuts, and ignore cover helps a lot.

 

Best variant I felt is the one that does AoE MW on selecting a target. The ability is nice and the gun itself has a super-solid profile.

 

Standard BB I found most underwhelming, it's just so incredibly middle of the road.

[Inquisitor_Lensoven]

6 hours ago, TheArtilleryman said:

Same as every vehicle with a twin-linked gun. Land raider, razorback, etc. I think they’ve always been twin-linked; it’s just that the rules changed back to re-rolls like they used to be. I much preferred it when twin-linked meant two guns strapped together, instead of one slightly better gun. Imagine having 30 heavy bolter shots instead of the 15 … that would be awesome.

That’s how it was last edition and it was great 

[Jolemai]

GW have never settled on a defining "twin-linked" rule.

• 2nd ed was one hit roll for both weapons. If it hit, rolled to wound/applied damage from both weapons to that single location.
• Then it became a re-roll to hit for many editions (HH has kept this)
• We got used to the double shots from the last couple of editions but it was considered OP when it first came out...
• Now it's re-roll to wound

They will probably change it again next edition. As someone who runs/ran Assbacks, I adored the double shots but we arguably shouldn't have had that in the first place. At this stage of the game, they should all probably have their own profile rather than simply a keyword for a re-roll to wound.

 

Two independent guns doesn't fit the fluff of the weapon at all as they aren't that - they are simply two weapons lashed together after all.

[Jolemai]

On 3/3/2024 at 7:33 PM, Inquisitor_Lensoven said:

5 TL’d HBs isn’t much against the sort of targets the vehicles’ main guns are supposed to be targeting.

 

 

The whole point of the sponson weapons is that they are support weapons. They aren't supposed to be targeting the same as the main gun and given split fire is a thing these days, this isn't a problem at all. (Tbh, it still isn't a problem in HH either given fire arcs and how the rules are for splitting fire with sponsons and defensive weapons).

[TheArtilleryman]

58 minutes ago, Jolemai said:

2nd ed was one hit roll for both weapons. If it hit, rolled to wound/applied damage from both

When you think about it, this is the most logical way to do it … well done GW for fixing what ain’t broke… several times 

 

I had two “Assbacks” - gutted that they are only in legends now. Although oddly, Grey Knights can still use them.

Edited March 5 by TheArtilleryman

[Inquisitor_Lensoven]

1 hour ago, Jolemai said:

 

The whole point of the sponson weapons is that they are support weapons. They aren't supposed to be targeting the same as the main gun and given split fire is a thing these days, this isn't a problem at all. (Tbh, it still isn't a problem in HH either given fire arcs and how the rules are for splitting fire with sponsons and defensive weapons).

There are several primary weapons options that would ideally have the same targets as the sponsons,  but I agree, which is why it’s silly to make them TL’d since that encourages people to target higher S units than they otherwise should be.

 

meanwhile, the sort of units they should be targeting they do worse against because of the fewer shots