Terminator Chaplain + DW Knights

[L30n1d4s]

Some may have already commented on this, but with the new Balance Dataslate, I think Deathwing Knights led by a Terminator Chaplain might be a real force to contend with.

 

Durability-wise, DW Knights already have 20W at T5 2+/4++ and -1 Dmg for any attacks against them. The Chaplain adds a 4+++ FNP against MWs, which now includes Devastating Wounds again, making them 50% more durable against one of the best ways to damage them. Add in Armour of Contempt and skillful use of Cover and they ought to be exceptionally difficult to shift.

 

Offensive-wise, now that DW Knights Swords are buffed to 5 attacks at WS2+ S6 AP-2 Dmg2, the Chaplain's +1 to Wound in melee means that they can reliably kill a T11, 14W, 3+ save Vehicle or Monster and can drop kick almost anything T6 and below.

 

I am looking at running them in my Vanguard Spearhead (with the Infiltrate enhancement on the Chaplain to start them midfield on a critical objective) in order to put pressure on my opponent and protect my key shooting units. Anyone else trying this combo out?

[Karhedron]

I haven't seen it used yet but I agree it looks very promising. With the nerf to how Captains work with stratagems, I think Chaplains are definitely worth a look. 

[FarFromSam]

It's something to consider.   For the points,  it may be a task for them to recoup their investment centering an entire list around them and shooting them forward.   They are limited to a five man after all.   But maybe as you say with skillful use they can cause your opponent to do some underestimating. 

 

I have to wonder if the unit is appealing not of its own merits, rather because captains, iron wing etc took an unnecessary, boring, nerf.  

 

Let us know how testing goes!

[Karhedron]

The trick is to get them somewhere where their durability is a problem for the opponent. If you can park them on an objective then your opponent will have to devote significantly more than their 300 points to removing them.  With T5  4W, a 2+ and -1D most anti-infantry weapons will take forever to chew through them, even overcharged plasma will take a while. Add the 4++ and even a Lascannon hit has less than a 25% chance to 1-shot a model. Add the Chaplain and that 4+++ covers MWs/DWs.

 

The trick then is force your opponent to make difficult choices. Do they devote the majority of their army for a turn trying to delete them?  If they do, use your more offensive units to punish them. If they don't, you can rack up the VPs. Best case scenario your opponent under-commits and the DWKs tank enough fire to help the rest if your army survive without dying themselves. 

[FarFromSam]

So a flanking objective?  Middle,  Or, 2 units of them and cause problems on both sides?

[Karhedron]

40 minutes ago, FarFromSam said:

So a flanking objective?  Middle,  Or, 2 units of them and cause problems on both sides?

 

Depends what else is in your list. If you put them on a flank Objective, there is a good chance not enough of your opponent's forces will be able to threaten them so they will probably be safe.  However if your opponent ignores them completely then is it worth 300 points to make one Objective untouchable? 

 

Putting them in the centre makes them harder to ignore but is also more dangerous. This play works better if you are aiming to force your opponent to decide if they want to commit the resources to killing them. This works well in a list with plenty of other tough targets such as vehicles. DWKs are hard to kill without resorting to dedicated anti-tank weapons. If your opponent is shooting Lascannons at the Knights then they are not aiming at your vehicles. 

[dice4thedicegod]

I’m thinking of running 3 units.  Just advance them towards all the midfield objectives T1 and force your opponent to deal with them.   Call it  “more elite custodes”.

[N1SB]

Brother Leonidas, you've always had these simple yet creative thematic combos.

 

I'm taking what everyone is saying to heart.  Now, there's this Boarding Actions thing, we DO know the Warhammer Community page mentioned it'll have Terminators, but NOT specifics like Deathwing Knights.  If it does, this will be my go-to choice.  We'll see, they got those mini-Detachments that specify what we can use, but very excited for this.

[bigtrouble]

I’m considering this too, with Honor Vehement on the Chaplain. Does anyone have game experience with this? Was it helpful?

[L30n1d4s]

I finally got to try DW Knights with a Terminator Chaplain (Blade Driven Deep enhancement) out in a few games this past weekend.

 

In both games they performed very well, absorbing the best melee punch my opponent had to throw at me and surviving, all while keeping his forces back from my objectives and gunline. The ability to Infiltrate the unit (and redeploy it, if necessary, thanks to my Phobos Captain) was very helpful, allowing me to put pressure on my opponent as early as turn 1 and also lean into holding "no man's land."

 

The unit also hit very hard in combat, with the +1 to wound in combat from the TDA Chaplain allowing them to wipe out a Possessed squad and almost wipe out an entire Assault Intercessor squad in a single turn each (I was using swords for the extra attacks).

 

Overall, I am quite pleased with the unit's performance and will be keeping it in my competitive 2000 point Vanguard Spearhead list going forward.

Edited October 14 by L30n1d4s

[dice4thedicegod]

I’m considering a riff on this:

 

3x deathwing knights + Terminator Chaplain 

 

3x redemptor dreadnought 

 

really lean into the 2+, -1 damage reduction.

 

Stormlance detachment for the mobility.

[dice4thedicegod]

Well, took it to an rtt.

 

lost to death guard, beat death guard , beat daemons.

 

1- it’s really tanky

2- I can’t roll a 3+++ on the lion to save my life.  Or his life rather.  Rotigus just charged over and took him from full to zero, even after a cp reroll (though a redemptor then boxcarred saves against a bloodthirster… so I guess it evens out)

3- I really didn’t have much army… it all fit in my dice tray 

[L30n1d4s]

Well, had another game and once again this unit was an All Star (even with the increased point cost).

 

Admittedly, I got quite lucky with the rolling (both mine and my opponents), but the Chaplain + DW Terminators got charged by the Nightbringer and didn't lose a single model to his attacks. 

 

On the clap back, they only did around 4 wounds to him, but i was able to Fall Back, unload almost all of my shooting on the Nightbringer, then finish him off with Tank Shock and melee from a Redemptor, so the DW Knights more than did their job. They then Heroically Intervened and handily took out a unit of Wraiths (with Technomancer giving them a 5+++ FNP) on the next turn.

 

Overall, DW Knights continue to exceed my expectations game after game, they have definitely become a staple of my army list!

 

 

Edited November 17 by L30n1d4s