Mauls v Swords: Thoughts on goonhammer article June 19th.

[Xenith]

This Goonhammer article on Charnabal weapons is a couple of months old now, hoever some good food for thought

 

https://www.goonhammer.com/horus-heresy-hot-take-charnabal-weapons-are-better-than-you-think/

 

 

Looking at the summary:

 

"Power Swords aren’t really meant for heavy armor, but they give you great versatility in allowing you to wipe the floor with regular power armored goons while still having the ability to hurt 2+ saves." 

 

Got me thinking.

 

In that instance, is the maul not superior, bring able to waste 3+ saves. To deal with 2+ saves, both are fishing for a 1/6 chance, the sword to wound and the maul to get a failed save...only the sword then has to deal with an invuln.  A maul attack has a 7% chance of causing a wound to a WS5 2+ save, and the same against hit on 4+, 2+/4++ save. The sword has 8% chance of a rend and 6% chance of a wound vs 2+ for 14% chance of a wound overall. Against 2+/4++ that drops to 9%, which is still ~30% better than the maul, however that equates to 2 additional wounds in 100 attacks. Against 3+ saves, the maul has a 42% chance of wounding, while the sword has 25%. Overall I'd say the maul roughly as good as the sword vs 2+/4++, but miles ahead vs 3+ saves, but the sword will be better against 2+ no invuln things, which are...exclusively command squads.  So if you want to win against command squads, axes, failing that swords, if you're fighting anything else, axes or mauls all the way.

 

The sword, despite gaining rend 6+, isn't really better than the other choices, other than maybe squeezing a wound past arty armour - however I'd argue that a spear has the same chance except you do it one initiative higher.

 

It seems like spears and mauls are the way to go this edition, and swords, and to some extent, axes, are left in the dust. Axes used to be great, but since veterans went to 2W, they're less valuable, and if you're willing to strike last, you might as well spend the extra 10pts on the fist. 

 

Thought on usability of pweps, or on the content of this article in general?

Edited August 12 by Xenith

[Harrowmaster]

Honestly, since the changes to the maul's ap in 2.0 I've been considering it a lot more than I used to. Being able to hit at Str 6 and break power armour at initiative is a much better deal than hitting at Str 4 and maybe getting through artificer armour at initiative. If I want to counter 2+ saves the axe is just more reliable than the sword. 

[Razorblade]

The Article sort of lost me when they said they weren't going to consider charnabals in a Duel Setting (the Situation they are intended for and dominate) and then proceeded to compare two weapons in a niche scenario neither weapon is good for. 

To recap: Sabres for killing Sergeants, Lances and Mauls for mass power Armour, Fists and bigger for stuff with 2 Wounds. This leaves Axes, Swords and all charnabals but the Sabre on the sidelines 

[arnesh88]

At this point, the only reason I include swords in my squads is because they're easy to find in plastic. That's it.

I mostly take axes in squads like despoilers, assault marines, or models with WS 5 because the Line units usually have enough numbers to deal with 3+ armor with weight of attacks that some AP2 can help when caught in combat with 2+ units and keeping them cheap. The WS 5 units are hard enough to hit that they're more likely to survive not being hit to swing back (even then, I don't spam, just peppering).

 

Charnable only on models that can challenge for Duellists Edge.

Maces and Lances specifically for a squad that's hunting power armor, and they're good enough that when going for a certain theme/role for a unit that they can still perform well. For example, I plan on having 2 power lances in my Sanctifier Squad because they're primarily equipped to fight power armor and can take on a dreadnought/vehicles with the melta bombs + WS 5, and gives them a "hunting party" vibe that is unique in my army and the only way I can think of having them stand out from Adherents/Pyroclasts/Firedrakes.

[Harrowmaster]

 

At this point, the only reason I include swords in my squads is because they're easy to find in plastic. That's it.

The only reason I have them is because I built the minis in 1st edition and don't want to take them apart.