Sanguinor and Sanguinary Guard

[Marshal Reinhard]

 

 You can tell me you don't agree but if you declare, with certainty, that my opinion is wrong then that is something else.

I would tend to agree, but the post you quoted said "I think they look absolutely okay.", which I don't think qualifies as what you described.

 

But I'll silence myself on this any further.

 

Back to the topic: I wonder how the new Sanguinary guard would feel as a basis for Blood Angel JP intercessors. Paint em red, give em ordinary helmets, chainswords etc.

[Karhedron]

OK, mostly the Sanguinor is a solid (if uninspiring) update of the original. But what the heck happened to his face? His mask is supposed to be a mirror of Sanguinius's since he was his Herald in Imperium Secundus. The original Sanguinor believably captured that. The new face looks like he is gurning. In fact he looks like Kryten failing to swear.

 

[INKS]

 

I would tend to agree, but the post you quoted said "I think they look absolutely okay.", which I don't think qualifies as what you described.

 

But I'll silence myself on this any further.

 

Back to the topic: I wonder how the new Sanguinary guard would feel as a basis for Blood Angel JP intercessors. Paint em red, give em ordinary helmets, chainswords etc.

I think they would look great as BA JP Intercessors, or even the Death Company ones.

 

OK, mostly the Sanguinor is a solid (if uninspiring) update of the original. But what the heck happened to his face? His mask is supposed to be a mirror of Sanguinius's since he was his Herald in Imperium Secundus. The original Sanguinor believably captured that. The new face looks like he is gurning. In fact he looks like Kryten failing to swear.

 

Could you imagine if they released a Sanguinius and that was his face? lol

[Karhedron]

 

I think they would look great as BA JP Intercessors, or even the Death Company ones.

 

A bit ornate for JAIs but they might make a good basis for VanVets since we still don't have a proper primaris kit for them.

[Blindhamster]

 

 

A bit ornate for JAIs but they might make a good basis for VanVets since we still don't have a proper primaris kit for them.

 

I feel like the bodies are too ornate for anything not in artificer armour tbh
 

[Inquisitor_Lensoven]

 

I like both kits,  never attached the wings to my SG.

You still got yours?

[INKS]

 

 

A bit ornate for JAIs but they might make a good basis for VanVets since we still don't have a proper primaris kit for them.

kind of like the idea for maybe the Sgts or something but yeah that is a good point on them being too ornate.

[TheHaplessHeretic]

I dislike them

[Nephaston]

 

OK, mostly the Sanguinor is a solid (if uninspiring) update of the original. But what the heck happened to his face? His mask is supposed to be a mirror of Sanguinius's since he was his Herald in Imperium Secundus. The original Sanguinor believably captured that. The new face looks like he is gurning. In fact he looks like Kryten failing to swear.

 

Inb4 it looks alright when not painted by someone who gets high on edge highlights and NNM.

 

Then again 30k Sanguinius does look suspisciously like Bill Nye the science guy.

[roryokane]

3 instead of 5? straight downgrade
No axes? sad. They looked cool. 
Lack of wings - sad, and very much a downgrade in how characterful the models are.
Facemasks are REALLY Stormcast-looking. It's one of the few times that a helmetless model looks, without question, better than their helmeted equivalents.
Also they feel a lot less ornate, even when you disregard the wings. The greaves especially!
I do mostly like the poses - especially the one who's about to thrust his spear overarm. Shame they've not made a forearm-mounted inferno pistol.

Sanguinor's hair looks less Sanguinius and more Conan the Barbarian, and I find the T-pose a bit dull. The rest of the model is fine.

[DemonGSides]

 

This is one of the biggest downsides of modern Marine (40k in general, but Marines especially) releases - the lack of significant poseability and customisation has lead to major reduction in variety. This is obvious in Bladeguard and Obliterators, basically every three-strong unit that has come out has a distinct issue when you see more than one unit on the table because each is just a copy-paste of the last one.

 

While sculpt quality is absolutely incredible, the detail is fantastic (as in the technical detail, not necessarily the aesthetic), but the lack of posing options means we're just getting cardboard cutouts. This isn't quite as much of an issue for characters, but when it comes to units it's one of the biggest issues IMO. Variety is the spice of life and all that, and especially for Warhammer in general, the "Your Dudes" part is a significant one where the reduced variety becomes more pronounced.

 

On the SG and Sanguinor, I agree with a lot of what's been said already. Sanguinor is mostly fine, I'm not a fan of the Primaris Jump Pack, he feels like he should be very bespoke, but it is what it is; SG are mediocre - the scale and detail are good, though the aesthetic is not great and doesn't follow the original SG aesthetic particularly well; much like the DA Inner Circle Companions, they feel like a more generic version of the thing they're based on (though the ICC are sort of their own thing, that's more just me trying to give a comparison to something else that felt similar).

 

Eh, disagree even though you're agreeing with me.  My bladeguard don't look the same even though it's only the same pose doubled; I only ever got the initial ones from Indomitus, and traded my necrons for my buddy's copies of the SM.  But if you throw enough bits at them, then "The way we stand" isn't as important.

The issue with these is that they are not only stuck with their pretty meh poses (GW has done plenty of good "in motion" poses for flying/jumping units, just not these guys), combined with a kit that has sucked ALL of the flavor out to be able to to distinguish them even slightly.

 

I don't need a bajillion greeblies to make me happy, but SOME sort of soul is nice.  As mentioned, these could be Blood Angels Vanguard Veterans, and i'd honestly probably be pretty thrilled with the idea of them; helmets are easy to throw into Sprue Goo and put REAL Marine Helmets on. For use as SG, bare minimum is scavenge some old SG or the even more harrowed Stormcast faces (Seriously, once again, anyone comparing these heads to Stormcast is just doing it in bad faith.  EVERY Stormcast helmet looks better than ANY of the options given for the Death Masks, which are all simultaneously suffering from macrocephaly).

But to have our bespoke Bodyguard unit be just a big meh is SUCH a let down, especially when it's the only new troop kit that we're getting.  Even fi you didn't like ICC as a concept, the models themselves are at least cool.  We don't even get that!

Edited August 12 by DemonGSides

[Kastor Krieg]

 

DC moving to an upgrade kit I could stomach, if any kit could be said to be cluttered, it was that one. And the Lore for them has them repainting their armor, not getting bespoke detailing, but it was still an amazing source for BA bits thats now lost. 

 

But those SG? Pathetic.

I was gonna say they look like Stormcast, but no, the new stormcast models look a fair bit better. No wings, no two-handed weapons, chunky detail or plain armor where they should be ornate, straight up stormcast helmets rather than the old Deathmasks, bleh.

 

The character models have ranged from fine to good, but the infantry kits and dreadnought are massive disappointments compared to the old stuff. Sanguinor looks like the worst update imo, it isn't bad (minus the thanos chin) but if any model could've used a modern redesign to be fancier that was it. An AoS style overwrought flying base would've been perfect here, rather than the same akward Tpose over scrolls

They look like first generation Stormcast, the old bland chonkers.

And Sanguinor is just an absolutely lazy, dialed-in redo.

 

The scrolls themselves... just look at the physicality of "levitating angel drags parchment scrolls" on the original.

 

Thin, folding, damaged...

 

And with the downgrade we get "lol, just make them straight beams of thick plastic, then wing something when painting it, lmao".

 

i wonder how cool they would look with this chap's jump pack... I bet they'd look amazing. Always thought he had the best wings. Now how to source 3 of this mfer affordably.... Edit: Or if you're feeling cheap, I suppose just do the Sarge for them, lol. 

So they could and did give a proper winged jump pack to THIS GUY, but couldn't be arsed to do the same for the unit that is literally iconic for exactly this design of a jump pack?

Right.

[Kallas]

 

Eh, disagree even though you're agreeing with me.  My bladeguard don't look the same even though it's only the same pose doubled; I only ever got the initial ones from Indomitus, and traded my necrons for my buddy's copies of the SM.  But if you throw enough bits at them, then "The way we stand" isn't as important.

Sure, you can get a lot of value out of just slapping different bits on them, but a reduction in options is still a reduction in options.

 

 

The issue with these is that they are not only stuck with their pretty meh poses (GW has done plenty of good "in motion" poses for flying/jumping units, just not these guys), combined with a kit that has sucked ALL of the flavor out to be able to to distinguish them even slightly.

Yeah, I agree - I do also think it's a compounding issue, where the reduction in options is more greatly felt when the flavour is sucked out.

 

 

I don't need a bajillion greeblies to make me happy, but SOME sort of soul is nice.

 

But to have our bespoke Bodyguard unit be just a big meh is SUCH a let down, especially when it's the only new troop kit that we're getting.  Even fi you didn't like ICC as a concept, the models themselves are at least cool.  We don't even get that!

Yup, no disagreement from me. I know my dislike of the the ICC isn't particularly widespread, but it's basically a mirror of your dislike of the SG here - I don't like the ICC (or the SG) because they're not particulary well representative of their faction; they have the hallmarks (big cloaks, some iconography for ICC; some fancy filigree/body sculpt and some blood drop iconography for SG) but they don't have that soul like you said.

 

I feel like the technical skill of GW is massively improved over the sculpts we got 10 years ago, but the details feel so lifeless. Compared to something like the new Skaven models, which are just absolutely brimming with Skaven-ness, a lot recent 40k (and especially Marine) releases aren't.

[Xirix]

 

Huh

To quote the article:

Tracing their heritage back to the Great Crusade, the Sanguinary Guard are the Chapter’s most elite warriors. Their dwindling supply of relic armour, Angelus boltguns, and unmistakable death masks have been retrofitted to work with new Tacticus Mark X armour. 

 

So it seems the lack of certain iconic parts of the kit are actually intentional in lore.

Probably because after the Devastation of Baal the BA were reduced to a single Sangy Guard and basically all the other wargear was lost.

To be fair this is Warcom, someone high up might have just told them to write that in preparation for people not liking the sculpt after the fact.

[Marshal Mittens]

So, I don't hate them, but for what ever reason, they don't grab me like the older models did. I don't know what they are lacking, but I just feel, well, uninspired I guess. 

[Remain_Indoors]

 

Apologies, I don't think I seen it. Why is losing the wings a good thing? Or why do you think it's a good thing? The wings were rather Iconic. 

As someone else who thinks the wings going is a good thing, for me it’s because they were an absolute pain in the backside to keep attached to the model. I had a Bling Wing force - Dante, Six squads of Sanguinary Guard and the Sanguinor - back in 7th and it was next to impossible to transport them to a game and play without at least one wing becoming detached. 

Edited August 12 by Remain_Indoors

[INKS]

 

As someone else who thinks the wings going is a good thing, for me it’s because they were an absolute pain in the backside to keep attached to the model. I had a Bling Wing force - Dante, Six squads of Sanguinary Guard and the Sanguinor - back in 7th and it was next to impossible to transport them to a game and play without at least one wing becoming detached. 

understandable. I did not have this issue with magnets but I can see how annoying this would certainly be.

[Mostwanted]

I've really liked the previous reveals for the Blood Angels and been happy with it all, even the upgrade sprue that some people didn't like. But this reveal has been a little disappointing.

 

The Sanguinors body, I feel is really good and the sword looks a lot better than the old one. But his helmet looks nothing like how I feel he should be depicted. The old one looks so much better.

 

Also I really dislike the scroll work on the new one. The original does a brilliant job of making the model look like he is floating, with the parchment flowing below him. It looks too thick now and is too static and even. It also looks weird bowed outward like that. To me, it has lost the floating illusion the original pulled off so well.

 

I also dislike the wings. I always felt that they should look organic and feathered. These look to industrial and lacking in finer detail.

 

This could and possibly should have been our centerpiece model but it feels like GW played it too safe.

 

Now the Sanguinary Guard.

I wasn't bothered with them losing their wings as I thought they looked a bit weird and over the top when the old kit first came out. But these new ones have lost so much detail from the old kit. Why is there no difference in the chest design any more?

 

I felt the old Death Masks detailing was a little on the large size previously, like they wouldn't be able to move their heads around very much. So, I like the more understated design of the new ones, but I think they needed some modeled hair as part of the mask, like the previous ones had. With the masks being bold, it does make them look very Stormcast.

I do love the bare heads though, I think they look brilliant.

 

The bolters on the gauntlets look good but why not have the inferno pistol mounted the same way instead of held like a regular pistol?

 

I'm also so disappointed in the banner. The old one was brilliantly detailed. I get that it would be unwieldy to carry a full on banner when you've gout a jump pack, but going from that chapter banner to this boring small design is a massive drop off.

 

The leg detailing looks a little boring compared to the old ones and the models stances just seem a bit awkward to me as well.

 

These aren't terrible, just not as nice as I was hoping and I know GW can produce a lot better.

[Blindhamster]

I went and looked at the old unit after thinking on it.

 

poses on the old ones kinda sucked tbh, though the legs were excellent to convert

 

the old sanguinary guard heads are also bald from the front, the hair is only on the back part, which always seemed sort of weird to me.

 

even the thigh muscle design on the old ones was hit and miss (it’s literally not there in some, depending on the pose, which is illogical.

 

i think the only things on the new ones I really dislike after spending time comparing the two, is the chests, they’re just too bulky and I’d have liked some alternative designs, and no cables. 
 

I think I’ll look at making a mold of Dante’s front chest piece to use for mine 

[Deus_Ex_Machina]

 

I think they would look great as BA JP Intercessors, or even the Death Company ones.

Could you imagine if they released a Sanguinius and that was his face? lol

That´s the way Sanguinius looks when he thinks of Horus.

[SkimaskMohawk]

Another issue with some of the marine 40k things is that it feels like the designers are having a hard time elevating the designs they're revamping.

 

You look at nids and they're a hit. You look at stormcast and they're a hit (somehow even stealing the...thunder...of grim darked veterans now). You look at the new skaven line and it's basically perfect. 

 

But the marines keep on spinning their wheels.

[MoriyaSchism]

 

Another issue with some of the marine 40k things is that it feels like the designers are having a hard time elevating the designs they're revamping.

 

You look at nids and they're a hit. You look at stormcast and they're a hit (somehow even stealing the...thunder...of grim darked veterans now). You look at the new skaven line and it's basically perfect. 

 

But the marines keep on spinning their wheels.

It's not like they have a shortage of inspiration. If they took any of the datasheets from the old Imperial Armour books like Badab War you'd probably get some great Marine kits out of that. Even basic stuff like recreating the old character upgrade set that came with loads of bionics. Also what is stopping them from making a leg armour upgrade for the basic intercessor kits? It's all in CAD and files on a computer these days and they proved that they can make upgrade pieces for specific monopose bodies with the Terminator Sergeant bits in the last two chapter upgrade kits they released.

[Nephaston]

 

It's all in CAD and files on a computer these days and they proved that they can make upgrade pieces for specific monopose bodies with the Terminator Sergeant bits in the last two chapter upgrade kits they released.

The terminator chest bit is a universal fit, and will fit on any of the 5 bodies. As will shins and tassets, in addition to the shoulder pads and arms being not specific to any one body.

[Scribe]

 

Another issue with some of the marine 40k things is that it feels like the designers are having a hard time elevating the designs they're revamping.

 

You look at nids and they're a hit. You look at stormcast and they're a hit (somehow even stealing the...thunder...of grim darked veterans now). You look at the new skaven line and it's basically perfect. 

 

But the marines keep on spinning their wheels.

 

Too much CAD design combined with the simplicity of the bog standard marine frame/outline.

[MoriyaSchism]

 

The terminator chest bit is a universal fit, and will fit on any of the 5 bodies. As will shins and tassets, in addition to the shoulder pads and arms being not specific to any one body.

That's not really an excuse. I have a third party Grenadier conversion kit for the plastic Krieg kill team that works in the same way the Primaris Intercessor shin armour works. If some guy in Estonia can do it on his home computer then GW can do it too.