Sanguinor and Sanguinary Guard

[Wispy]

 

 

Jes has articulated that notion a few times. Words to the effect of feeling like the captain models were starting to look like Christmas trees. It's why they introduced the Lieutenants with practically zero flair, just the (painted) multi-stripe on the helmet of a model that otherwise looked like a typical Sergeant.

 

I think it was during the Shadowspear episode of Voxcast that he mentioned they approached the initial Primaris wave as being the plain rank and file who were not yet weathered veterans with honors and trophies, but that those would be coming eventually (here he was no doubt alluding to the contents of Indomitus and later releases).

You can see it with the other model lines. Like, the Templar have a great progression from line troop Crusaders to Veterans to Heroes.

 

The thing is the DA's Inner Circle companions and Sword Brethren are very elaborately caped and robed. The new Sanguinary Guard are very plain in comparison.

 

Maybe the wings were a big consternation point for GW internally. They are a very silly part of the lore, pure decoration. Still, Sanguinor and Astorath still have them. Maybe they thought the Veterans with wings were really taking away from Captains and Dante who didn't have them. I think they should have just lived with all that though, the wings were too iconic to the unit.

Edited August 16 by Wispy

[Kallas]

 

sometimes what is considered a flaw is highly subjective. Personally I don’t consider the Black Rage or the Red Thirst to be flaws. They both add character.

They are pretty definitively flaws. The Red Thirst and Black Rage are both losses (or reductions) of control, this is not maybe a flaw, it's absolutely a flaw.

 

Does it add character to the Chapter? Oh hell yeah, of course it does. But it's definitely a flaw, and that's perfectly fine. Negatives add to the whole when it comes to characterisation - squeaky clean perfect characters are widely derided in pretty much any media unless done very well, so flaws adding character is definitely welcome. But the Red Thirst and Black Rage are flaws.

[StrangerOrders]

 

They are pretty definitively flaws. The Red Thirst and Black Rage are both losses (or reductions) of control, this is not maybe a flaw, it's absolutely a flaw.

 

Does it add character to the Chapter? Oh hell yeah, of course it does. But it's definitely a flaw, and that's perfectly fine. Negatives add to the whole when it comes to characterisation - squeaky clean perfect characters are widely derided in pretty much any media unless done very well, so flaws adding character is definitely welcome. But the Red Thirst and Black Rage are flaws.

I mean, we know at least one of those was almost certainly an engineered trait.

 

I guess the question becomes whether a missile blowing up is a flaw from the missiles perspective? From the perspective of the designer and the user it is certainly a plus even if both would rather the missile not do so around them.

 

Props to the Heresy for making the BAngels like the only thing in the setting to improve with time though, those guys were walking atrocities pre-Sang.

[The Unseen]

 

Maybe the wings were a big consternation point for GW internally. They are a very silly part of the lore, pure decoration. 

Not true; there's been some lore that there are limited anti-grav emitters in the wings, along with control surfaces. So they do have a function lorewise. Clearly a justification for aesthetic, but still.

[Wispy]

 

Not true; there's been some lore that there are limited anti-grav emitters in the wings, along with control surfaces. So they do have a function lorewise. Clearly a justification for aesthetic, but still.

That just invites more questions, like someone decided to make anti-grav emitters angel winged shaped.

 

(also, y'know, these were the same single-engine jump packs and didn't need wings: MKIV Destroyer Squad with Jump Packs)

Edited August 16 by Wispy

[lansalt]

IIRC Sanguinary Guard's "jump packs" were capable of actual flight to be able to follow Sanguinius. The wings were not just decorative.

I think this is shown in Echoes of Eternity during the battle against Ka'bandha.

[Wispy]

Okay but the prospect of someone engineering a flight device but making them look like angel wings is even weirder! They're trying too hard to explain it and just drawing more attention to how silly it is!

Edited August 16 by Wispy

[lansalt]

Well, that's the Imperium for you. They're supposed to have a very different mindset than us in M3, focused on symbolism over just functionality.

Edited August 16 by lansalt

[The Unseen]

 

That just invites more questions, like someone decided to make anti-grav emitters angel winged shaped.

 

(also, y'know, these were the same single-engine jump packs and didn't need wings: MKIV Destroyer Squad with Jump Packs)

They don't require the anti-grav stuff to work, but presumably they had them put in to let them more easily keep up with Sanguinius, since he can, you know, actually fly. Regular jump packs are more limited, doing more powered leaps, or controlled descents, not true flight. And nobody decided to make the anti-grav emitters shaped like wings, except the Blood Angels themselves. If you can miniaturize anti-gravity generators, I think making the outer casing look like wings is small potatoes.

[Halandaar]

 

A classic box of Sanguinary Guard equips 1.66 boxes of the new guys. 

 

Sure, but as already mentioned they're now OOP and actually finding them at a reasonable price is going to become increasingly difficult. GW and all the major FLGS in the UK are already sold out. This isn't a "solution" for anybody who doesn't already have a box in their pile of shame.

[Blindhamster]

have to say though, the classic winged jump pack does look nice on them

[SkimaskMohawk]

Having finally caught up (again).

 

I definitely remember the 5th edition BA release being a bit divisive. Nipple armour was purely mocked, the wings were sometimes called a bit tacky and chunky, the weird two handed sword was avoided, and there was a pretty even split between the full assembly of BA tac box vs mix it into generic tax box (same with the wolves grey hunters down the line). But people really liked the range update for providing so many options, the concept of how much detail they could pack in, and of course, the paintjobs carried all the new releases super hard. Kinda crazy to look back at 5ths range refreshes and see all the innovation, and now it's like, one character and special unit visual update for marines. 

 

But ya, many opinions on the OG release. The thing is, those kits now have....over a decade of presence. People expect their BAs to have a lot of options to decorate them how they wanted. Sang guard are expected to have mega wings, and seeing the photoshopped pics definitely makes something click together for me. It always feels terrible to have options taken away, and feels even worse to pay more for less. Someone said a few pages back something to the effect that we're not entitled to having extra stuff in our kits and it's like...that's kinda a stupid take, isn't it? We're paying for these things. Some of us have been paying for these kits for multiple decades. GW created the expectation wayyyyy back in the day of having extra bits in kits to add meaningful variety, and that was part of the draw; you got a full unit of models, you could customize them with a bunch of different war gear and aesthetic touches, paint them however you wanted, and then play games with them. They were models AND gaming pieces. Now it's what? Minimum squad size, monopose, barely any visual customization, choice of A or B weapon, much more expensive.

[Toxichobbit]

 

Okay but the prospect of someone engineering a flight device but making them look like angel wings is even weirder! They're trying too hard to explain it and just drawing more attention to how silly it is!

 

Probably an Aeldari - look at Swooping Hawks.

[Wispy]

 

 

Sure, but as already mentioned they're now OOP and actually finding them at a reasonable price is going to become increasingly difficult. GW and all the major FLGS in the UK are already sold out. This isn't a "solution" for anybody who doesn't already have a box in their pile of shame.

Sure, start stocking up now. 

[Evil Eye]

 

 

Sure, but as already mentioned they're now OOP and actually finding them at a reasonable price is going to become increasingly difficult. GW and all the major FLGS in the UK are already sold out. This isn't a "solution" for anybody who doesn't already have a box in their pile of shame.

 

There is a solution...

[Wispy]

Yes, there are already unofficial after market wings NOW. I think Greytides Crimson Lord backpack is looking pretty useable. But if you prefer official bits, stock up on a classic Sanguinary Guard kit before it becomes a rarity.

 

I'm just trying to be constructive. You have options! Getting your minis to look how you personally want them to look does require a bit more effort. 

Edited August 16 by Wispy

[Inquisitor_Lensoven]

 

Yes, there are already unofficial after market wings NOW. I think Greytides Crimson Lord backpack is looking pretty useable. But if you prefer official bits, stock up on a classic Sanguinary Guard kit before it becomes a rarity.

 

I'm just trying to be constructive. You have options! Getting your minis to look how you personally want them to look does require a bit more effort. 

Did you miss the part where they said that stores all over the UK are already out of stock?

it’s already difficult to get those kits for many.

[Wispy]

 

Did you miss the part where they said that stores all over the UK are already out of stock?

it’s already difficult to get those kits for many.

it's challenging, sure, but I have bought out-of-print kits and models on Ebay and trading sites before. Trading forums are handy too. You can cannibalize wings from your old Sanguinary Guard miniatures too! if it's still too difficult, well it must not be that important to you... 

 

Sorry, i am not trying to shame people who are upset, your frustrations is valid. but, you know, directing your frustrations at me trying to be constructive is frustrating for me. GW isn't going to take the Sanguinary Guard back to the drawing board. That's the reality and these are our options.

 

and getting some after market jump packs is not a difficult or unaffordable option at all - many of us already own and purchase after-market bitz and like I said they are getting made right now. I like Greytide's work and have purchased some choice bitz from their Primal Hounds campaign in the past.

 

 

 

[Gorgoff]

About time.

They learnin'

[AlanofAngels]

 

About time.

They learnin'

if you think that's real then hello it's me, a Nigerian prince 

[Gorgoff]

 

if you think that's real then hello it's me, a Nigerian prince 

I am still waiting for the chest of gold you promised!

[The Unseen]

Yeah, that's an obvious fake bait post. Well done though.

[Alternis]

 

About time.

They learnin'

Oh dear. 
Who knew a troll meme could become so popular.

Even more so that the populace have such belief that it could be real. 
 

Pretty sure this is a Fabrication by the Drukhari to torment the BA fanbase.

[Wispy]

Greytide revealed their winged Jumpack set, for those of us who are partial to their designs. 

Edited August 17 by Wispy

[Karhedron]

OK, I have given a lot of time and thought before posting this as I have been trying to work out my feelings on the new models. I am not massively impressed as the Sanguinor looks too close to the original but with a worse face. I don't mind the SanGuard losing their wings as they always felt a bit OTT to me but the lack of detail and elegance compared to the original has disappointed me. I guess that disappointment sums up my feeling for the whole release really. I don't hate any of it but I am not excited by much of it either. The new Captain and Priest are cool but that is tempered by the knowledge that we are losing the Jump Priest.

 

When the new Mephiston and Dante models came out, I was really excited to get the new models and replace my old ones but this new release has not interested me in the same way. I don't feel that any of the new models are cool enough or improved enough to replace my originals. I think I will keep running my OG Sanguinor and I can probably do something with my existing SG by proxying their fists as the new Spears. I have been looking forward to the BA Primaris release for a long time and this is just underwhelming. I don't hate it but I don't feel interested in buying much of it.