Sanguinor and Sanguinary Guard

[Ayatollah_of_Rock_n_Rolla]

 

Everyone excited for space wolves needs to temper their expectations. Everything has been a downgrade since the Templars. 

 

I can't agree. New Terminators are very good.

[Ayatollah_of_Rock_n_Rolla]

 

I guess it’s a matter of personal taste. What many view as steps back, I see as a step in the right direction. 
I know this will probably rub many the wrong way, but I truly and deeply disliked the old SG kit and the old Death company kit.  To me they were particularly bad examples of GW’s tendency at the time to overcrowd minis with way too many details. 

 

While I totally get the dislike for overcrowding, I think that in the case of veteran units there need to be some balance struck, and now GW went too far into the plainess zone. The miniatures got bigger, the casting more refined, so it should be possible to introduce some marked individualism without the model looking like a Christmas tree.

[apostle85]

 

 

While I totally get the dislike for overcrowding, I think that in the case of veteran units there need to be some balance struck, and now GW went too far into the plainess zone. The miniatures got bigger, the casting more refined, so it should be possible to introduce some marked individualism without the model looking like a Christmas tree.

That’s fair, I admit I may have been being a bit to strong in favour of going the other way with things.

[Nephaston]

 

We can't do anything about that, GW certainly aren't

Warhammer 40.000: Pre-Rift (name pending) coming to a warhammer store near you!

 

 

[Indy Techwisp]

 

 

When did THAT happen?

 

Pretty sure the lore was baked in to the upscaling from day one.

 

From my research into it because when I joined the hobby I didn't have a clue what any of the screaming matches were about, at the time the upscaling was planned there was a growing dissatisfaction with GW's lore approach of just saying "it's always been like this/it's always been there" whenever a model was updated or a new thing added.

So with the Primaris marines, the decision was made to make them a wholly new kind of Space Marine as to GW that is what the community wanted.

They believed the community were saying they were tired of models getting scale crept upwards and of things just getting retconned into the timeline, so GW took that opportunity to redesign the Space Marine while upscaling them to both complete their aim of bigger Marines and fulfil the supposed community wish for an explanation for why their marines were suddenly larger than the Marines they'd been collecting up to that point.

[Indy Techwisp]

Anyway, moving away from that.

I really, really hope that the new BA Combat Patrol comes with the current BA Upgrade kit like how the DA Combat Patrol still has theirs.

[Gorgoff]

For good or bad they look like Stormcast Eternals.

We went full circle apparently. 

They introduces Stormcast in AOS as the new posterboy faction because Space Marines sold so well in 40k and now they introduce Stormcast Eternals in 40k because AOS sells so well.

 

I hate those.

The masks look good though but that's about it.

Lame poses, bad look, no wings. Horrible.

[ZeroWolf]

Just been on the YouTube video announcing these and I have to ask, where were the rumours saying that the Sanguinor was going to be primarch sized? Last few I heard from mister V was that he wasn't going to be that sized?

 

A lot of comments over there seem supportive of the new figures with biggest feedback being some variant of "No wingz?". Also a lot saying about third party bits, which is funny as GW still wins in that case.

[Toxichobbit]

 

That’s fair, I admit I may have been being a bit to strong in favour of going the other way with things.

 

The other thing is that with Marines, you can just not add some of the detail. Use a torso, legs, shoulder pad etc from another Marine kit to tone it down and make them less busy. Easy, as you're probably buying those other kits anyway. 

 

Though with Primaris this is harder in both directions. It's harder to reduce detail as GW are now making Marines almost mono-pose. You can't just swap out a torso anymore because it's connected to a pair of legs and twisted in such a weird way that it looks unnatural unless you do the pose the designer intended. And it's getting harder to add more detail in as all those old kits that had too much are retired and we're left with the meagre pickings of a single upgrade kit that's mostly shoulder pads. BT, BA & DA upgrade kits are a bit better, but still sad compared to the customisation that MkVII had. You now have to go to 3rd party bits sellers to fill in the gaps that GW has left, which is I thought the opposite of their aim after the Chapter House debacle.

[Inquisitor_Lensoven]

 

 

From my research into it because when I joined the hobby I didn't have a clue what any of the screaming matches were about, at the time the upscaling was planned there was a growing dissatisfaction with GW's lore approach of just saying "it's always been like this/it's always been there" whenever a model was updated or a new thing added.

So with the Primaris marines, the decision was made to make them a wholly new kind of Space Marine as to GW that is what the community wanted.

They believed the community were saying they were tired of models getting scale crept upwards and of things just getting retconned into the timeline, so GW took that opportunity to redesign the Space Marine while upscaling them to both complete their aim of bigger Marines and fulfil the supposed community wish for an explanation for why their marines were suddenly larger than the Marines they'd been collecting up to that point.

…but what you’re saying people complained about is exactly what they did…oh these are new primaris marines, but they’re not really new they’ve actually been here all along hiding in a basement on mars.

 

they didn’t use the lore to introduce something new in the universe, they introduced something thousands of years old in universe.

[Indy Techwisp]

 

…but what you’re saying people complained about is exactly what they did…oh these are new primaris marines, but they’re not really new they’ve actually been here all along hiding in a basement on mars.

 

they didn’t use the lore to introduce something new in the universe, they introduced something thousands of years old in universe.

 

I'm recalling this from memory, plus most of the information comes from disparate sources across the internet.
I stopped looking into it deeper after I came to the conclusion that the Primaris hatred was a childish waste of breath not worth the effort to research further.

[DemonGSides]

It's weird seeing the comparison to stormcast. It's like very telling when someone says that, because A) they really don't look like anything currently stormcast besides being gold, and B) I wish they did, because they'd be a lot cooler, as stormcast sculpts have been :cuss:ing awesome for a while. 

[Special Officer Doofy]

Never disappointing clicking on a blood angel thread that's 7 pages long in a few hours.

[darkhorse0607]

So after staring at these in contempt for a while I noticed something that furthers my disdain but probably was obvious to everyone else

 

It's literally just the same armor sculpt as the captain they showed last week

 

They aren't even in unique armor. It's the exact same minus the sculpting on the captain's leg and the belt buckle

 

Why is GW making hand-over-fist, but can't even put in the effort to give iconic units detail to set them apart and not make it look copy and paste

[Marshal Reinhard]

 

I for one like the loss of the ridicilous huge wings of the old SG models. Feels more like a thing when limited to sanguinor and astaroth. Also found it weird how the sg had them but not dante.

 

Need to see the models on a big screen before i can judge further

Now that I've seen them up close... they're rather dull. I think a major issue with them is they're going for a sort of "half artificer look"... Like I really dig the idea that, finally the SG don't look more ornate than the bloody chapter master... but they went too far in the other direction. They're being careful not step on the new captains toes either

 

Like, look at the thigh armor. The captain gets artificer thigh armor, while the SG may have fancy greaves, but then normal mk. X thighs.

 

 

You have sculpted abs, then normal standard belt buckles. Shaped gauntlets, completely normal elbow armor.

 

I feel this the problem with the models, rather than a lack of wings. It's what sepperates the captain, which I think is briliant, to the SG, which feel confused.

 

Still some neat bits here to use. I just have to have the head of the SG i posted, for instance.

[Indy Techwisp]

 

It's literally just the same armor sculpt as the captain they showed last week

 

You're the first one to mention this, so it's possible you're the first in the Forum to notice it.

 

See post below.

Edited August 12 by Indy Techwisp

[DemonGSides]

 

 

You're the first one to mention this, so it's possible you're the first in the Forum to notice it.

 

I posted about this on the third page.

[Indy Techwisp]

 

 

I posted about this on the third page.

 

My mistake, I missed that.

[sbarnby71]

Shame the axes have gone, although the spears are a nice touch. 

[darkhorse0607]

As someone pointed out above, they do have slightly different thighs, but still it's close enough to give me pause

 

 

[Bev'an]

 

sanguinor feels like he has double chin with that "helmet strap"

Has Turin Shroud vibes for sure 

[Toxichobbit]

 

Why is GW making hand-over-fist, but can't even put in the effort to give iconic units detail to set them apart and not make it look copy and paste

 

Because they don't need to. Since the advent of Primaris and a massive influx of new fans, Marine players (the collective, not individuals and certainly not every Marine player) will buy anything and everything Marine. There's a growing number of fans who are just like the Apple or Disney cultists. If it's Marine, it's good, regardless of it's actual quality or design merit. So why put resources into something that's guaranteed to sell like hotcakes no matter how bland it is? Better to put those resources into projects with more discerning fanbases, like refreshes of less popular 40k factions, AoS & Necromunda.

[apostle85]

 

 

The other thing is that with Marines, you can just not add some of the detail. Use a torso, legs, shoulder pad etc from another Marine kit to tone it down and make them less busy. Easy, as you're probably buying those other kits anyway. 

 

Though with Primaris this is harder in both directions. It's harder to reduce detail as GW are now making Marines almost mono-pose. You can't just swap out a torso anymore because it's connected to a pair of legs and twisted in such a weird way that it looks unnatural unless you do the pose the designer intended. And it's getting harder to add more detail in as all those old kits that had too much are retired and we're left with the meagre pickings of a single upgrade kit that's mostly shoulder pads. BT, BA & DA upgrade kits are a bit better, but still sad compared to the customisation that MkVII had. You now have to go to 3rd party bits sellers to fill in the gaps that GW has left, which is I thought the opposite of their aim after the Chapter House debacle.

I fully see what you’re saying here.  And I think it’s that mono pose tendency that has me leaning so far the other way.  You are 100% right when you say it’s definitely more difficult to go either way with the details now and I definitely see where people that want far more individualized models are coming from. 
Had the upgrade kit felt less phoned in I think it would have helped to quell some amount of the complaints.  

[Lord Marshal]

 

Just been on the YouTube video announcing these and I have to ask, where were the rumours saying that the Sanguinor was going to be primarch sized? Last few I heard from mister V was that he wasn't going to be that sized?

 

I think it was just one of those guesses based on 40k Blood Angels not having a Primarch they can bring back, so people theorised they'd roid up the Sanguinor to functionally be a 'Primarch-esq' centrepiece. Then I suppose the theorising got Chinese Whisperer'ed enough for some to take it as an actual rumour, rather than a discussion. 

[Remain_Indoors]

I’d rather they’d stayed as a five man squad, but I like them. And I do not miss the wings, they fall off if you look at them funny anyway.