NOVA Open Preview - August 28th/29th

[INKS]

It showed knights was after Eldar... chaos was some footnote... 

[darkhorse0607]

 

 

Which is more than we’ve gotten in many years (maybe ever). They didn’t show off any models, but they had been very forthright with this being focused on what’s coming, rather than models.

 

 

Does this extend to the other game systems? The Horus Heresy for example?

 

There are two bullets on the Heresy (and let us not forget our smaller friends the Legion Imperialis minis) for "still to come"

 

The Mechanicus "still deploying" could very well mean the pre-orders that go live tomorrow. There's no indication of anything beyond that. "Another faction in the shadows" literally tells people nothing other than there is something that could be anything from Talons, to Raven Guard (unlikely, poor RG folks), Demons, who knows

 

Other than that it literally just says "tanks" and "more" Legion Imperialis, whatever that means. And supposedly something every month. Whether that is one thing for both, one thing for either, it doesn't say. The only additional thing that the article says is "new plastic weapons options for existing walkers for Warhammer: The Horus Heresy." Which again, means not a lot

[ursvamp]

 

 

Please tell me where they outright say the first 2 release slots are at the start of the calendar year. Please tell me where they state the roadmap ceases in August next year. The only hints of a date is krieg "starting off the new year" it doesn't mention anything about any other timespans.

 

They have about 1-2 release slots for 40k per quarter year/3month period.

That isn’t stated in the video, it’s just how GW operates. Or at least how they have operated for the last 10+years that I’ve been in the hobby.

they clearly state that there are models coming and in what order. So we know what fills the first three release slots. Which then, usually/historically, means covering a period of about 4-5 months

 

 

The point still stands the release pace has slowed to a crawl and by all measure it looks like 1/3 of the game get a 12 months or less codex.

 

The frequency of codexes has indeed slowed, compared to the same period last year. But I’m not sure its slowed compared to last edition.

And I agree that it’s unfun game design/business choice to have several factions play the majority of the edition without their own ’dex. It’s the Bleeurrgh!

 

 

Does this extend to the other game systems? The Horus Heresy for example?

 

I am only talking about 40k. I don’t know anything about horus heresy (never played or engsged in it).

[ThePenitentOne]

Yeah, the way I see it is this: if the edition lasts 40 months instead of 36, then the four month release vacation isn't a big deal. But in a 3 year cycle, every month that you don't have your dex is a month where you aren't playing on a level field against those who do. If the last dex in 9th came out 6 months before the new edition and that was WITHOUT a four month hiatus, the faction to get their dex last is now looking at a mere two months with their dex before the rules change.

 

In Canada, that means that if you paid a dollar a day for dex, we'd be ten days into the new edition before it was paid for.

 

If GW wants to bump the release cycle to five years? Yeah, a break from the grind of new releases is fine. Since there's almost zero chance of that happening, this does mean that every faction without a dex already will have less time to enjoy the full suite of options available to them. On a side note, I WISH they'd go to a five year cycle. Even four would be nice.

[phandaal]

 

I believe that is more official glimpse-into-the-future information than we’ve had from GW in 14 years (when they stopped using their newsletter to announce what was being released six months ahead).

 

Opinions are subjective and all that, and everyone's stinks (except mine of course).

 

However, this is objectively incorrect. As others have noted, we have gotten many recent showcases of what to expect and when that cover a lot more ground than this in a lot more detail.

 

Nothing wrong with having a positive vibe from this reveal, but saying this is the most detail we have gotten in a reveal in 14 years is a wrong statement. 

[Lord Marshal]

 

Yeah, the way I see it is this: if the edition lasts 40 months instead of 36, then the four month release vacation isn't a big deal. But in a 3 year cycle, every month that you don't have your dex is a month where you aren't playing on a level field against those who do. If the last dex in 9th came out 6 months before the new edition and that was WITHOUT a four month hiatus, the faction to get their dex last is now looking at a mere two months with their dex before the rules change.

 

In Canada, that means that if you paid a dollar a day for dex, we'd be ten days into the new edition before it was paid for.

 

If GW wants to bump the release cycle to five years? Yeah, a break from the grind of new releases is fine. Since there's almost zero chance of that happening, this does mean that every faction without a dex already will have less time to enjoy the full suite of options available to them. On a side note, I WISH they'd go to a five year cycle. Even four would be nice.

 

This isn't a defence of the churn or anything, but unless something has gone horribly wrong with sales it seems unlikely 11th will be another 'reset' as 8th and 10th was - so getting a codex shortly prior to the new edition may not be quite so bad. Guard players certainly got our monies worth out of the 8th edition codex at least... (not so much 9th obviously)

 

Edited August 30 by Lord Marshal

[ursvamp]

 

However, this is objectively incorrect. As others have noted, we have gotten many recent showcases of what to expect and when that cover a lot more ground than this in a lot more detail.

 

Nothing wrong with having a positive vibe from this reveal, but saying this is the most detail we have gotten in a reveal in 14 years is a wrong statement. 
 

 

Is it?

can you give an example? I can’t remember the last time we knew what the next three model releases for 40k would be, stretching about 6months into the future.

[caladancid]

 

 

Is it?

can you give an example? I can’t remember the last time we knew what the next three model releases for 40k would be, stretching about 6months into the future.

I can’t tell if this is serious. Surely not. 

[ursvamp]

 

I can’t tell if this is serious. Surely not. 

Not sure how that is relevant.

Since that’s the expanded road map from back in february/march (when Sisters, GSC, and Redacted was announced).

The roadmap we got around this time last year only covered up to ”Spring 2024” (that is to say; the roughly the same period of time as we have now. But with less information, since we didn’t know which of those would get model releases and which would get Codex+Character releases. And we didn’t know anything beyond that (as we know about ”something chaos-related” now)).

Edited August 30 by ursvamp

[caladancid]

 

Not sure how that is relevant.

Since that’s the expanded road map from back in february/march (when Sisters, GSC, and Redacted was announced).

The roadmap we got around this time last year only covered up to ”Spring 2024” (that is to say; the roughly the same period of time as we have now. But with less information, since we didn’t know which of those would get model releases and which would get Codex+Character releases. And we didn’t know anything beyond that (as we know about ”something chaos-related” now)).

I do not think you are trying to respond in good faith. 

[Ahzek451]

 

 

Yeah, the way I see it is this: if the edition lasts 40 months instead of 36, then the four month release vacation isn't a big deal. But in a 3 year cycle, every month that you don't have your dex is a month where you aren't playing on a level field against those who do. If the last dex in 9th came out 6 months before the new edition and that was WITHOUT a four month hiatus, the faction to get their dex last is now looking at a mere two months with their dex before the rules change.

 

In Canada, that means that if you paid a dollar a day for dex, we'd be ten days into the new edition before it was paid for.

 

If GW wants to bump the release cycle to five years? Yeah, a break from the grind of new releases is fine. Since there's almost zero chance of that happening, this does mean that every faction without a dex already will have less time to enjoy the full suite of options available to them. On a side note, I WISH they'd go to a five year cycle. Even four would be nice.

This^^^ is where I am at with the hobby, if 40k got nothing for the rest of the year and 11th ed. didn't come out until 2027 at the earliest, then personally I wouldn't care as much with the gap, bit of a small bummer to have such a codex break gap but would make the longer edition cycle as an overall win(assuming that is what we got). I think more and more people are starting to get fed up with the same old model GW has been running with quick edition cycles and quickly invalidated rules at the end of an edition. Since I see no other evidence that GW plans to break this cycle, then seeing such a gap would give cause to anyone not brand new to the hobby to feel a certain kind of way. And this would be one part of the overall disappointment pie from this preview show, others have already covered many of the other dissatisfactions, thus making for an overall really indigestible mud of a pie for most people that watched that stream. 

It's not for no reason GW received the heavy reactions they got that goes above and beyond the normal and arguably minor collection of dissenting daily voices they receive. In short, it was an objectively bad show and the wisdom of the crowd was clearly present that day.  

IMHO those with differing thoughts, wave your flag high, its your right to do so. Reasonable challenges are not a bad thing. That being said there's always bound to a couple people that enjoy or are ok with burnt toast.  And it also stands to reason why folks might fire back because they feel they don't want GW to be incentivized for it to be ok to keep burning the toast. 

 

 

Edited August 30 by Ahzek451

[Noserenda]

 

I do not think you are trying to respond in good faith. 

Surprising given their account has only ever posted in this thread despite being around a while. So are they a sockpuppet trolling outside their main profile? A GW employee desperately trying to defend their screw up? Or a long term lurker suddenly inspired to post in defence of some strangers screw up? 

I know one of them feeeels implausible. Speaking of feels though, i dont think i have ever seen a preview be such a uniting force in fan contempt. Very 40k really :D 

[LemartestheLost]

 

Surprising given their account has only ever posted in this thread despite being around a while. So are they a sockpuppet trolling outside their main profile? A GW employee desperately trying to defend their screw up? Or a long term lurker suddenly inspired to post in defence of some strangers screw up? 

I know one of them feeeels implausible. Speaking of feels though, i dont think i have ever seen a preview be such a uniting force in fan contempt. Very 40k really :D 

 

After Coteaz, the Blood Angels, and now this, the 40k team must be reeling (not that any system got a "good" roadmap). Just an absolutely horrid 10 weeks. I hope the powers that be over at GW are taking notes.

[Dr. Clock]

 

Very 40k really :D

#New40k is dat u?

 

 

every faction without a dex already will have less time to enjoy the full suite of options available to them.

 

True - within a given edition, and in the case that the rules do not carry forward to 11th. I think a hopeful positive feature of a 3-year edition cycle will be that the game doesn't suffer the later '0.5' doldrums where they try and kludge new charge or combat rules, new unit types, Armour of Contempt, a second (nth) Marines 'dex, or other weirdo wholesale changes and still-paywalled 'special campaign lists' that just add crud and creep to things from year 2.5 on.

 

Essentially the model could/should just be to 'Make each 0.5 a new iterative edition on the last' so that people retain their last codex rules through the odd editions. As long as they don't index every edition, you still are only ever buying 1 book per army per 3 years. I'm okay with that calculus alot more than 'buy a codex and 1-3 other books where we hide the late-edition releases and new power rules for multiple armies'. Yes, sometimes you might pay twice in 2 consecutive fiscal years, but correspondingly you may sometimes get 4 years. Like, at least Pariah Nexus type campaign stuff doesn't have paywalled core content for Sisters and Crons and Inquisition...?

 

If the Indexes didn't exist, weren't still free, and weren't still accounted for and supported in all updates, I would have more concerns for the remaining index-havers. The indexes still feel MILES better at this point of the edition than I remember them feeling a year and a half into 8th, though. I have to say I'm personally pretty satisfied with the level of rules support/balancing World Eaters and Votann have received through 10th, while definitely appreciating how anyone who bought those books in 9th could taste some sour grapes. I will likely not buy late edition codexes again and return to piracy if there's an indication that they'll just be reindexed in '26... Maybe next year's roadmap will let us know lol.

 

Cheers,

 

The Good Doctor.

[ursvamp]

 

I do not think you are trying to respond in good faith. 

Ok? Why?

my argument is that last years roadmap covered the same period of time. But with less information.

 

Last year showed which codexes would be released up to, and including, spring. But told us nothing in regard to which would recieve larger model releases.

This year’s shows us the same thing, but also told us which of them would be accompanied by more than just a character. And also told us something about what to expect, concerning models, after what is shown.

 

the picture you linked is from a later stage, after Sister and GSC had been rvealed (about three months or so before they were released). So that image only covers about 3-5 months ahead. And still with no information about model releases, or what the last codex shown is.

 

so I genuinely find it hard to understand how it showed more information than we got from this reveal?

[SkimaskMohawk]

Theyve also done much more detailed 30k roadmaps in the past.

 

These are bad. Objectively so

[Lord Nord in Gravis Armour]

 

Ok? Why?

my argument is that last years roadmap covered the same period of time. But with less information.

 

Last year showed which codexes would be released up to, and including, spring. But told us nothing in regard to which would recieve larger model releases.

This year’s shows us the same thing, but also told us which of them would be accompanied by more than just a character. And also told us something about what to expect, concerning models, after what is shown.

 

... and this is at least part of why you're being accused of arguing in bad faith.

 

Last year's roadmap (the one you're comparing it to) was NOT promoted - along with roadmaps for every other game - as the big draw for Nova Open or any other preview show. It was rather treated as the barely-news that it was.

 

BIG contrast to this year where we were specifically hyped on the promise of seeing (presumably SUBSTANTIVE) roadmaps because Nova Open 2024 otherwise had nothing to offer outside of actual model reveals for two of their games.

 

Edited August 30 by Lord Nord in Gravis Armour

[Flaherty]

The roadmaps are being met with such hostility because they were so much less detailed than the prior year's version. Look at the HH roadmap which had four quarters of visibility and a breakdown on plastic vs. resin releases! You can have vague stuff in there like "Mystery army release" or miss on some things, like melee weapons, but it gives people something to be hyped about. It's just silly to provide an update that is 1/4 as detailed and expect people to be excited.

[phandaal]

 

 

... and this is at least part of why you're being accused of arguing in bad faith.

 

Last year's roadmap was NOT promoted - along with roadmaps for every other game - as the big draw for Nova Open or any other preview show. It was rather treated as the barely-news that it was.

 

BIG contrast to this year where we were specifically hyped on the promise of seeing (presumably SUBSTANTIVE) roadmaps because Nova Open 2024 otherwise had nothing to offer outside of actual model reveals for two of their games.

 

All that, plus what others have said, and the fact that he said this year's roadmap was the best, most detailed reveal in 14 YEARS. Come on, man. 

 

It is obvious that he came in with the intent only to push back on criticism, and will dodge any examples people give him.

 

On the other hand, it did get people talking, so cheers to you, Mr. "Posting for the first time on my decade-old account" Man.

[Ming the Merciless]

Personally I'm happy to get another year of use from of my Drukhari and World Eaters index cards...

 

Daring to be optimistic I think the slower release schedule may point to a longer edition lifespan.

[Mogger351]

 

Ok? Why?

my argument is that last years roadmap covered the same period of time. But with less information.

 

Last year showed which codexes would be released up to, and including, spring. But told us nothing in regard to which would recieve larger model releases.

This year’s shows us the same thing, but also told us which of them would be accompanied by more than just a character. And also told us something about what to expect, concerning models, after what is shown.

 

the picture you linked is from a later stage, after Sister and GSC had been rvealed (about three months or so before they were released). So that image only covers about 3-5 months ahead. And still with no information about model releases, or what the last codex shown is.

 

so I genuinely find it hard to understand how it showed more information than we got from this reveal?

The "un-updated" version if you will was posted 18th November 2023 (https://www.warhammer-community.com/2023/11/18/world-championships-preview-asmodai-demands-to-know-which-codexes-are-coming-next/). It tells us 10 books are coming out across a 3 quarter period.

 

They've updated the roadmap, as you note, with that level of granularity 3 times since the edition started including some amendments.

 

With any of those you know which armies are getting something in the next 9 months. I don't care how big the release is, you know at least the next 9 factions and loosely when they're coming.

 

The current one just says "nothing for 4 months, AM, then Eldar and I guess knights some time after and *something undefined* for chaos". So as a perspective customer/gamer of the system, the old one told me when to save up for, when to look for pertinent releases to my forces within a 3 month window.

 

The new one only tells me 3 factions have a release some time next year. That is objectively less information - to put this to practice with a valid example, November 2023 me could tell you that:

The necron and admech books are next and not far off. I know that Dark angels are next after that with a model preview (so we've actually surpassed the contemporary roadmap). I could tell you Orks were the 4th army in line and in the next 3 months Orks will be joined by Custodes, Tau and Chaos Marines. I could tell you in the following 3 months that GSC, sisters and a mystery book is coming.

 

I'd like you to tell me what's coming in the next 3 quarterly blocks covering the next 9 months using the current roadmap please. A break down for Autumn (Aug - Nov), Winter (Dec - Feb) and Spring (March - May). 

[Ahzek451]

It's not a lot of help, but I do seriously recall that although it was primarily a codex/army roadmap, they did also announce that every book would have at least one new model to come with it at minimum. 

[Xenith]

=][=  It's very clear that these new roadmaps are not the most detailed or far-reaching that Games Workshop have produced. Let's move on please =][=

Edited August 30 by Xenith

[DeadFingers]

 

Also, they said in the stream that the Chaos reveal isn't until the end of next year, not what is after the three announced codices.

In which part of the stream did they say that? I don't remember hearing anything along those lines, just "some really exciting stuff on the horizon after [Eldar] for the forces of Chaos".

Which yes, that still can mean basically anything from the whole Emperor's Children release, to the Codices for the other three Cult Legions, to the standalone releases of the Night Lords and/or the two CSM characters, to just the Chaos Knights Codex, but I don't remember hearing anything about having to wait until the end of next year for any reveal.

Edited August 30 by DeadFingers

[Joe]

For context, the last time they had a preview show attached to GenCon was 2021 - this year was supposed to be the first since then. There were some scheduling issues that prevented it, from what I've seen mentioned elsewhere.