EC Rumours

[Indy Techwisp]

@LSM

The thing is, EC haven't had many many years of being pigeon-holed into a Legion stereotype, which is why we're even able to have this discussion now.

T-Sons became "The Rubric Guys" at pretty much the same time we started getting proper Lore for the faction, so our model range essentially defined our lore (until the 30k team decided to throw us a bone in HH)

World Eaters have always been "The Berserker Guys", but as the lore for Chaos Marines has progressed the abilities of said Berserkers have regressed. No Flamers, no shooty guys, just Chainaxes a and the occasionally a Pistol that makes you explode.

Deathguard, being both almost fully defined from the word go and an edition launch faction, have actually had a nice wide take on their unit types. They are clearly still "Plague Marines", but the DG range has been allowed to experiment with what that actually means on a unit by unit basis.

 

All this is to say, the "pigeon-hole" that EC finds themselves in is that of a surprisingly... normal CSM faction.

The excessive hedonism and/or perfectionism proliferates the Legion, however for the most part the EC are described as being kinda just normal Legionnaires with a few clear "Noise Marines/Kakaphoni" scattered about, simply because up until this very moment "Normal Legionnaires" made up the majority of your expected EC army.

 

This is made even clearer with how other characters react to Cult Marines in the BL books. Characters encountering Thousand Sons, World Eaters or Deathguard use the Legion's name and the Cult Marine term interchangeably, since they're a ubiquitous part of the army, yet characters encountering Emperor's Children usually make a clear attempt to differentiate the Emperor's Children Marine with his Bolter and Chainsword from the Noise Marine liquefying people with concentrated Hardbass.

[techsoldaten]

Long time ago, I bought an Emperor's Children army. Looked to be circa 2nd edition. It consisted of:

 

- Chaos Lord with Doom Siren

- 30+ Noise Marines with Sonic Weapons

- Dreadnought with Sonic Blasters

- Several Rhinos

- Daemonettes

- Daemonettes on Seekers

- Goat-headed Keeper of Secrets with massive claws

 

The army was visually striking and the mix of troops and daemons seemed so appropriate to Slaanesh. Tons of short-to-mid range shooting with fast attack / melee infantry to tie up opponents. Never played against it, but thought it would be fun to run.

 

While I'm certain GW will do their best, there's lots to love in what's already come before. I hope they don't take it in too different a direction.

[Ahzek451]

Here to stir the pot: 

Worry not, the small release of about 5 units that the other god legions received will be about the same for EC. BUT....GW will attempt to make it seem bigger than it is by splitting up the daemon codex and adding each god daemons to each legion. 

[HeadlessCross]

2 hours ago, StrangerOrders said:

That all being said, one thing I am let down by with the rumour of us being a TS/WE as opposed to DG is the lack of an awesome siege engine. Which would have fit Noise Marines pretty well.

 

Sidenote: Isn't it funny how Noise Marines have never been great against vehicles in the game iirc despite the lore having literally melt tanks and even kill titans when enough are screaming in unison?

 

I would have loved a Doof Warrior style 'Noise Marine on an Amp Stage pulled by motorcycles' vehicle. Something to scream a tank to pieces (which we have lore for).

 

Granted alot of the cult marines lack fairly core extensions of their concept.

 

There is not a good reason for WE to not have Jump Units, nor for TS to not have a Heavy Weapon Unit. Those are obvious things for Berserkers or Rubrics. 

Remember, GW now mostly justifies a unit entry based on models. That's why World Eaters have no special Terminators (which is funny since there's basically nothing that would make Blightlords special if you just equipped all your Terminators with Power Weapons) and apparently you're only a Chaos Lord if you're riding a Juggernaut. 

[The Praetorian of Inwit]

If Fulgrim is just a plastic version more or less of the Forgeworld one that would be great. My concern is that they try to outdo that model and have gone over the top. Time will tell. 

[Ahzek451]

22 minutes ago, The Praetorian of Inwit said:

If Fulgrim is just a plastic version more or less of the Forgeworld one that would be great. My concern is that they try to outdo that model and have gone over the top. Time will tell. 

It will come with a serpentine paint brush to navigate all the twists and turns required to get at all the dressings and tail. 

[Nephaston]

24 minutes ago, HeadlessCross said:

Remember, GW now mostly justifies a unit entry based on models. That's why World Eaters have no special Terminators (which is funny since there's basically nothing that would make Blightlords special if you just equipped all your Terminators with Power Weapons) and apparently you're only a Chaos Lord if you're riding a Juggernaut. 

Not to mention that Typhus is/used to be a Lord of Contagion, Ahriman is/was an Exalted Sorcerer, But Khârn isn't even a Lord nor do World Eaters have a "Unique Character but as a generic Unit" character, unless Khârn is supposed to be a Master of Executions, which is a CSM leftover. At least with EC the rumour of a generic HQ I'm hopeful it is a "Lucius but generic" type unit, though I would also want them to have the same access that DG have like regular Lords and Sorcerers.

[Tokugawa]

EC is well known for swordsmanship. If EC would not receive an "expert duelist" type model and still use the default CSM master of execution model, it would look quite awkward.

[LSM]

The Emperor's Children even have the universe's greatest duellist, Lucius the Eternal!

 

Who begins duelling his opponents by releasing the cacophony of the Armour of Shrieking Souls, a sonic crescendo which ruptures eardrums and pulverises bones. Then (depending on the edition) he emits a piercing Warp Scream, tearing at the very fabric of reality to disorientate his opponent.

 

Stomping forward deftly on his hooves, the sentient daemon whip that's forever merged into his right arm cruelly lashes out, its barbed hooks and sinuous coils (depending on the edition) absorbing and amplifying nearby terror or ensnaring and tangling his opponent.

 

Laughing maniacally, tongue lolling so far out Gene Simmons is blushing, he hits the go button on his combat drug dispensers, flooding his body with all the galaxy's most heinous, deadly, and exotic stimulants, strength boosters, and analeptics.

 

If you are an exciting foe, he'll sadistically blitz you with a staggering number of savage attacks. If you're a gretchin, he'll get bored and sad and maybe deign to kill you I guess but seriously what's even the point...

 

If you manage to land a hit on him (depending on the edition) the pain will only fuel him to even more attacks, or cause his armour to (presumably) shriek so forcefully that it wounds those nearby. He might also pause the duel, giddy at the thought of someone able to actually hurt him, and enquire as to who you even are. 

 

If you actually manage to kill the masochist, he takes so much pleasure from his own agonising death that Slaanesh is like "get a load of this psycho!" and allows Lucius to worm his way into the victor through any (depending on edition) triumph/satisfaction/pleasure they have taken from the kill. Slowly, over the next few weeks or (depending on the edition) instantly, Lucius will take possession and his killer will end up just another soul trapped in his armour, whose torment and anguish will be harnessed and unleashed upon his foes.

 

Y'know. An expert duellist.

 

//

 

Let's have a look at those Fabius Bile trilogy Emperor's Children marines:

 

Edited 6 hours ago by LSM

[HeadlessCross]

1 hour ago, LSM said:

The Emperor's Children even have the universe's greatest duellist, Lucius the Eternal!

 

Who begins duelling his opponents by releasing the cacophony of the Armour of Shrieking Souls, a sonic crescendo which ruptures eardrums and pulverises bones. Then (depending on the edition) he emits a piercing Warp Scream, tearing at the very fabric of reality to disorientate his opponent.

 

Stomping forward deftly on his hooves, the sentient daemon whip that's forever merged into his right arm cruelly lashes out, its barbed hooks and sinuous coils (depending on the edition) absorbing and amplifying nearby terror or ensnaring and tangling his opponent.

 

Laughing maniacally, tongue lolling so far out Gene Simmons is blushing, he hits the go button on his combat drug dispensers, flooding his body with all the galaxy's most heinous, deadly, and exotic stimulants, strength boosters, and analeptics.

 

If you are an exciting foe, he'll sadistically blitz you with a staggering number of savage attacks. If you're a gretchin, he'll get bored and sad and maybe deign to kill you I guess but seriously what's even the point...

 

If you manage to land a hit on him (depending on the edition) the pain will only fuel him to even more attacks, or cause his armour to (presumably) shriek so forcefully that it wounds those nearby. He might also pause the duel, giddy at the thought of someone able to actually hurt him, and enquire as to who you even are. 

 

If you actually manage to kill the masochist, he takes so much pleasure from his own agonising death that Slaanesh is like "get a load of this psycho!" and allows Lucius to worm his way into the victor through any (depending on edition) triumph/satisfaction/pleasure they have taken from the kill. Slowly, over the next few weeks or (depending on the edition) instantly, Lucius will take possession and his killer will end up just another soul trapped in his armour, whose torment and anguish will be harnessed and unleashed upon his foes.

 

Y'know. An expert duellist.

 

//

 

Let's have a look at those Fabius Bile trilogy Emperor's Children marines:

 

I mean if I kept coming back from the dead after losing at a duel, I'd hope I get slightly better each time.

[HeadlessCross]

5 hours ago, Nephaston said:

Not to mention that Typhus is/used to be a Lord of Contagion, Ahriman is/was an Exalted Sorcerer, But Khârn isn't even a Lord nor do World Eaters have a "Unique Character but as a generic Unit" character, unless Khârn is supposed to be a Master of Executions, which is a CSM leftover. At least with EC the rumour of a generic HQ I'm hopeful it is a "Lucius but generic" type unit, though I would also want them to have the same access that DG have like regular Lords and Sorcerers.

But frankly, Death Guard's access to regular Lords/Sorcerers is odd in terms of rules design. There's really no design space for Wizard On Foot and Wizard On Foot But He's Sicker I Guess.

 

This is why it was a mistake to move the Cult Legions to their own codices. I'm still mad that Death Guard lost as many units as they did just to get an additional Terminator unit and two new Daemon engines. Yeah the Bloat Drone and Crawler are neat (and quite frankly all CSM armies should have a piece of artillery like that anyway), but the Blight Hauler is literally just a Helbrute with the Multi-Melta and ML but with a different bespoke rule. They're even almost the same exact size!

[Orion]

12 hours ago, LSM said:

 

 

(Personally, I adore the depiction of Noise Marines in the Fabius Bile books, I just wish they had been called something else. "Choirmasters" or something.)

 

"Legion Kakophoni"?

I think that's a neat name.

[Nephaston]

1 hour ago, HeadlessCross said:

This is why it was a mistake to move the Cult Legions to their own codices

I agree on the rules front, but in the model department it was an absolute win., even if they managed to miss some obvious ones like Red Butchers or Rubric Dreadnoughts.