Grotmas Calendar 2024 - New Detachments Edition

[AutumnEffect]

So what is left for Grotmas? Tau, World Eaters and Space Wolves?
Am I missing one or two?

[Indy Techwisp]

9 minutes ago, AutumnEffect said:

So what is left for Grotmas? Tau, World Eaters and Space Wolves?
Am I missing one or two?

Black Templars 

[AutumnEffect]

9 minutes ago, Indy Techwisp said:

Black Templars 

 

Gotcha, I couldn't remember if their rules were in the Space Marne codex or if they were getting a book this edition.

[Wormwoods]

Where was this character-but-not-exclusively-close-combat focused BA detachment when I ran that exact army for the entirety of a 1.5 year Crusade? This could have pulled me out of Firestorm, goddamn!

 

But yeah, seems cool, I like this one a lot.

[DemonGSides]

53 minutes ago, Xanthous said:

I'm not sure what this detachment is supposed to represent - the name and the reference to Gabriel (Seth, presumably?) in the article title made me think it was a Flesh Tearers/successor chapter detachment, but the rules are character focused.

 

LAG (Formerly Sons of Sanguinius) got theme shifted away from the "This is your birthright, sorry about it" that BA have always had as a theme and moved more towards a generalized "This is how the BA show up for war" theme.  This detatchment brings that theme of "You are the destined sons of a flawed father who's choices, though the probably the best in the moment, have left you with deep scars that will never heal" and makes it forefront with the prophetic visions, the ability to have a lil of that red thirst type benefit, while locking it in behind the idea that BA has always exemplified; nobility in the face of their own savagery.  Characters are the shining exemplars of nobility, so they get the buffs.

I like it.  Very thematic.

[Tastyfish]

1 hour ago, Indy Techwisp said:

 

Well firstly, there goes any hope that T'au were getting an Intergrated Auxiliaries Detachment or a Soup Detachment with Guard/LoV.

It'll be interesting to see what they do with this to make it not just Retaliation Cadre, but slower.

Presumably more of the Bork'an experimental weaponry vibe, with +6" range and Hammerhead, Stormsurge etc buffs perhaps?

Maybe even bringing back Longstrike/Apocalypse upgrade set Hammerhead commanders via a detachment rule and enhancement.

[Borbarad]

7 minutes ago, Tastyfish said:

Presumably more of the Bork'an experimental weaponry vibe, with +6" range and Hammerhead, Stormsurge etc buffs perhaps?

Maybe even bringing back Longstrike/Apocalypse upgrade set Hammerhead commanders via a detachment rule and enhancement.

Experimental weaponry sounds very cool; buffs to guns but a lot of ‘gets hot’ to compensate 

[Inquisitor_Lensoven]

39 minutes ago, DemonGSides said:

 

LAG (Formerly Sons of Sanguinius) got theme shifted away from the "This is your birthright, sorry about it" that BA have always had as a theme and moved more towards a generalized "This is how the BA show up for war" theme.  This detatchment brings that theme of "You are the destined sons of a flawed father who's choices, though the probably the best in the moment, have left you with deep scars that will never heal" and makes it forefront with the prophetic visions, the ability to have a lil of that red thirst type benefit, while locking it in behind the idea that BA has always exemplified; nobility in the face of their own savagery.  Characters are the shining exemplars of nobility, so they get the buffs.

I like it.  Very thematic.

I agree. 
it’s a fluffy detachment, but also seems fairly competitive.

[DemonGSides]

Yeah I think most tournament players will continue to take LAG cuz +2S/+1A is just so damn good, but there's at least legs and reasons to take this if you want to build around it and it isn't punishing you for doing so.

[chapter master 454]

pleasantly surprised by the tau teaser, hoping this is good enough to replace the now kneecapped and executed retaliation cadre due to the deep strike change.

Funny how tau got nerfed by getting no individual changes but yet one of their detachments is now effectively just dead because it lost a core gameplay component.

 

Hopefully the detachment makes riptides worth it along with stormsurges, I want my mecha to be mega!

[Mogger351]

I can only hope that the world eaters is so close to the end because they had to step back, radically rethink and rebalanced the army, due to remembering vindicators exist and adding them in.

 

I WANT TO PULP PEOPLE WITH BIG TANK SHELLS! 

[gaurdian31]

42 minutes ago, chapter master 454 said:

pleasantly surprised by the tau teaser, hoping this is good enough to replace the now kneecapped and executed retaliation cadre due to the deep strike change.

Funny how tau got nerfed by getting no individual changes but yet one of their detachments is now effectively just dead because it lost a core gameplay component.

 

Hopefully the detachment makes riptides worth it along with stormsurges, I want my mecha to be mega!

Deep strike changes keep getting mentioned and I am having trouble finding anything on the change so I am missing something. What is the change? (This is not directed specifically at @chapter master 454 , they just had the latest post about it).

[HeadlessCross]

9 hours ago, Mogger351 said:

Honestly this whole thing is depressing. It's like if an army gets a detachment and it's not a 55% WR+ meta silver bullet it's deemed a useless insult to people's intellect. There is a whole lot of mid ground for people to just play the game for fun, try things out, use stuff because they can. Not everything needs to rock the competitive world to have value.

It doesn't need to rock the competitive world but it needs to be usable. Zero competitive play would have no impact on how unplayable 1st Company and Anvil are. 

[INKS]

As long as tau isn’t all crisis suits then I’ll be happy 

[Mogger351]

8 minutes ago, HeadlessCross said:

It doesn't need to rock the competitive world but it needs to be usable. Zero competitive play would have no impact on how unplayable 1st Company and Anvil are. 

Think about the choice of language. You use "unplayable". This suggests it is not possible to play it, that it functionally does not work. This is objectively not the case.

 

What you mean to say is how "sub-optimal" it is, as that outlines your problem is with its worth, not its ability to function. Even then, sub optimal is correct because it is entirely possible to play and win with those detachments. Not every game is against a top tier optimised opponent/list, sometimes you get an easy game to do something different in, rather than win harder.

[Tastyfish]

1 hour ago, gaurdian31 said:

Deep strike changes keep getting mentioned and I am having trouble finding anything on the change so I am missing something. What is the change? (This is not directed specifically at @chapter master 454 , they just had the latest post about it).

 

It's at the start of the balance dataslate - it's easy to skim over as it's technically not a 'deep strike' update, but more an update to anything that lets you set up 3" away being changed to being 6" away

[HeadlessCross]

1 hour ago, Mogger351 said:

Think about the choice of language. You use "unplayable". This suggests it is not possible to play it, that it functionally does not work. This is objectively not the case.

 

What you mean to say is how "sub-optimal" it is, as that outlines your problem is with its worth, not its ability to function. Even then, sub optimal is correct because it is entirely possible to play and win with those detachments. Not every game is against a top tier optimised opponent/list, sometimes you get an easy game to do something different in, rather than win harder.

That doesn't work. 1st Company is technically able to be used in a game too if you take zero Veteran units to use the Strats on too, but you wouldn't call it "sub-optimal". You also wouldn't call it "sub-optimal" if someone was taking Angelic Host and ran zero Jump units.

 

Objectively you aren't doing a deep dive into some of these detachments when you talk like that. 

 

That's not even taking into account unplayable rules of certain detachments, where they don't function like GW thinks they do, or it ends up somehow benefitting the wrong units (case in point how the Grotmas detachment for Dark Angels functions better for Dreads than it does any Deathwing infantry).

[LSM]

2 hours ago, Mogger351 said:

I can only hope that the world eaters is so close to the end because they had to step back, radically rethink and rebalanced the army, due to remembering vindicators exist and adding them in.

 

I WANT TO PULP PEOPLE WITH BIG TANK SHELLS! 

 

Heh.

 

New World Eater Detachment: "Uhhh, add the Vindicator, Chaos Lord, Warpsmith, Chaos Biker, and Traitor Guardsmen unit entries to the World Eater Index..." 

[HeadlessCross]

9 minutes ago, LSM said:

 

Heh.

 

New World Eater Detachment: "Uhhh, add the Vindicator, Chaos Lord, Warpsmith, Chaos Biker, and Traitor Guardsmen unit entries to the World Eater Index..." 

Do World Eaters not even have Vindicators?

[DemonGSides]

1 hour ago, Mogger351 said:

Think about the choice of language. You use "unplayable". This suggests it is not possible to play it, that it functionally does not work. This is objectively not the case.

 

What you mean to say is how "sub-optimal" it is, as that outlines your problem is with its worth, not its ability to function. Even then, sub optimal is correct because it is entirely possible to play and win with those detachments. Not every game is against a top tier optimised opponent/list, sometimes you get an easy game to do something different in, rather than win harder.

 

Some people are interested in discussing the viability of things.  I wouldn't misconstrue that conversation as saying that things LITERALLY aren't playable, just that playing them set you up for failure.  Surely you've heard of slang, coloquialisms, and the like?  Unplayable is gaming slang and has been for a while. A video game running at 15 fps is technically 'playable', in that you for sure can suffer through that.  But most anyone who's into video gaming would tell you that anything sub 30 is unplayable; not that it physically can't be played, but that by doing so, you're going to have a bad time.

Just my two sense.  There are for sure some "unplayable" things (like certain rules that just don't work the way GW writes them), but overall those get addressed pretty routinely.

[LSM]

49 minutes ago, HeadlessCross said:

Do World Eaters not even have Vindicators?

 

They do not.

 

They are so stripped down it's crazy.

[HeadlessCross]

19 minutes ago, LSM said:

 

They do not.

 

They are so stripped down it's crazy.

I wasn't really sure since I know they're missing a LOT, but figured they weren't doing Vindicators or Forgefiends because Agron is a lot of points and they love to complain about how they don't have shooting (they do).

[Tastyfish]

34 minutes ago, LSM said:

 

They do not.

 

They are so stripped down it's crazy.

 

Vindicators would be in direct competition with their Doom Blasters.

World Eaters need to get the vast array of old epic tanks added back in to go alongside the frothing lunatics.

 

"The mortar shells, known as 'gravediggers', are horrific to look upon, and are made from the bones of those killed by the Doom Blaster, which scavenges the battlefield for them once the battle is over, to consume those bones and convert them into fresh ammunition."

 

Seems suitably metal for the Blood God.

Edited Friday at 08:21 PM by Tastyfish

[The Praetorian of Inwit]

GW have done a good job with these Detachments. Though it is sad they didn't do one for Imperial Fists. 

 

I'm interested in the Black Templars when they get to it. 

[phandaal]

30 minutes ago, Tastyfish said:

 

Vindicators would be in direct competition with their Doom Blasters.

World Eaters need to get the vast array of old epic tanks added back in to go alongside the frothing lunatics.

 

"The mortar shells, known as 'gravediggers', are horrific to look upon, and are made from the bones of those killed by the Doom Blaster, which scavenges the battlefield for them once the battle is over, to consume those bones and convert them into fresh ammunition."

 

Seems suitably metal for the Blood God.

 

I gave this a thumbs-up because there is no "metal" emoji. That is hardcore!