Opinions on new teased models and future codex

[Bouargh]

https://www.warhammer-community.com/en-gb/articles/gw3wcpc7/world-championships-preview-aeldari-phoenix-lords-step-from-the-webway/

 

Hi all, following yesterday's teaser what do you think about the info disclosed?

 

As far as I am concerned, the models are rather OK even if not that disruptives. The Spiders lord is the most thrilling, while interestingly it is for the Spiders themselves that I am the less enthusiastic.

 

It is globally a nice thing getting renewed models but they do not really break the table. All is in continuity with what existed before. Nothing too radical.

 

As for the codex, the info is still limited. It maintains Ynnari, which I was doubting about before. There is no annoucement of a corsair force, except if it goes in an non announced yet detachment or if they have a xmasgrot detachment...

 

Globally a nice and lkean release but I am not that transported. Looks like there is more creativity in AoS nowadays...

Edited November 23 by Bouargh

[Wormwoods]

Well, I didn't get the new jetbike autarch I wanted for my 2025 jetbike army, which is a pain. I may have to just convert one up. Same with the Vyper, was hoping against hope that we would have a model refresh for that old thing, make the pilots more modern-sized.

 

Otherwise, I quite like the updated aspects, the Eldar aesthetic was basically nailed from the get-go, and it's been about updating the model quality to match it for the last 40-odd years. Maybe the general shift away from Forgeworld will mean we eventually get some plastic versions of the big, dumb tanks and/or Shadow Spectres?

 

Stranger things have happened.

[Karhedron]

I loved all the new models. Just the right level of glow-up compared to their previous editions IMHO and the new Warp Spider PL looks amazing. I am really hoping they do a new army box with all these models, data cards and Ltd Ed Codex. I can feel my wallet trembling in fear already.

 

In terms of detachments, 8 is pretty generous and I think covers most the archetypes we wanted to see.

1. Battle Host: Generic all-rounder
2. Ynnari
3. Harlequins
4. Seer Council (Ulthwé)
5. Wraith Host (Iyanden)
6. Aspect Host (Biel Tan)
7. Wild Riders (Saim Hann)
8. Pathfinders (Alaitoc)

The obvious omission is Corsairs. 

[Indy Techwisp]

2 hours ago, Karhedron said:

In terms of detachments, 8 is pretty generous and I think covers most the archetypes we wanted to see.

1. Battle Host: Generic all-rounder
2. Ynnari
3. Harlequins
4. Seer Council (Ulthwé)
5. Wraith Host (Iyanden)
6. Aspect Host (Biel Tan)
7. Wild Riders (Saim Hann)
8. Pathfinders (Alaitoc)

The obvious omission is Corsairs. 

Since the Grotmas Calendar Detachments are stated to be designed to allow for thematic playstyles an army's Codex lacks, I'd say there's a Good Chance the Grotmas Detachment is a Corsairs focused one.

[Emperor Ming]

Unless there's some form of heavy restrictions

 

The seer council will let us eldar players have battle focus and the fate dice.....mwhahahaha

[The Yncarne]

The new models are nice. I was hoping for a bit more of a design update, but seeing scorps and banshees, I knew it was unlikely. At least this round doesn't have any oddball things like the bucktooth bunnies, or the exarch being much larger than the troops.

 

I'd still love to see new vehicles. Also new Avengers as the current ones are no longer the right scale with the newer models.

 

I wonder about Corsairs. IIRC GW said they'd support kill team releases for two years. What happens to those units in 40k? Reboxes and another price increase? 

 

I'm sure these all will end up under my brush and in the closet.

[Dr. Clock]

I'm absolutely here for it. I'll be in off the hop for some new dragons, spiders and Lhykis. At that point I'll have a full-on Aspect Host if I want it, though it'll still be half metal lol. Will also be adding new Scorps and Reapers in advance, though - I passed on them to now but this has got my head swimming in the potential of having a... second, newer, shinier Ulthwé army at... a consistent scale.

 

Hawks are cool enough, but I'll probably double up on spiders and/or dragons before going that route. Also Fuegan will only be a matter of time.

 

Hopefully Ynnari detachment does Corsairs well enough (assuming that even if the xmas detachment is Corsairs it won't include Drukhari, who for my purposes are also basically Corsairs). I took Yriel the other day and he did decent work! Just generally excited for detachment variety though, and glad to see battle focus returning, even if in-game it could end being a bit of a faff if it's just move-shoot-move again.

 

Fate dice does seem more like a Seer Council thing tbh. Curious to see if the re-rolls show up somewhere in a detachment as well, because I think that's lowkey just as good if not better than fate dice (where they've landed at 6) in the first place. I really just hope that warlocks make a comeback even if only in that detachment so I can eventually do 'no aspect Ulthwé' whenever I get around to adding war walkers and maybe a unit of WGuard? Sounds like a 2026 project ; )

 

As the original faction through which I was introduced to 40k in the 90s, this feels like the true culmination of the 'plastic regeneration', and that's definitely on account of the Spiders simply never being updated since release, and that fact that it's 3 aspects AND their Lords coming out at the same time, and putting a solid pin in the 'all aspects in plastic' situation.  

 

I do expect Karandras will be the 'long tail' of the update in a year or two... At least conceivably with a reworked serpent/falcon dual build (?) and/or vyper?

 

Cheers,

 

The Good Doctor.

[CancelledApocalypse]

Can only comment re the sculpts as I barely play these days, but I love them. I've never wanted huge differences in the designs of the aspect warriors as they were nailed pretty much from the outset. 3rd edition aspects were a big mistake imo, barring the tolerable fire dragons and the nice swooping hawks. I've had a slight quibble with the helmets generally being just a bit too tall for my liking, making them impractical looking, which hasn't been fixed this time round, but thankfully they're no worse than the last lot, so it's a minor complaint.

 

Lhykis looks fantastic, and took me by surprise. Baharroth is great, if a touch underwhelming in terms of the creativity of the pose. Fuegan looks awesome and the understated pose actually heightens the model in his case, I'm a little undecided on Asurman's 'face', though it's an improvement on the original, imo, and the rest of the model looks pretty much perfect. Karandras also looks fantastic, soooo stealthy, I almost didn't spot him.

 

Overall, I'm extremely happy with this bumper release and the quality of the models. My wallet next year is going to hate me.

[Indy Techwisp]

25 minutes ago, Dr. Clock said:

I do expect Karandras will be the 'long tail' of the update in a year or two... At least conceivably with a reworked serpent/falcon dual build (?) and/or vyper?

 

Cheers,

 

The Good Doctor.

I'm predicting that Karandras will be the "Farsight in Arks of Omen" Token Xenos Rep for the event which brings back Leman Russ at the end of the edition.

[Bouargh]

56 minutes ago, Dr. Clock said:

I do expect Karandras will be the 'long tail' of the update in a year or two... At least conceivably with a reworked serpent/falcon dual build (?) and/or vyper?

 

Beside Karandras missing as a redone Phoenix Lord, Shining spears are still orphans too. And if Karandras steps once again from the shadows, might we expect one day a genuine Arhra?... Wish listing me...

[Iron Lord]

It looks to me from the wording

 

"Each squad of Fire Dragons has new helmetless options in case you want to run them as part of a thematic Ynnari army, plus a dragon’s breath flamer if you fancy torching infantry in the gaps between blowing vehicles to pieces. The Exarch competes with Fuegan himself in the firepike size contest, or can instead be equipped with a much more restrained fire axe and fusion pistol."

 

(and the difference in details of the model's armour compared to that of the Exarch - though it does look a little fancier than a regular Fire Dragon) that the "dragon's breath flamer guy" might now be one of the squad, rather than it being an Exarch weapon option. Could just be poor wording though - aside from the lack of straps on his chest leading to the central spirit stone, Flamer Guy does look awfully Exarch-ish.

 

Glad to see the spinneret rifle return as a Warp Spider option - hasn't had stats in a while, and has never had a model option.

 

Swooping Hawks used to have access to something called a sunrifle (again, no model) - I'm guessing the scatter laser option is a replacement for that.

3 hours ago, Bouargh said:

 

Beside Karandras missing as a redone Phoenix Lord, Shining spears are still orphans too. And if Karandras steps once again from the shadows, might we expect one day a genuine Arhra?... Wish listing me...

Regarding Arhra, I got the impression from Drazhar's Phoenix Lord-like statline over the last few editions, that he was Arhra - just incognito. Has any fluff specifically contradicted this?

Edited November 23 by Iron Lord

[Indy Techwisp]

21 minutes ago, Iron Lord said:

It looks to me from the wording

 

"Each squad of Fire Dragons has new helmetless options in case you want to run them as part of a thematic Ynnari army, plus a dragon’s breath flamer if you fancy torching infantry in the gaps between blowing vehicles to pieces. The Exarch competes with Fuegan himself in the firepike size contest, or can instead be equipped with a much more restrained fire axe and fusion pistol."

 

(and the difference in details of the model's armour compared to that of the Exarch - though it does look a little fancier than a regular Fire Dragon) that the "dragon's breath flamer guy" might now be one of the squad, rather than it being an Exarch weapon option. Could just be poor wording though - aside from the lack of straps on his chest leading to the central spirit stone, Flamer Guy does look awfully Exarch-ish.

 

The fact that the Exarch is brought into the paragraph after the Flamer in a new sentence implies that the Flamer is a normal unit thing.

That said, if it is just a normal unit thing, is it a one-per-squad thing or can the entire unit of Fire Dragons be given Flamers?

[Iron Lord]

The implication from the wording is one flamer per squad.

 

Flamer Guy is on the same page as the two Exarch weapon options, and has two waist runes with fabric dangling, whereas all the others have one.

 

 

[Indy Techwisp]

13 minutes ago, Iron Lord said:

The implication from the wording is one flamer per squad.

 

Flamer Guy is on the same page as the two Exarch weapon options, and has two waist runes with fabric dangling, whereas all the others have one.

 

True, but he also doesn't have a Back Banner.

That may be the Exarch of a Second Box of Fire Dragons built to be a "normal" Fire Dragon for a 10 model unit.

 

Alternatively, the Exarch can choose to be your one Flamer in the squad.

 

Or both of the above are true!

[The Yncarne]

Can't unsee this mirror pose for the helmet.

 

[shabbadoo]

Nice models overall. the new Warp Spider Phoenix Lord may be the best of the bunch.

 

Notably absent is Kharandras....and a Shining Spears Phoenix Lord.

 

Two models to go, plus any of the Craftworld specific characters to be redone in plastic.

[Karhedron]

17 hours ago, The Yncarne said:

Can't unsee this mirror pose for the helmet.

 

Copying from the best! 

 

 

[Karhedron]

I like the Axe and Pistol option for the Fire Dragon Exarch. Quite often 4 shots from the Dragons is enough to destroy the target but often leaves the squad close to the enemy. Adding a bit of melee power to the squad makes charging them not quite such a no-brainer. Although adding Fuegen to the squad may be more effective.

[Magos Takatus]

You guys keep missing something... I've heard a few people saying that the only Phoenix Lords missing (presumably ignoring the Shadow Spectres) are Karandras and the on for the Shining Spears. You are missing one though:

 

Spoiler

 

[Iron Lord]

I got the impression that because the Shining Spear phoenix lord's weapon itself was not missing, being available as an artefact for generic characters, that the Lord had been utterly destroyed except for the weapon itself, which was retrieved and is now doing the rounds among various Craftworlds.

[Bouargh]

4 hours ago, Magos Takatus said:

You guys keep missing something... I've heard a few people saying that the only Phoenix Lords missing (presumably ignoring the Shadow Spectres) are Karandras and the on for the Shining Spears. You are missing one though:

 

  Reveal hidden contents

 

 

You are right, of course... The Crimson Hunter is an Aspect too...

 

3 hours ago, Iron Lord said:

I got the impression that because the Shining Spear phoenix lord's weapon itself was not missing, being available as an artefact for generic characters, that the Lord had been utterly destroyed except for the weapon itself, which was retrieved and is now doing the rounds among various Craftworlds.

 

I thought it was more of a self inflicted penitent exile, for the shame of his actions and their consequences... 

Edited November 25 by Bouargh

[TheMawr]

If there was one thing I had the power to retcon it was Crimson hunters being aspect warriors/path of the warrior. I'd make them path of the pilot instead, maybe even specifically those lost on the path of the pilot. If I had another retcon power I'd do similar to shining spears.. making riders/jetbikers a path and have shining spears be those lost on that path, partaking in jousting shows when not in battle, and going for a grail knights style presentation/studio paintjob where each sports more individualized looks and heraldry.

 

On 11/23/2024 at 8:41 AM, Karhedron said:

In terms of detachments, 8 is pretty generous and I think covers most the archetypes we wanted to see.

1. Battle Host: Generic all-rounder
2. Ynnari
3. Harlequins
4. Seer Council (Ulthwé)
5. Wraith Host (Iyanden)
6. Aspect Host (Biel Tan)
7. Wild Riders (Saim Hann)
8. Pathfinders (Alaitoc)

The obvious omission is Corsairs. 

 

If the rumors of more corsair stuff is true I can see corsairs being a codex detachment rather than Alaitoc ( altough rangers too are a common sight with corsairs, and such a detachment might represent that too.

 

imho Alaitoc was always a bit of a paradoxal craftworld (rules wise).. its described as very strict and military wich results in many more seeking the freedom and become outcasts than the average. Subsequently the rules focus on these outcasts, instead of Alaitocs strict and military nature. Not a complaint or evidence of anything, just something I always found funny. ( the same with there technically being no craftworld specific characters, as Illic, Eldrad and Yriel are all outcasts in one way or another, meaning, technically, yvraine/the visarch are as much biel tan characters as they are alaitoc/Ulthwé/iyanden characters.)

 

As I do belief the rumors to be true (though I see a possibility of only Yriel and the jumppack corsairs being corsairs, with the farseer and vyper just being updates to as they are now),  I expect they didnt mention that detachment to not spoil anything, and the grotmas detachment is Alaitoc themed instead.

[Wraithwing]

Latest Valrak video details contents of the new Combat Patrol and rumours of a forthcoming Corsairs release fleshing out the subfaction proper. 

 

If Valrak says it, it is pretty much guaranteed. 

[Karhedron]

1 minute ago, Wraithwing said:

If Valrak says it, it is pretty much guaranteed. 

 

I think @Chapter Master Valrak would be the first to dispute that assertion. However there is no doubt that he does seem to have his finger on the pulse.

 

The Combat patrol sounds less interesting to me. I have lots of Wraithguard and Dire Avengers already, it sounds like it will be mostly old models with only the Warp Spiders actually being new. Hopefully there will be a shiny new army box with all the new Aspects as well as codex and data cards for me to splash out on.

[TheMawr]

20 minutes ago, Wraithwing said:

Latest Valrak video details contents of the new Combat Patrol and rumours of a forthcoming Corsairs release fleshing out the subfaction proper. 

 

If Valrak says it, it is pretty much guaranteed. 

 

Looking at the video right now, as I often say, the more specific details are often the most reliable ones.. and now that the vyper got further described, as well as having a corsair-specific build, I do think this addition is still coming. it really sounds like the contents of one of those army boxes they do nowadays with every codex :

 

Yriel, corsair seer, jump pack corsairs and vyper. with or without a unit of the existing corsair kit*. There are many imaginable reasons why this wasnt showed with the Phoenix lords and aspect warriors, beyond the already very understandable one of just spreading out the hype. But I do think its part of the codex release wave ( unless they do something weird like make it their own codex.) I think the corsair specific built might be a venom like transport. Even with those the eldar releasewave would still be smaller than the biggest few, nonstarterset, 9th and 8th edition 40k release waves and AoS releasewaves. So its not too wild either, its just that so far 10th has had relatively small release waves.

 

From the same video he talks about exodites kill team again, though he himself admits its from a "darker place" and needs more salt, but there are reasons why he puts his neck on the line with it, and I think it could be that he heard another eldar kill team is coming from other more trusted sources and rightfully or wrongfully adds 1+1.

However I still find it hard to believe, not because I cant believe exodites returning.. more that foot exodites have never been a GW/Jes goodwin thing.. BL does it, and the fans headcanon it.. but neither of these are the ones making the miniatures. I think its more likely a case of mistaken identity again.

 

Harlequin "mimes" > Another corsair unit > New wyches/bloodbrides > Ynnari KT ( mostly if upgrade sprue kill teams where still a thing.) > Drukhari Grotesques and/or wracks > New alternate rangers unit > new Dire Avengers > Sslyth mercenaries as an unit > Archons court/Beastmaster/Beasts > new kabalites/trueborn > Croneworld or chaos eldar > Exodites   would be my ranking guess of likely eldar kill teams, however, good chance Im proven wrong once again

 

 

* If the seer has a jump pack, wich would make it fill another niche, I could see them leaving out the current kit and Yriel is just awkwardly there by foot, alone, wich I think has been done before.