LAG w/ new OoM

[Inquisitor_Lensoven]

Obviously we can’t take our special units, but still it allows us to have units absolutely punching up on the charge, and non-of the strats or enhancements are locked to any of our unique units.

 

i have a game set up for Saturday and I’m planning to give it a shot.

[Rhavien]

Please report how the game was, but I'm not convinced that the +1 to wound on the OoM target is more valuable than access to our BA units. Sure, against something like Knights or "oops, all big boys" - lists it will be very effective. 

[Karhedron]

+1 to Wound is strong but limiting it to just the OOM target stops it becoming overpowered I think. Vanguard Veterans look interesting as they are S5 Natively so S7 on the charge in LAG. With +1 to Wound they will be wounding even T12/13 targets on a 4+. Knights suffer death by a thousand paper cuts! 

[Inquisitor_Lensoven]

4 hours ago, Rhavien said:

Please report how the game was, but I'm not convinced that the +1 to wound on the OoM target is more valuable than access to our BA units. Sure, against something like Knights or "oops, all big boys" - lists it will be very effective. 

All of our unique units I’ve used since the codex dropped, have been very underwhelming.

[Karhedron]

8 minutes ago, Inquisitor_Lensoven said:

All of our unique units I’ve used since the codex dropped, have been very underwhelming.

 

My personal experience has been different. Dante and 6 SanGuard carved through Vahl and her Warsuit Bodyguard very effectively last time I ran them and they are a staple of the meta. YMMV of course.

[Inquisitor_Lensoven]

6 minutes ago, Karhedron said:

 

My personal experience has been different. Dante and 6 SanGuard carved through Vahl and her Warsuit Bodyguard very effectively last time I ran them and they are a staple of the meta. YMMV of course.

I don’t have any of our epic heroes, which I hear shine pretty hard, so that might be part of it.

 

[Rhavien]

Also death company shows up in many lists. But yes, mostly together with Lemartes and astorath. My ten DCs plus Lemartes dished out tremendous amounts of damage. 

As we can also easily pop lance in LAG I don't value the new OoM that much. 

Of course OoM also works for shooting, but it's only one target per round.

Wish you good luck with your game @Inquisitor_Lensoven

[Inquisitor_Lensoven]

7 minutes ago, Rhavien said:

Also death company shows up in many lists. But yes, mostly together with Lemartes and astorath. My ten DCs plus Lemartes dished out tremendous amounts of damage. 

As we can also easily pop lance in LAG I don't value the new OoM that much. 

Of course OoM also works for shooting, but it's only one target per round.

Wish you good luck with your game @Inquisitor_Lensoven

Clear out one dangerous target early and it can really change the course of the game.

[DemonGSides]

3 hours ago, Rhavien said:

Also death company shows up in many lists. But yes, mostly together with Lemartes and astorath. My ten DCs plus Lemartes dished out tremendous amounts of damage. 

As we can also easily pop lance in LAG I don't value the new OoM that much. 

Of course OoM also works for shooting, but it's only one target per round.

Wish you good luck with your game @Inquisitor_Lensoven

 

Yeah the +1 to wound is defintiely a GOOD benefit to have, I just don't think it outclasses, say, the dev wounds from Astorath and his boys, Dante and his boys, or even Mephiston, let alone the ability to combo all of them.

They're probably overall similar, and hard to compare directly, but I play BA for a reason and part of it is loving those heroes and the Death Company.  Not having access to those just feels like "Here's space marines".  I can make a homebrew chapter to do that if I wanted to.

[Inquisitor_Lensoven]

1 hour ago, DemonGSides said:

 

Yeah the +1 to wound is defintiely a GOOD benefit to have, I just don't think it outclasses, say, the dev wounds from Astorath and his boys, Dante and his boys, or even Mephiston, let alone the ability to combo all of them.

They're probably overall similar, and hard to compare directly, but I play BA for a reason and part of it is loving those heroes and the Death Company.  Not having access to those just feels like "Here's space marines".  I can make a homebrew chapter to do that if I wanted to.

As I said I don’t have any of the epic heroes, so I don’t have that benefit anyway 

[Montoya]

You REALLY need to buy the BA characters, or otherwise you're not really reaping the benefits and synergies of playing a blood angels army in the first place.   Death company are good with a chaplain but better with Lemartes or Astorath.   Sanguinary guard absolutely slay, but I suppose without Dante they're not as powerful.  But even with a jump Captain I've found them great.   With the recent drop in points they will be even better.

 

 

[Brother Raul]

Not enough to leave the good stuff for me sorry.

[Ash]

Ive had very good results with Dante and Sanguinary Guard, Mephiston is very good, Astorath with Death Company and the on foot Smash Captain., Not to mention Blade Guard.  Vanilla marines needed something and good for them but there's no attraction to leave the LAG detachment.  Our Detachment works on everything we charge and devastating wounds re-rolling hits on DC is just better.

Edited December 13, 2024 by Ash

[Inquisitor_Lensoven]

LAG and new OOM is kinda OP.

 

 

Edited Wednesday at 08:08 AM by Jolemai

[Karhedron]

Running vanilla Marines with LAG and the boosted OOM is definitely a strong combo. JAIs are wounding anything T11 or less on a 4+ on the charge on the VanVets take that up to T13 or less. We also get the tasty enhancements and strats from LAG and there are other good units like BGVs to take advantage of the Red Thirst. Ultimately it is still balanced by the fact that OOM only affects one target per turn and once it is dead, the bonus evaporates. 

[Blindhamster]

honestly I expect and hope that it gets an errata shortly to disallow it. The intent was clearly for new OoM to be for non divergent chapters, and that should really have disallowed the detachments as well as the units.

Frankly speaking I'd like to see a change for divergents where they can't use core codex detachments and must use one of their own detachments to "unlock" their units.

[Inquisitor_Lensoven]

31 minutes ago, Blindhamster said:

honestly I expect and hope that it gets an errata shortly to disallow it. The intent was clearly for new OoM to be for non divergent chapters, and that should really have disallowed the detachments as well as the units.

Frankly speaking I'd like to see a change for divergents where they can't use core codex detachments and must use one of their own detachments to "unlock" their units.

I definitely disagree about the last part.

i don’t see a problem with using BA units in firestorm for example.

[DemonGSides]

Agree on the first paragraph. Second paragraph is just needlessly restrictive. It's not like any of the base detatchments are so good that we have to use them.  Most people playing BA are playing LAG anyways, so if someone wants to take a fun Baal Predator list based around Ironstorm, let em.

[Blindhamster]

but, if it was done that way, GW could balance the detachments instead of OoM.

i.e. everyone gets the same OoM

 

but each of the codex marine detachments gets a distinct flavourful buff based on its theme - intended to balance out vs divergent chapters units and detachment combos.

[DemonGSides]

53 minutes ago, Blindhamster said:

but, if it was done that way, GW could balance the detachments instead of OoM.

i.e. everyone gets the same OoM

 

but each of the codex marine detachments gets a distinct flavourful buff based on its theme - intended to balance out vs divergent chapters units and detachment combos.

 

This is just Chapter Rules With Extra Steps, and everyone has hated that for various reasons over the years.

 

Extra OoM is the balance against divergents. If you want the keep divergents and baseline separate, it makes more sense to ban the new OoM from the divergent detatchments than it makes sense to ban the divergents from the baseline codex.

[Inquisitor_Lensoven]

6 hours ago, Blindhamster said:

but, if it was done that way, GW could balance the detachments instead of OoM.

i.e. everyone gets the same OoM

 

but each of the codex marine detachments gets a distinct flavourful buff based on its theme - intended to balance out vs divergent chapters units and detachment combos.

New OoM had nothing to do with detachments. It’s about balancing the extra options in the divergent codexes that non-divergent chapters don’t have access to.

 

also worth noting the FAQ and what not dropped with no mention of limiting new OoM to codex detachments only.

Edited Wednesday at 09:03 PM by Inquisitor_Lensoven