Can anyone make sense of the new Krieg rules?

[DemonGSides]

16 minutes ago, Inquisitor_Lensoven said:

They wouldn’t do something redundant? Really? Just like they wouldn’t give a laspistol a 48” range right?

 

I just don't think you've done anything to resolve the second set of asterisks in a logical way.

 

You're wrong and so is the "AI". 

[Inquisitor_Lensoven]

5 hours ago, Crimson Longinus said:

 

No. It refers to total weapons. The lists already limit to two choices per one list, as it says so on top of each list. They would not add a note to say the same thing again.

 

And of course what ChatGTP "thinks" is meaningless. It is even more easily confused that us apes.

 

 

 

Yes.

 

 

Yeah, that's what the rules amount to, and how you wrote would be way clearer way to express it.

 

 

 

 

 Not once does it say anything about total options.

thats you just making something up completely.

[Inquisitor_Lensoven]

1 hour ago, DemonGSides said:

 

I just don't think you've done anything to resolve the second set of asterisks in a logical way.

 

You're wrong and so is the "AI". 

The ** is simply stating you can only take 2 from each list.

 

i have already stated that this resolving it.

you can have a flamer and grenade launcher, and plasma gun as well as a melta gun, but you cannot have a flamer, grenade launcher, long las, and a meltagun.

 

you can have a long las and a grenade launched with a vox and a plasma gun.

you cannot have a plasma gun, melta gun, vox, and a grenade launcher.

 

its not hard to understand, especially in the context of the current loadout, my reading makes more sense than a random pointless nerf.

[Inquisitor_Lensoven]

1 hour ago, Crimson Longinus said:

 

The latter is a simple typo or a copypaste error. (And I think was already fixed in a FAQ.) But it makes no sense that a rules writer would intentionally write a lengthy extra note to add to already complex entry that does nothing.

 

When you actually read the whole weapon section under the assumption that the writer was not insane, just inarticulate, and assume that everything actually has purpose, my interpretation is the logical conclusion. And I am quite confident that I am correct about this.

If they thought it was complex they may add an extra line because they believed it was clarifying.

 

theres literally no logical or reasonable explanation for why they’d have the options split into two categories if you’re not allowed to select 2 from each. If it was 2 total it would just be 1 list of options.

[DemonGSides]

12 minutes ago, Inquisitor_Lensoven said:

The ** is simply stating you can only take 2 from each list.

 

i have already stated that this resolving it.

you can have a flamer and grenade launcher, and plasma gun as well as a melta gun, but you cannot have a flamer, grenade launcher, long las, and a meltagun.

 

you can have a long las and a grenade launched with a vox and a plasma gun.

you cannot have a plasma gun, melta gun, vox, and a grenade launcher.

 

its not hard to understand, especially in the context of the current loadout, my reading makes more sense than a random pointless nerf.

 

This doesn't make any logical sense. You're just wrong.  It apparently is hard for you to understand considering in the context of the current loadout it doesn't make sense; they are losing access to a weapon, not increasing access.

 

I got it wrong initially too, but if you think about it even a slight amount, your interpretation doesn't make any sense. There's no way to get 4x of any one weapon so your interpretation is just patently wrong. 

[Crimson Longinus]

14 minutes ago, Inquisitor_Lensoven said:

If they thought it was complex they may add an extra line because they believed it was clarifying.

 

No. Repeating the same thing would not clarify, it would just confuse. It refers to the total options.

 

14 minutes ago, Inquisitor_Lensoven said:

theres literally no logical or reasonable explanation for why they’d have the options split into two categories if you’re not allowed to select 2 from each. If it was 2 total it would just be 1 list of options.

 

There is a logical reason. It prevents taking vox if you take only meltas and plasmas, which are generally considered to be the better weapons. It now gives a reason to pick weapons from the weaker list, as you get a vox too.

[Inquisitor_Lensoven]

13 minutes ago, DemonGSides said:

 

This doesn't make any logical sense. You're just wrong.  It apparently is hard for you to understand considering in the context of the current loadout it doesn't make sense; they are losing access to a weapon, not increasing access.

 

I got it wrong initially too, but if you think about it even a slight amount, your interpretation doesn't make any sense. There's no way to get 4x of any one weapon so your interpretation is just patently wrong. 

I never claimed you could get 4 of any one weapon.

[DemonGSides]

6 minutes ago, Inquisitor_Lensoven said:

I never claimed you could get 4 of any one weapon.

 

I know. But you also haven't logically cleared the **'s because you won't address it.

[Inquisitor_Lensoven]

23 minutes ago, Crimson Longinus said:

 

No. Repeating the same thing would not clarify, it would just confuse. It refers to the total options.

 

 

There is a logical reason. It prevents taking vox if you take only meltas and plasmas, which are generally considered to be the better weapons. It now gives a reason to pick weapons from the weaker list, as you get a vox too.

Under my interpretation you also have a reason to take the lesser weapons.

[DemonGSides]

13 minutes ago, Inquisitor_Lensoven said:

Under my interpretation you also have a reason to take the lesser weapons.

 

Not really. Under your interpretation you just take two plasma and two melta and then 2 grenade launchers and 2 long las per 20. But there's no way they intended for that to be the loadout, as that would give them double the special weapons of all the other battle line squads.

 

Your interpretation assumes that all the asterisks are independent but that's not how you read a datasheet, unfortunately. 

Edited January 30 by DemonGSides

[Inquisitor_Lensoven]

24 minutes ago, DemonGSides said:

 

Not really. Under your interpretation you just take two plasma and two melta and then 2 grenade launchers and 2 long las per 20. But there's no way they intended for that to be the loadout, as that would give them double the special weapons of all the other battle line squads.

 

Your interpretation assumes that all the asterisks are independent but that's not how you read a datasheet, unfortunately. 

That is not my interpretation.

my interpretation is 4 total per 10, no doubles, only 2 from each list. That necessitates taking 2 of the weaker options.

ive explained this ad nauseum, but apparently you haven’t actually read my posts at all, or you’re skimming and ignoring most of what I’ve said.

 

who cares if they get double the special weapons than their peers? Their peers have other reasons to take them.

Edited January 30 by Inquisitor_Lensoven

[Maritn]

14 hours ago, Inquisitor_Lensoven said:

Take this however you want, but ChatGPT reads it the same way i do.

Edit

nvm, even ChatGPT is confused and contradicting itself lol

edit #2

actually I do think ChatGPT js reading it my way, just worded poorly.

Never take what a LLM puts out as a fact. 
When asked how many hydrogen atoms there are in 1,2,4-trimethylbenzene, it responded with the correct formula (C9H12) and then "explained" why it contains 15 H atoms. 

[DemonGSides]

11 hours ago, Inquisitor_Lensoven said:

That is not my interpretation.

my interpretation is 4 total per 10, no doubles, only 2 from each list. That necessitates taking 2 of the weaker options.

ive explained this ad nauseum, but apparently you haven’t actually read my posts at all, or you’re skimming and ignoring most of what I’ve said.

 

who cares if they get double the special weapons than their peers? Their peers have other reasons to take them.

 

What you wrote is literally no different than what I wrote I just did it per 20.

 

I think we can all firmly move on from this and we'll all laugh about it when it gets FAQ'd. Easy enough.

Edited January 31 by DemonGSides

[Inquisitor_Lensoven]

20 hours ago, Maritn said:

Never take what a LLM puts out as a fact. 
When asked how many hydrogen atoms there are in 1,2,4-trimethylbenzene, it responded with the correct formula (C9H12) and then "explained" why it contains 15 H atoms. 

If you don’t train it sure. 
but it works just fine to assist in designing cancer treatments for a PhD candidate at an Ivy League school, so I’ll trust it with warhammer 

[Crimson Longinus]

5 hours ago, Inquisitor_Lensoven said:

If you don’t train it sure. 
but it works just fine to assist in designing cancer treatments for a PhD candidate at an Ivy League school, so I’ll trust it with warhammer 

 

Sure, mate...

 

[MechaMan]

Interesting to note that Krieg infantry are being released separately. I wonder if they'll remove sprue B (the one with the Kill Team upgrades) from the set along with the tokens? Maybe they'll swap it out for another A73 arm for the melta/plasma (one can dream).

[TheArtilleryman]

53 minutes ago, MechaMan said:

Interesting to note that Krieg infantry are being released separately. I wonder if they'll remove sprue B (the one with the Kill Team upgrades) from the set along with the tokens? Maybe they'll swap it out for another A73 arm for the melta/plasma (one can dream).

They ought to do a whole new kit that is just basic infantry with a handful of options, and release them in 20s a la Horus Heresy solar auxilia. I’d like to see this for Cadians, Catachans and Krieg.

[DemonGSides]

17 minutes ago, TheArtilleryman said:

They ought to do a whole new kit that is just basic infantry with a handful of options, and release them in 20s a la Horus Heresy solar auxilia. I’d like to see this for Cadians, Catachans and Krieg.

 

100%.  I'd be thrilled with cheaper battleline for these horde armies.

[MechaMan]

Would be a full circle moment to pick up boxes of 20 cadians with limited options again haha 

[The Pounder]

With regards to the cheaper set, will they still have medics?
 

Or are they on the “Kill Team” sprue?

[MechaMan]

54 minutes ago, The Pounder said:

With regards to the cheaper set, will they still have medics?
 

Or are they on the “Kill Team” sprue?

Yes so the current kill team has two medics. One on the B, or kill team, sprue the other on A (the main sprue). 

[MechaMan]

So with the codex coming out this weekend I guess they’ll be updating the app, then we’ll have complete certainty? 

[TheArtilleryman]

2 hours ago, MechaMan said:

So with the codex coming out this weekend I guess they’ll be updating the app, then we’ll have complete certainty? 

I would say so. 

[Emperor Ming]

2 hours ago, MechaMan said:

So with the codex coming out this weekend I guess they’ll be updating the app, then we’ll have complete certainty? 

Don't think its this weekend

 

Generally everything is two weeks, so two week preview, two week preorder window etc etc

 

So end of the month

 

 

[Sergeant Bastone]

You can only take 2 of the ** options, so plasma, melta, grenade launcher, flamer.  No duplicates allowed.

 

You can only take 2 things from the second list: plasma, melta, vox.

 

If you choose plasma and melta then that's legal; you took 2 things from the 2nd list and 2 total ** options with no duplicates.  But you can't have a vox because you already took 2 things from the 2nd list.

 

If you take grenade launcher and plasma then you CAN add a vox.  You've legally selected 2 ** options, and you are also allowed to select a 2nd thing from the 2nd list.