Creations of Bile(’s Apprentice) Kill Team - Now done and ready for paint!

[GuitaRasmus]

Edit: For a post with the whole team now complete, jump to this post: 

 

 

 

 

I love Chaos in 40k. And monsters. And body horror. I’ve loved it since I was a kid, and I’ve never really stopped being fascinated by monsters, and mutated horrors. So what better than to combine them into a Kill Team? Enter Creations of Bile - grotesque experimental Chaos Space Marines. I really like Fabius Bile as a character, and I’ve read the trilogy several times. However, he seems a bit too large of a character to use for small skirmishes, so I decided to use one of his apprentices instead.

Most of the models are works in progress, and any and all comments, critique or ideas are much appreciated. :)

The Kill Team (Nemesis Claw) will consist of:

Visionary - Bile’s apprentice - still very much a WIP, he seems a bit boring to me, although I like the turning around pose I managed to get

Skinthief - a former Berzerker, changed beyond recognition with insane amounts of muscle and bone growth stimms

 

Screecher - a Chaos Space Marine, laced with genespliced xenos DNA, allowing him to change his body on a molecular level (basically, I love The Thing 2011, and wanted a marine in that vein)

 

Ventrilokar - “forced growth psyker” - a chaos space marine, showing faint glimmers of psychic potential, getting them massively improved by lots of stimms and chemicals, causing brain enlargement.

 

Heavy gunner - again, boring compared to the rest - any ideas?

Melta Gunner - no ideas yet, input appreciated.

Hope you enjoy them. :)

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited January 27 by GuitaRasmus

[Dr_Ruminahui]

Those guys are gloriously hideous - I love them!  I also think your change of directional focus on the bile model drastically improves the sculpt.  Indeed, I love your use of model focus in all the models above - the missile launcher guy, the axe monster and the "running and reaching out guy" are all very natural looking in their attention and focus and much more interesting than if their focus had a forward facing - that's a really tough ballance to make (natural motion and change of focus) but you've pulled it off expertly.

 

That said, I think the reaching guy is more effective from a front on view - the contrast in motion and focus is less effective (IMHO) when viewed from the point of focus.

Edited January 17 by Dr_Ruminahui

[Heraclite]

I really like your Ventrilokar, he kinda gives some sort of Magneto vibe, hovering just above the ground and using his powers

[Brother Desultor]

These are some very inspired (hideously so) conversions. Excellent work.

[Teetengee]

I'm a big fan of incorporated weapons, so the last guy might have the melta equipment fused with the body in some way?

[Firedrake Cordova]

I think they look great

 

I really like the way you posed your "not Bile"  The almost-spawn are quite hideous, too

[PeteySödes]

Hell yes! Love seeing stuff like this, do you have a direction on how you plan to paint them? Really really good stuff brother!

[GuitaRasmus]

18 hours ago, Dr_Ruminahui said:

Those guys are gloriously hideous - I love them!  I also think your change of directional focus on the bile model drastically improves the sculpt.  Indeed, I love your use of model focus in all the models above - the missile launcher guy, the axe monster and the "running and reaching out guy" are all very natural looking in their attention and focus and much more interesting than if their focus had a forward facing - that's a really tough ballance to make (natural motion and change of focus) but you've pulled it off expertly.

 

That said, I think the reaching guy is more effective from a front on view - the contrast in motion and focus is less effective (IMHO) when viewed from the point of focus.

 

Thanks a lot - I'm really glad you picked up on the posing, since it's something I spend a lot of thought and time on - IMO, it makes or breaks any miniature. A lot of GW model suffers from this, while being really cool and detailed (I'm looking at you, new Lucius!), the pose is awkward or just uninspiring (like Fabius - he looks like he's strolling happily through the park) I didn't do very much to Bile - I cut of the tabs on legs, so I could turn them a bit, and cut of the head (obviously) so I could replace it, but it's actually pretty small tweaks that give a dramatic change. 

Reg. the reaching guy - I know what you mean, but I honestly don't know what to do about it - the whole "the thing"-thing is really messy/hard to focus on, so I tried my best to give ham the right vibe, and comfort myself with him being a 3d object, so IRL he makes more sense. Thanks again! 

 

9 hours ago, Heraclite said:

I really like your Ventrilokar, he kinda gives some sort of Magneto vibe, hovering just above the ground and using his powers

Thanks man! I'm quite fond of the pose as well. :)
 

8 hours ago, Brother Desultor said:

These are some very inspired (hideously so) conversions. Excellent work.

Thanks a lot - much appreciated! :) 
 

8 hours ago, Teetengee said:

I'm a big fan of incorporated weapons, so the last guy might have the melta equipment fused with the body in some way?

 

I've already gone that route with my Iron Warriors, on an obliterator, so I'd rather do something different. Thanks for the input, though! :) 

 

7 hours ago, Firedrake Cordova said:

I think they look great

 

I really like the way you posed your "not Bile"  The almost-spawn are quite hideous, too

 

Thanks a lot! I'm liking him as well, it's amazing how much the model can change with a few small tweaks. (Legs and head)

 

4 hours ago, PeteySödes said:

Hell yes! Love seeing stuff like this, do you have a direction on how you plan to paint them? Really really good stuff brother!

 

Thanks, man! :) I'm not sure yet (veering towards Black Legion mercenaries, though), but I'd love some ideas or input? 

[Dr_Ruminahui]

50 minutes ago, GuitaRasmus said:

 

Thanks a lot - I'm really glad you picked up on the posing, since it's something I spend a lot of thought and time on - IMO, it makes or breaks any miniature. A lot of GW model suffers from this, while being really cool and detailed (I'm looking at you, new Lucius!), the pose is awkward or just uninspiring (like Fabius - he looks like he's strolling happily through the park) I didn't do very much to Bile - I cut of the tabs on legs, so I could turn them a bit, and cut of the head (obviously) so I could replace it, but it's actually pretty small tweaks that give a dramatic change. 

Reg. the reaching guy - I know what you mean, but I honestly don't know what to do about it - the whole "the thing"-thing is really messy/hard to focus on, so I tried my best to give ham the right vibe, and comfort myself with him being a 3d object, so IRL he makes more sense. Thanks again! 

 

I'm not surprised to hear you say that you put a lot of thought into posing, as the results are clearly reflected in the models.  The more I look at the models, the better they get - I really like how non-Bile's reposing puts the emphasis on the tools on his thigh, and how on the almost-spawn the breaks on the front armour of the legs mirror and look like the first steps to the full on armour failure you have on the torso.

 

As for the reaching guy - I'm not certain there's anything you need to do, he's a fine model in his own right.  It may just be a matter of a model having some angles being better than others, which isn't necessarily a flaw but just something to keep in mind when photographing him to show his best side.  That said, in closer look I think my (very small) issue isn't a model focus thing like I first thought, but rather the interaction between the model and his base.  From the photos, I hadn't clued into that he was supposed to be floating and instead he just came across as being very "prancey" with an odd gap between his foot and the angled terrain beneath him looking like he had just jumped off of it.  I think the reason I preferred the "from the front view" is it maximized the visual separation between the model an the base.  I think the model would be improved with one or more of the following to better show him floating rather than bouncing: flatter terrain beneath him, his foot angle not matching the angle/positioning of the rock and/or with more room between the two.  That said, I think he's a fantastic model as is - this is just an exploration of whether he could be a touch better.

 

I don't really have any suggestions for the melta gunner (or other models), other than to suggest a rightwards focus on it/them.  Of the models shown, 3 are looking left, 1 centre (the almost spawn) and only 1 right (the brute with the chainaxe).  I think from a group photo perspective, it would look best if you diversify the direction of focus of the group away from the left focus of the bulk of your current models.

Edited January 17 by Dr_Ruminahui

[GuitaRasmus]

12 hours ago, Dr_Ruminahui said:

 

I'm not surprised to hear you say that you put a lot of thought into posing, as the results are clearly reflected in the models.  The more I look at the models, the better they get - I really like how non-Bile's reposing puts the emphasis on the tools on his thigh, and how on the almost-spawn the breaks on the front armour of the legs mirror and look like the first steps to the full on armour failure you have on the torso.

 

As for the reaching guy - I'm not certain there's anything you need to do, he's a fine model in his own right.  It may just be a matter of a model having some angles being better than others, which isn't necessarily a flaw but just something to keep in mind when photographing him to show his best side.  That said, in closer look I think my (very small) issue isn't a model focus thing like I first thought, but rather the interaction between the model and his base.  From the photos, I hadn't clued into that he was supposed to be floating and instead he just came across as being very "prancey" with an odd gap between his foot and the angled terrain beneath him looking like he had just jumped off of it.  I think the reason I preferred the "from the front view" is it maximized the visual separation between the model an the base.  I think the model would be improved with one or more of the following to better show him floating rather than bouncing: flatter terrain beneath him, his foot angle not matching the angle/positioning of the rock and/or with more room between the two.  That said, I think he's a fantastic model as is - this is just an exploration of whether he could be a touch better.

 

I don't really have any suggestions for the melta gunner (or other models), other than to suggest a rightwards focus on it/them.  Of the models shown, 3 are looking left, 1 centre (the almost spawn) and only 1 right (the brute with the chainaxe).  I think from a group photo perspective, it would look best if you diversify the direction of focus of the group away from the left focus of the bulk of your current models.

Wow - thanks for the thorough and detailed feedback! It’s really cool that you’ve looked so closely and taken time to write this. You’ve read my mind about facing, another thing I ponder a lot, to have a proper distribution of left/right/front facing guys. I was messing around with a melta guy last night, this is where I’m at right now. As usual, any input is appreciated.

 

 

 

[Firedrake Cordova]

It's a neat pose.  I think for me, he might be slightly too rotated?

[GuitaRasmus]

I’ve messed around a bit more tonight, and decided on an empty hand for the melta gunner and the helm hand on the missile guy: 

 

 

 

 

I’ve also spent some time figuring out what weapons to give my surgeon - a chainsword seemed so boring, but the cane is way too iconic for Bile - so I decided to make a sort of surgeons claw, with vials filled with nasty stuff to pump into his victims. I’m leaning towards keeping the needler gun, as it’s cool and can counts as either a plasma or bolt pistol, depending on my mood. I’ve also exaggerated the pose a bit more, to make him look like he’s turning around to draw his gun. Still debating whether that works or not. 
 

 

 

 

 

Edited January 19 by GuitaRasmus

[Firedrake Cordova]

The "Edward Scissorhands" claw is a good choice.  My first reaction when reading that you were thinking about the weapons loadout was "needle pistol", so definitely keep that  

[Pearson73]

Holy smokes, these are some fantastic builds! The proto-spawn are phenomenal, and as you've been discussing the posing just ratchets these guys up another level.

 

Great choice swapping the hemet hand to the missile launcher chap. The multi-melta guy will work really well with the rest of thr group, just due to the fact that he's facing a different way! But I also like the 'flow' of the pose with the angle from the outstretched gun up to the shoulders matching that of the legs.

 

I think the claw with the vials and extra details is really cool, but it also looks a bit oversized to me... To be honest I've always found that the Warp Talons claws feel more appropriate on Terminators than power armour. Might be tricky to find the right parts, but something similar, but smaller would be perfect (in my view).

[ZeroWolf]

These are all fantastic looking. You've certainly got an eye for detailing and posing.

 

Bile's apprentice looks like he's just spied an unfortunate soul for his specimen collection.

[GuitaRasmus]

12 hours ago, Firedrake Cordova said:

The "Edward Scissorhands" claw is a good choice.  My first reaction when reading that you were thinking about the weapons loadout was "needle pistol", so definitely keep that  

 

Cool, I tend to agree. :) 
 

12 hours ago, Pearson73 said:

Holy smokes, these are some fantastic builds! The proto-spawn are phenomenal, and as you've been discussing the posing just ratchets these guys up another level.

 

Great choice swapping the hemet hand to the missile launcher chap. The multi-melta guy will work really well with the rest of thr group, just due to the fact that he's facing a different way! But I also like the 'flow' of the pose with the angle from the outstretched gun up to the shoulders matching that of the legs.

 

I think the claw with the vials and extra details is really cool, but it also looks a bit oversized to me... To be honest I've always found that the Warp Talons claws feel more appropriate on Terminators than power armour. Might be tricky to find the right parts, but something similar, but smaller would be perfect (in my view).

 

Thanks a lot! I think it was a good choice too, swapping the hands, but I still kind of think the melta guy needs something, a... Je ne sais quoi, to make him as cool as the rest. 

Regarding the claw, I see what you mean. I just don't know where I should find the bits. 

 

9 hours ago, ZeroWolf said:

These are all fantastic looking. You've certainly got an eye for detailing and posing.

 

Bile's apprentice looks like he's just spied an unfortunate soul for his specimen collection.

Thanks a lot, I DO put a lot of time into both of those. :) Yep, I was going for a "Now, there's an interesting specimen..." kinda look. 

[GuitaRasmus]

Okay... The melta gunner turned out cool, but he's more of a cool CSM miniature, than a bespoke Creations of Bile miniature... So I've been wracking my mind for the last couple of days, trying to come up with something more body-horrory (yes, that's a word now!). 

I decided to try and go in a completely different direction. Bile is known for his work on enhancing space marines, yes, but just as known for just making horrible Khimeric creatures - so I decided to try and meld a human and a horrible xenos creature together. 

 

 

 

 

(here with an alternative head, maybe a Dark Mechanicus Magos Biologis decided to experiment on himself)

 

 

I've also had to do some modifications to the psyker (floating dude); I wanted to try and de-genestealercultify the head a bit, and I wanted him to have a bigger brain. Long story short - I cut off the top of his head, put on the brain from the skaven stormfiends, and it looked... Kinda like giant 70's afro. Doh. 

... So I had to try and find another head. I think this Berzerker head is kinda cool, the tubes symbolize the gross stuff pumping into his brain, and the will get connected to the (new) vials on his backpack: 

 

 

 

As always, I'd love to hear any input or thoughts on these. :) 

Edited January 20 by GuitaRasmus

[ZeroWolf]

That melta guy is giving me flashbacks to games like Dead Space, brillant stuff.

 

The new head on the psyker is giving experiment vibes there, so I think it's working well

[Firedrake Cordova]

The meltagunner is totally disturbing

[Teetengee]

Love the melta, and I think the biologis is really nice, because from some angles the piping will look like just bionics and a rotation will have a horror reveal.

[Dr_Ruminahui]

I really like the new meltagunner - the previous one wasn't bad (though the torso was too small and plain), but the new one is so much better and much more evocative of your central idea  (and cooler) - I really like how he's kind a ranged version of almost-spawn, conceptually, yet the models look so different.  As for heads, while I like the  look of the various tubes on the mechanius head, the hood portion doesn't really make sense (as it would just fall off unless anchored to something, which it doesn't appear to be) so I prefer the gas mask head instead.

 

As for Bile, to me the motion in the first model made more sense and looked more natural.  Don't have a problem with the improved loadout, but I think you should try to replicate the original posing, so far as that is possible.

 

For the "helmet in hand" for the missile launcher guy, I don't think it really improves anything over the rocket (both, afterall, are in my mind just something to fill the hand).  That said, its not a downgrade either.  I do feel its kind of too bad to separate that helmet holding hand from the base of the model with the dead primaris on it - in conjunction with that base, it tells the story of the model ripping the helm off the corpse, where as divorced from it it becomes simply something to hold.

 

Finally, in terms of reaching guy, I prefer the first swelled head because it better communicated the idea he was a pscycher.  That said, if it isn't possible to go back to that head, the new one is fine.

Edited January 21 by Dr_Ruminahui

[GuitaRasmus]

Thanks a lot for the feedback, guys - I’ll respond to them each tomorrow. For now, an update on the meltagunner; it bothered me that he didn’t read as a marine, like the rest of the Kill Team hopefully does - and it dawned on me that the human part of the spawn is pretty much marine sized - so I took a leap of faith, cut of some of the human limbs, and replaced them with power armoured limbs. This way he reads as a marine, and the armour will give him a way to tie in with rest of the Kill Teams colour scheme. I’m liking this much more, but I would love your feedback. 
 

I’m still debating whether he should have the shoulder mounted melta, or get a power armour arm, with shoulder pad, and a one handed melta gun, but I REALLY should get to bed now…

 

 

 

 

 

[Teetengee]

I think it works, but it feels like something that is gonna make or break on tiny posing differences whether it feels cohesive/flows as a model. That makes it hard to make a final judgment while tacked, sadly.

[Heraclite]

I think the melta is fine as is on the shoulder, if you wereto give him a regular arm, it would lose some of the body horror theme you've got going on with your team

[apologist]

Absolutely masterful work already, and that you're still pushing the envelope on them is commendable – the additional effort is really paying off. 

I offer these suggestions purely as food for thought, as the models as-is looks great.

 

On Visionary, if you'd like to move further away from Bile's silhouette, I wonder if you'd consider using Dark Eldar haemonculus arm(s) to replace the rather brutal power claw? The narrow, skinny weapons would fit the rather insectoid frame well, and help emphasise the brutishness of the other members of the warband. It'd also allow you to add two or three of the skinny eldar forearms, offering a variety of surgical kit and distancing him further from the iconic rod of torment.

 

For the melta gunner, I think having a normal arm and a regular melta would look better, as it would reinforce the asymmetry. You could perhaps have an additional vestigial left arm helping to prop up/aim the thing.

 

Your comment about melding figures together for the gunner got me thinking the that was a cool overall theme for the warband. Skinthief, Screecher and the melta gunner show this already; but you could lean into it as Visionary's 'thing', by extending it to the others:

• For the missile launcher gunner, this could be a creepy pseudocherub spotter/loader, physically connected to the figure himself through an umbilical cord/ichor-artery.
• The Ventrilokar could riff on the idea of the puppet controlling the master, with a stunted conjoined twin whispering into the main body's head, like the Warhammer character Vilitch the Curseling. In this case, however, the twin could be a psyker – human or otherwise – that has been added to enhance the Ventrilokar's threat through psychic dominance. That would enable you to bring back the cool original head.

Looking forward to how the warband progresses.

 

 

Edited January 22 by apologist