Codex Salamanders?

[Evil Eye]

1 hour ago, Deus_Ex_Machina said:

True-scale vehicles would only work in Legions Imperialis. Otherwise you would need to accommodate their size and put severely less terrain on the board because you need to make sure that they can traverse the battlefield without obstructions.

And that's not even touching on how even military engineers struggle to get regular-sized soldiers and their gear to fit into a vehicle that's tough enough to survive rough terrain, enemy fire, IEDs etc and not be too big and heavy to operate on roads, bridges, soft ground etc. What chance does a miniature model company have of designing such a vehicle (even a facsimile of one) with crew that are 7+ foot tall and clad in extremely bulky powered armour?

 

Anyway, a new drop pod could be good as I understand the existing kit is a bit of a pig to build, provided it wasn't excessively redesigned and any changes were to facilitate actually useful features (like enabling it to be built to carry a Dreadnought without the occupant having to awkwardly side-step out past the fins) and not just "make it 3 times the size and cover it in stubbers and weird round bits". I'd still miss the old one as it's a pretty nice design.

[ZeroWolf]

Hopefully it is just a nice upscale (not drastic, just enough to make it look nice next to the new range) and betrer fitting rather than a complete redesign. 

[Deus_Ex_Machina]

36 minutes ago, Evil Eye said:

And that's not even touching on how even military engineers struggle to get regular-sized soldiers and their gear to fit into a vehicle that's tough enough to survive rough terrain, enemy fire, IEDs etc and not be too big and heavy to operate on roads, bridges, soft ground etc. What chance does a miniature model company have of designing such a vehicle (even a facsimile of one) with crew that are 7+ foot tall and clad in extremely bulky powered armour?

 

Anyway, a new drop pod could be good as I understand the existing kit is a bit of a pig to build, provided it wasn't excessively redesigned and any changes were to facilitate actually useful features (like enabling it to be built to carry a Dreadnought without the occupant having to awkwardly side-step out past the fins) and not just "make it 3 times the size and cover it in stubbers and weird round bits". I'd still miss the old one as it's a pretty nice design.

Or think outside the box:

Reduce transport capacity of "Metal Bawkses" to either three or five men in power armour. I can right now hear the anguished howls of Gee-Dubbs marketing creatures. 

[Evil Eye]

4 minutes ago, Deus_Ex_Machina said:

Or think outside the box:

Reduce transport capacity of "Metal Bawkses" to either three or five men in power armour. I can right now hear the anguished howls of Gee-Dubbs marketing creatures. 

Realistically that'd be fine (10 Marines in one METAL BAWKS is kinda overkill for a mechanized unit if we go by admittedly-variable depictions of Marine fighting capacity in fluff), obviously the issue comes to GW wanting to sell squads of 10 Marines- and, to be fair, players wanting to field squads of 10 Marines.

 

In a Primarisless world, if I were making Marines play more like how the fluff says I'd say a Rhino could transport 6 guys, same as the Razorback, which gains the turret in exchange for a price boost and losing fire points and rapid disembarkment (the Rhino could have a rule that it counts as open-topped but with none of the downsides to represent the roof hatch). Alternatively, a Rhino could transport 10 Marines but gains the downsides of open-topped as the hatch has to be opened to fit extra men. Which would also mean a new Rhino kit (if you really wanted one) wouldn't have to be much bigger than the old one if you wanted a slightly more convincing, if not true-scaled, size.

 

On the subject of drop pods, I wouldn't mind a new one drawing inspiration from the old Epic models (and by extension the extremely rare Armourcast model). Would be a nice callback and would make it fit in with Firstborn collections with very little modification, hopefully.

[DemonGSides]

If you want a firstborn drop pod... Those exist.

 

I hope a Primaris drop pod had a little something different about it. 

[Evil Eye]

39 minutes ago, DemonGSides said:

If you want a firstborn drop pod... Those exist.

 

Yes, for now. We all know that if they Primarize the drop pod, the classic one will go OOP.

[DemonGSides]

31 minutes ago, Evil Eye said:

Yes, for now. We all know that if they Primarize the drop pod, the classic one will go OOP.

 

Right but you just asked for a new one to match first born aesthetics but those quite literally already exist. So just go buy one. 

[Karhedron]

My issue with the Drop Pod is not the model, it is the rules. There are too many restrictions on what it can carry meaning that you either can't include the squads you really want to run in it or can't run them with the Character they need to function efficiently.

[Brother Tyler]

I'm moving this to the Adeptus Astartes forum since (a) this is far more speculation than rumor, and (b) we've extended far beyond the Salamanders.

[Tacitus]

On 1/26/2025 at 2:35 PM, Inquisitor_Lensoven said:

Idk.

they let chaos destroy cadia, and open the rift.

theres several prophesies about dark times, and fall of cadia, opening of the rift, loss of armeggedon, would all lead into that nicely.

GW lets a lot of things happen that never upset the status quo apple cart.  

 

The Primarchs have returned!  Nothing really changes.

The largest founding since the Heresy brings out millions of bigger better Space Marines!  Nothing really changes.

and on and on. 

[Evil Eye]

48 minutes ago, DemonGSides said:

 

Right but you just asked for a new one to match first born aesthetics but those quite literally already exist. So just go buy one. 

I think you're missing the point of what I'm trying to say; a new drop pod that could visually work with Primaris OR Firstborn (like the new Terminaotrs) would be good so we don't end up with a Dreadnought situation where plastic Castraferrum kits now go for obscene amounts of money, because there's still a demand for them that the Redemptor doesn't meet. The base design of the existing kit is fine; it could do with some modernization to be less hellish to build, and as mentioned have a build option to let Dreadnoughts be feasibly able to exit without demolishing the pod/initiating the Rites of Noclip, but it's not like it needs an excessive redesign. And as mentioned prior, if they DID want to get more creative, I'd be happy with one inspired by the old Epic spherical pod. What would suck is if they replace it with something that barely even resembles a drop pod and is so markedly different (both visually and ruleswise) that not only do people who prefer Firstborn now have to go second-hand for drop pods, but people who already own drop pods now have no choice but to replace their existing ones.

[DemonGSides]

12 minutes ago, Evil Eye said:

I think you're missing the point of what I'm trying to say; a new drop pod that could visually work with Primaris OR Firstborn (like the new Terminaotrs) would be good so we don't end up with a Dreadnought situation where plastic Castraferrum kits now go for obscene amounts of money, because there's still a demand for them that the Redemptor doesn't meet. The base design of the existing kit is fine; it could do with some modernization to be less hellish to build, and as mentioned have a build option to let Dreadnoughts be feasibly able to exit without demolishing the pod/initiating the Rites of Noclip, but it's not like it needs an excessive redesign. And as mentioned prior, if they DID want to get more creative, I'd be happy with one inspired by the old Epic spherical pod. What would suck is if they replace it with something that barely even resembles a drop pod and is so markedly different (both visually and ruleswise) that not only do people who prefer Firstborn now have to go second-hand for drop pods, but people who already own drop pods now have no choice but to replace their existing ones.

 

I don't really know of a situation where the latter is happening.  Seems like Internet fear mongering; no one really cares about what models you use as long as they're somewhat similar and on relatively correct bases. It's a vehicle so base size doesn't really matter. All the concerns I've ever heard about people not being okay with certain models had come from an online contingent and has never manifested in the multiple game stores I've played in over the past decade. 

 

I want it to have different rules because current rules suck.  I'm not sure what you've cooked up in your head about what it could look like, but you might want to give up on it looking like anything from LI or HH.  Pretty obvious GW wants the lines to at least be a little distinct. 

Edited Tuesday at 06:33 PM by DemonGSides

[Evil Eye]

1 hour ago, DemonGSides said:

 

I want it to have different rules because current rules suck. 

It's a drop pod. What the hell do you want it to do? Its job is to allow units that can't normally deep strike to do so. If the current rules are bad they can rewrite them without making it into a Primaris Thunderbum Deployificator.

[Mazer Rackham]

36 minutes ago, Evil Eye said:

Primaris Thunderbum Deployificator.

 

Off topic, but this is my new favourite thing.

[Tacitus]

1 hour ago, Evil Eye said:

It's a drop pod. What the hell do you want it to do?

I want it to be big enough to allow a Redemptor inside.

I want to be able to magnetize People seats (that fit Gravis), Dread Tie Downs, and Deathwind Gun Panels. 

[DemonGSides]

1 hour ago, Evil Eye said:

It's a drop pod. What the hell do you want it to do? Its job is to allow units that can't normally deep strike to do so. If the current rules are bad they can rewrite them without making it into a Primaris Thunderbum Deployificator.

 

Be useful and not a points sink.

 

I didn't say anything about the Primaris stuff, that's just your weird hang up. Might be time to get over it. 

[HeadlessCross]

1 hour ago, DemonGSides said:

 

Be useful and not a points sink.

 

I didn't say anything about the Primaris stuff, that's just your weird hang up. Might be time to get over it. 

They're a point sink because right now they're 70 points. You could EASILY cut that in half and people would think it's just a neat option. 

[Evil Eye]

1 hour ago, Tacitus said:

I want it to be big enough to allow a Redemptor inside.

I want to be able to magnetize People seats (that fit Gravis), Dread Tie Downs, and Deathwind Gun Panels. 

See, that's fair, and would be a good reason to make a new drop pod.

1 hour ago, DemonGSides said:

Be useful and not a points sink.

 

That doesn't necessitate a completely new model, though. That just requires a points drop.

1 hour ago, DemonGSides said:

I didn't say anything about the Primaris stuff, that's just your weird hang up. Might be time to get over it. 

Dude, all I was saying was "I hope the new drop pod looks good and doesn't try to reinvent the wheel". We know they CAN do this, as we saw with the new Terminators, and there are some good looking Primaris models that even I as someone that absolutely despises the Great Replacement of Marines can appreciate (Bladeguard and Inner Circle Companions spring to mind), but Primaris vehicles have not been good so far; we've had the "Marine-o Kart Double Dash for the Forge World Nyntendeaux Cuboid Entertainment Cogitator" Invader ATV, the "Dat mite akchully be too much dakka..." Repulsor, the "suspiciously healthy-piloted Dreadnought" Invictor Warsuit, and the obnoxious trend of putting stubbers on everything (including a nonsensical AA mount for a close combat Dreadnought). Sad to say, but new Marine releases/rumours have me automatically thinking "Oh cripes, what are they gonna mess up this time?".

 

As far as "getting over it", I'll stop complaining about GW replacing Marines with sillier-looking updates when GW stops replacing Marines with sillier-looking updates.

[HeadlessCross]

Well the Invictor isn't supposed to be a Dread so that's not a reasonable complaint. 

[Indy Techwisp]

Anything new on the Rumour front?

[ZeroWolf]

1 hour ago, Indy Techwisp said:

Anything new on the Rumour front?

Other than what's been discussed here (campaign book, new drop pod) nope, not yet.

[TheNicronomicon]

7 hours ago, Karhedron said:

My issue with the Drop Pod is not the model, it is the rules. There are too many restrictions on what it can carry meaning that you either can't include the squads you really want to run in it or can't run them with the Character they need to function efficiently.

THIS. I want to be able to run a lore-compliant Blackmanes army with Ragnar and a squad of Blood Claws boiling out of a drop pod…and it’s not possible at all. 11 Marines in a pod would be fine, keeping an Lt or Wolf Guard Pack Leader pit of the unit is a perfectly acceptable tradeoff, but keeping capacity stuck at 10 when the game WANTS you to run 11- or 12-man units means it’s just not going to see the table, especially at 70 points. 

[Tacitus]

There's is one reason I'd believe we're about to see a Codex: Salamanders specifically vs Supplement: Compliant or some such second SM Codex if anything.  Vulkan as the third in the "Triumvirate" Second Empire Style with Vulkan playing the role of Sanguinius.  Its easily arguable he was the most "human" of the Loyalists after Sanguinius - but I'm pretty sure we're all expecting Russ next. 

[ZeroWolf]

6 hours ago, Tacitus said:

There's is one reason I'd believe we're about to see a Codex: Salamanders specifically vs Supplement: Compliant or some such second SM Codex if anything.  Vulkan as the third in the "Triumvirate" Second Empire Style with Vulkan playing the role of Sanguinius.  Its easily arguable he was the most "human" of the Loyalists after Sanguinius - but I'm pretty sure we're all expecting Russ next. 

I was expecting Russ next but lack of rumours around him make me suspicious.

 

Also new rumours state it isn't s codex at all but some kind of campaign book, which would be odd as I thought GW was going to move away from that with the advent of 10th but we shall see.

 

End of the day, while I'd like Russ to go with the Space Wolf army I'm planning for year's end, my plastic primarch collection cares little for who is added to their ranks.

[jaxom]

If a Salamanders 'dex sets up 11th edition Vulkan, I could see that being a cause.

 

A campaign book accompanied by free pdf rules for any new characters could definitely be a thing, but I would find it odd if they included it in a codex roadmap.